Redding Body Die?

[M16]

I just picked up a 6mm AI. The gun came with two dies. A neck sizer and a bullet seat die. Will I need another die to push the shoulder back on occasion or an I good to go. Would the Redding Body Die work?

 

[DukeDuke]

you will need a body or fl die after 4-5 firings.

 

[Danattherock]

What kind of neck die do you have?

I got a Redding body die. Works good. I neck size first with Lee collett neck die. Reduced runout considerably compared to the Redding Deluxe three die set I had been using. Now doing a two step sizing process. Familiar to many here. Which is how I heard about it.

Read all the post in thread below by Boyd Allen and myself. Especially mine towards the end and the link that Patch posted with German Salazar articles. I link a particular article about two step sizing after Patch posted the link. Good stuff!! Not discounting what others might have said in that rather long thread, but I didn't read it all.

But I know what Boyd Allen said and how valuable it is. Recently proved it to myself with Lee neck collet die FIRST, then using Redding body die to minimally FL size. Get headspace gauges from Hornady if you don't already have them. 0.001-0.002 I hear for bolts, 0.003"-0.004" for autos, which was my application.

http://forum.accurateshooter.com/index.php?topic=3870020.0


Dan

 

[bigedp51]

I just picked up a 6mm AI. The gun came with two dies. A neck sizer and a bullet seat die. Will I need another die to push the shoulder back on occasion or an I good to go. Would the Redding Body Die work?

You do not need a Redding body die it full length resizes the case body but not the neck. You would be better off with a standard full length die, because the non-bushing full length die would be a better bet with better body support leaving you with a more concentric case. The link above discusses two step bushing die sizing to reduce neck runout by doing it in steps when using bushing dies because the bushings float.

Now read what Germán A. Salazar has to say about full length resizing below.

The Rifleman's Journal
Reloading: Partial Neck Sizing
http://riflemansjournal.blogspot.com/2010/06/reloading-partial-neck-sizing.html

"In conclusion, I believe that allowing the bullet to find a relatively stress-free alignment in the throat by full length sizing (including the neck) and turning necks to enhance concentricity gives the bullet the best probability of a well-aligned start into the rifling. Additionally, I place a high value on easy bolt operation and true full length sizing helps that quite a bit."

 

[dalej]

If your rifle has been "gunsmith chambered" your smith should supply you with short piece of barrel reamed shoulder deep. That is your chambers' shoulder datum cup to measure shoulder bump and headspace, when used with caliper. The headspace should be recorded each time cartridge is loaded (doing this will indicate the "headspace sweet spot" for easy feeding and peak accuracy with minimum shoulder setback required). If you pay attention to this measurement there will be no need for shoulder bump die. Regular annealing of neck and shoulder will keep cartridge sizing consistent. To say you need to FL size or NK size or bump shoulders back would be misleading. You need the headspace data to self determine the sizing required for peak performance. Wilson makes case gauges for most cartridges.

 

[bigedp51]

And Hornady makes a cartridge case headspace gauge that can measure a fired case and a resized case and it is far more accurate than a Wilson gauge.

Below a Colt Field gauge, 1.4736

Below my calibrated Hornady gauge measuring the Colt Field Gauge.

Below measuring the fired case before full length resizing.

And after full length resizing for my AR15 A2 HBAR and .003 shoulder bump.

And the full length resized cases for my .223 bolt action would only have .001 to .002 shoulder bump or setback.

 

[dalej]

And Hornady makes a cartridge case headspace gauge that can measure a fired case and a resized case and it is far more accurate than a Wilson gauge.

Wilson measures fired and resized cases. The accuracy is in the caliper. Wilson steel, Hornady aluminum.
It might work as good. Wilson was making case gauges before Hornady even knew what they were. They were part of Stoney Point's product line.

 

[Marksman63]

And what about the RCBS Precision Micrometer? May I rely on it for my headspace measurement before and after shooting?

 

[tenring]

I measure my shoulder bump with the Redding Instant Indicator. Works great for me.

 

['Freak]

No matter the die’s design or maker, once the die is setup in the press, if the die, the case, the shell holder, and the press ram cannot all overlay a single common centerline then, can’t make concentric ammo.

Need to maintain a thousandth or two of clearance between the bolt face and the base of the case whilst the case shoulder is firmly butted against the chamber’s shoulder. Any sort of contraption that’ll get you a case base to shoulder datum reference number from a piece of brass that fits like you want it to will work. Then it’s a matter of shoving more or less case body length up into the size die to have the die bump back the shoulder just enough to have your contraption return a number near enough the reference to suit ya.

Read this until you feel you understand everything they’re trying to say, and then decide on a new die.
http://www.whiddengunworks.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Bushing.NonBushingExplanation.pdf

 

[LHSmith]

If your rifle has been "gunsmith chambered" your smith should supply you with short piece of barrel reamed shoulder deep. That is your chambers' shoulder datum cup to measure shoulder bump and headspace, when used with caliper. The headspace should be recorded each time cartridge is loaded (doing this will indicate the "headspace sweet spot" for easy feeding and peak accuracy with minimum shoulder setback required). If you pay attention to this measurement there will be no need for shoulder bump die. Regular annealing of neck and shoulder will keep cartridge sizing consistent. To say you need to FL size or NK size or bump shoulders back would be misleading. You need the headspace data to self determine the sizing required for peak performance. Wilson makes case gauges for most cartridges.

If you intend to run loads in the mid to upper load window, it is not a question of IF you need to push shoulders back, but WHEN. Annealing might delay the need for a cycle or two, but some cases out of the batch will start getting hard to chamber causing all sorts of problems.

 

[dalej]

When the optimum cartridge headspace is maintained why would shoulders need to be bumped back, occasionally? Annealing once in awhile isn't the best way to control sizing, but annealing every time before FL sizing will keep shoulder/neck dimensions consistent. With my Bench Source annealer, doing 100 rnds adds less than 15 minutes to my "shop therapy". If I find a great upper accuracy node would it be a waste of time to touch up neck in an outside neck turning tool each firing?

When consistency, uniformity, and accuracy is most shooters' goal, why bump shoulders, anneal, and outside neck turn once in a while? Why not maintain the cartridge uniformity through out the life of the cartridge?