• This Forum is for adults 18 years of age or over. By continuing to use this Forum you are confirming that you are 18 or older. No content shall be viewed by any person under 18 in California.

Reaching the breaking point?

Status
Not open for further replies.
I hate being broke, so I rat hole money any chance I get and definitely have to plan out when and where to spend dollars for shooting, if I absolutely need something new i usually end up selling something I’m no longer using. A friend said several years ago that instead of buying new gear just learn how to use the gear you already have, so I always consider that and make damn sure it’s a need vs a want.
 
I stopped buying steak 2 years ago. I buy more powder, primers, reloading tools, guns, and ammo than ever though! Priorities!

IMHO it's just really painful because we have watched ammo and components go crazy. Guns have gone nuts too. My first tikka was 515 bucks. Now they are very cheapest 750.

However, shooting is still only a moderately expensive hobby. A toy hauler, diesel, and some toys is more than a lifetime of shooting for basically anyone. Priced a golf membership at the country club lately?How about restoring a classic car or building a rock crawler or baja truck?

One thing that has gone down is the price for an accurate rifle. CNC machining has made the cheapest of guns absolutely hammer with factory match ammo. Heck my new tikka varmint shoots as well as my tikka with a Bartlein barrel. I don't think I could beat it unless I spend WAY more like 5k+ with a bat or Borden etc. Wasn't long ago moa was an amazing gun. Moa is pathetic now. I expect a heavy barrel factory gun to shoot consistently .5 to max .75 moa.

Scopes have also got way cheaper. For 300-600 you have many options in FFP that track like 100% or 99.9% perfect. Just like 10 or 15 years ago that would cost 2k.
 
Last edited:
jackieschmidt said:
Some of the products we use at my Shop have gone up substantially in the past three years.

1022 steel roughed turned round bar in 7 1/2“ to 9 1/2” in 30 ft sections has gone from around $.82 a pound to over $1.40 a pound. Tooling such as large end mills, threading inserts, turning inserts etc have gone 40 percent. Stainless Steel Submerged Arc 309L and 316L around 50 percent.
Add in all of the cost of health insurance and just opening the doors in the morning.
None of this is going down, baring a complete economic collapse. .

The real teaser is, despite things seemingly headed south in everything, we just had our best year in the past seven years.
Click to expand...
How can you use facts and honesty to make a point. This will never be understood.
 
Last edited:
The one class of powders that remain relatively affordable are ball powders. We seem to have fallen for the temperature insensitive thing hook line and sinker. My experience with reloading goes back before the dawn of their availability, and if my memory serves, and it usually does, we managed quite well in spite of what would today be viewed as a severe handicap. Back then, there was no internet, and except for reloading manuals for guidance, if we wanted to find out what a powder would produce, generally we bought a pound and put it through its paces. We really had no choice. The upside of this for some of us is that we became very experienced in doing these sorts of evaluations, ON OUR OWN, without taking a survey of the entire world's opinion. Never being one to favor shooting elderly reloads, I always loaded up for a day's varmint hunt a few days before, using a load that I had experience with in the expected ambient conditions. Using this problem, I never experienced any load problems in the field, and if I could do it back in the stone age, so can you. The fact is I have always enjoyed discovering things on my own, not so say that I do not read every thing I can about my hobby, but I still find things to explore that I have not seen in print, which I am very glad of.
 
I find it a moot issue. Supplies dwindled and became impossible to get when Obama was in office. That raised some warning flags for me. When Trump got into office, components started coming back and I started stocking up. I have enough supplies, powder, etc., to last the rest of my days. In fact, I picked up stuff that I later didn't need, so I started selling on GB for a nice profit which helped cover some of my other purchases.
 
BoydAllen said:
The one class of powders that remain relatively affordable are ball powders. We seem to have fallen for the temperature insensitive thing hook line and sinker. My experience with reloading goes back before the dawn of their availability, and if my memory serves, and it usually does, we managed quite well in spite of what would today be viewed as a severe handicap. Back then, there was no internet, and except for reloading manuals for guidance, if we wanted to find out what a powder would produce, generally we bought a pound and put it through its paces. We really had no choice. The upside of this for some of us is that we became very experienced in doing these sorts of evaluations, ON OUR OWN, without taking a survey of the entire world's opinion. Never being one to favor shooting elderly reloads, I always loaded up for a day's varmint hunt a few days before, using a load that I had experience with in the expected ambient conditions. Using this problem, I never experienced any load problems in the field, and if I could do it back in the stone age, so can you. The fact is I have always enjoyed discovering things on my own, not so say that I do not read every thing I can about my hobby, but I still find things to explore that I have not seen in print, which I am very glad of.
Click to expand...
I couldnt agree more. Over the years I've accumulated almost every powder out there and I test most of them in the numerous cartridges I work with. I let the target tell me what the rifle likes. Temp stability is at the bottom of my list. I have never and never will ask for nor use loads from folks on the internet. I load for MY rifle, not theirs. Like Boyd said, I've learned a lot in 50 yrs of handloading. I still have my reloading manuals and use them. The biggest game changer for me has been using QL and GRT due to the wildcats I work with. I have also downsized my powder to one line and gotten rid of the rest except for Ramshot.
 
SeabeeKen said:
I couldnt agree more. Over the years I've accumulated almost every powder out there and I test most of them in the numerous cartridges I work with. I let the target tell me what the rifle likes. Temp stability is at the bottom of my list. I have never and never will ask for nor use loads from folks on the internet. I load for MY rifle, not theirs. Like Boyd said, I've learned a lot in 50 yrs of handloading. I still have my reloading manuals and use them. The biggest game changer for me has been using QL and GRT due to the wildcats I work with. I have also downsized my powder to one line and gotten rid of the rest except for Ramshot.
Click to expand...
Not only are prices high but i miss the good ol days going to the gunshop and picking up whatever powder ,primers ,brass, or anything else you were looking for without having to buy more than you needed because you didnt know when you could even find it again.I am 71 years old now and as i have said, i will never again in my lifetime see those times again.I know i am blessed that most of my life was lived in those great times before our great country is being destoyed by the ones in power and influence .
 
When I was in Wyoming this past September I went in a gun shop that had plenty of reloading supplies. I looked at a box of 1500 Fiocchi srp. I set them back down and now wish I had bought them. I have more lrmp than I'll ever shoot because I've switched to srp brass. Hopefully one day I'll make a trade with someone, until then, I'll get by.
It will probably be more 22lr shooting, which I'm ok with.
 
BoydAllen said:
The one class of powders that remain relatively affordable are ball powders. We seem to have fallen for the temperature insensitive thing hook line and sinker. My experience with reloading goes back before the dawn of their availability, and if my memory serves, and it usually does, we managed quite well in spite of what would today be viewed as a severe handicap. Back then, there was no internet, and except for reloading manuals for guidance, if we wanted to find out what a powder would produce, generally we bought a pound and put it through its paces. We really had no choice. The upside of this for some of us is that we became very experienced in doing these sorts of evaluations, ON OUR OWN, without taking a survey of the entire world's opinion. Never being one to favor shooting elderly reloads, I always loaded up for a day's varmint hunt a few days before, using a load that I had experience with in the expected ambient conditions. Using this problem, I never experienced any load problems in the field, and if I could do it back in the stone age, so can you. The fact is I have always enjoyed discovering things on my own, not so say that I do not read every thing I can about my hobby, but I still find things to explore that I have not seen in print, which I am very glad of.
Click to expand...
Exactly why over 45 years ago I left the ball powder choices, BLC2 was the first to open my eyes when I gave it up for IMR 4064. My results got better. I also bought my first trickler.

Next was ww-760, I was happy with it but tried IMR 4350, again I was sold. I went Fer several years trying other IMR powders thinking IMR was the only powder. Then I was seeing so many do so well with the same powders I was using in the same cartridges with Hogdon, so I I tried H4895 instead of IMR, that I had always been told was the same thing, next H4350, from their I went on a Hogdon rant for a year or so.

But shortly it opened my eyes, first realizing, No, they are not the same, at least my results weren't. But that was when it became obvious to try others, but I never gave ball powders another look, after I gave up BLC2, which I had used quite a bit of, and 760, then BR got in my blood. AA2015, H322 shortly faced out the 2015, I thought I was done, and found my holy grail in the 6BR Tall Dog and new 6PPC. But N133 quickly over rode that.

But the came my quest for powders that were more friendly in multiple applications, and seemed less finicky. Ball powder always seemed to finicky after I went to powders like H4895, H4350, even H322. But they seemed to be better in a larger variety of cartridges. Maybe just because the older I get the more cartridges I try??

But I remember when I thought H335 was pretty good in my small calibers. I look today at it and see, always available, and cheaper than any other option. But in the back of my mind, I look at why I left the old ball powders. I know I'm happier with the H322 and the Extreme upgrade, but is it really the powder, the better bullets and brass, primers, barrels???

One thing I do agree with is listening to others, and taking thier word for anything, especially stranger's. Today the majority are Wanna- Bees! They don't pass on hands on facts, at least with any broad view. Most think one small incident is fact. He'll most make decisions on one 3 shot group at 100 yards. Some on any group they will never again duplicate on the same day, let alone when things change.

Fortunately we still have a few locals, that want to know results on a wider view, mostly those older guys at local matches, but we are seeing far less young folks that want to put in the time to "know" what and why. Most of the new shooters we see are short lived. If it success don't come quick, they go to something else. This why it's so refreshing to see new shooters that want to find out what, why, and pursue their goal to get to where they want!

Many use excuses like those guys are a bunch of snobs?? Really, I think we all know BR shooters are the first to want help, as well as offer advanced help, usually without being asked!

But today I agree Boyd, if your wanting to become informed, reading about it ain't the way to do it. Reviews and podcast, and videos are usually more harm than good. One thing is for sure, they don't open most minds to want to find out WHY, or WHAT. Hands on is the only way, and years ago the first thing we learned was that my gun ain't the same as yours, even if they were the same,,,,,, the fun is finding out why!

I've always found ball powders to require being more specific, and never have I shot better than extruded powders on the same range. But, maybe I should 40 some years later take a poke, and right now H335 would be a good one to try, and this new 222 would be a good test platform to do it with.
 
Last edited:
StaBall 65 and StaBall HD,.. ARE,..surprisingly, GOOD and accurate,.. BUT,..
you guys should, just keep on, "Badmouthing them" as, that, equates to MORE Powder & Cheaper prices for, Me and, My Family ! Hornady ELD-M's and StaBall 65, in a 6.5 Creed are, Sub, 1/2 MOA for, Me.
DITTO for StaBall HD,.. in the 7 and 6.5, PRC's
Thank You !
 
Larry Koch said:
I don't drink, smoke or chew, and competition shooting is more up lifting than the rest. Just remember the long game of the democrat policies. They have nothing to run on, only to lie, cheat and steal. They will destroy the 2nd amendment the same way they are going after the 1st.
Click to expand...
This is where all this come about. They want total disarment, every year they pass new gun legislation.
Here in Washington state they just passed a bunch of anti gun laws and have more on the way.

I would bet if you follow the money the Dems are behind the price increase.
Last year New York past a law, back ground checks for ammunition.

Here in everett Washington they were going for an extra 11% tax on ammunition and a $50 fee on every gun sold.

All this is a democrap thing, they will get what they want one way or another.
Can't take the guns away, make it so expensive that you can't afford it.
 
Charlie-NY said:
People buy into the hype regardless of what they actually need.

Last year I met a guy on a bear hunt in Canada. We were hunting over bait which was typically about 20yds from the stands. I felt a little under gunned with my Marlin 45-70 when I was standing next a big dude who was beaming about his Savage 338 Lapua, sporting a scope that was big enough to club any black bear to death.

I meet guys in the deer camps all the time that take about LR hunting and have some very expensive equipment to get the job done. When the day is done, many of these guys miss the deer that are standing in the soybeans 100yds away.

Marketing is a very effective sales tool.
Click to expand...
Could be where you live? To me, shooting at a club because that’s the only place seems frightening. Millions of acres and hundreds of miles worth of public ground out in west. For now. They are working on wrecking that too. Point is not everyone shoots in urban areas. If I had the desire and money to shoot 5 miles I’d have room.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Upgrades & Donations

This Forum's expenses are primarily paid by member contributions. You can upgrade your Forum membership in seconds. Gold and Silver members get unlimited FREE classifieds for one year. Gold members can upload custom avatars.


Click Upgrade Membership Button ABOVE to get Gold or Silver Status.

You can also donate any amount, large or small, with the button below. Include your Forum Name in the PayPal Notes field.


To DONATE by CHECK, or make a recurring donation, CLICK HERE to learn how.

Classified Ads

Forum statistics

Threads
165,809
Messages
2,203,708
Members
79,130
Latest member
Jsawyer09

Share This Page

Back
Top