Prohibited Products in Classifieds -- Building a List

[Forum Boss]

Folks,

I noticed a couple guys listed hand-loaded ammunition for sale. In one listing this was ammo hand-loaded by the seller's grandfather decades ago using now-unknown powder and primers.

We cannot allow this kind of stuff to be sold here. The liability risk is just too great. One guy hurts himself with somebody else's handloads and your Forum may quickly cease to exist.

Accordingly I have started a list of Prohibited Products. This is just a start. I would like feedback from members so that we can add items as necessary.

C. PROHIBITED PRODUCTS -- Preliminary LIST
(It will be against the Rules to list these products for sale)

1. Damaged or bulged barrels (unless they are sold only as salvage metal and are clearly described as "not to be used with live ammunition".)

2. Loaded ammunition that has been loaded or reloaded by a private party (e.g. NOT factory-loaded ammo).

3. Hand-mixed powders of any kind, or powder of unknown origin/date/burn rate.

4. Any actions, rifles, or sound suppressors with damaged or obscured serial numbers.

5. Scopes with broken internals or broken lenses.

 

[bozo699]

Paul,
I think maybe altered factory triggers could be added to the list. Home done trigger's not professionally done triggers
Wayne.

 

[Cold Bore]

...listed hand-loaded ammunition for sale. In one listing this was ammo hand-loaded by the seller's grandfather decades ago using now-unknown powder and primers.

I saw that as well. As a newbie (postwise at least, long term reader), I bit my tongue though.

1. Damaged or bulged barrels (unless they are sold only as salvage metal and are clearly described as "not to be used with live ammunition".)

FWIW, I knew a gunsmith who used to take short chunks of old barrels (sporter weight type), drill them out, and use them as pillars under flat bottomed actions (pre-64 M70 mainly). Free, and solid as heck.

 

[Taildrag15X]

Paul,
I think maybe altered factory triggers could be added to the list.
Wayne.

+ 1 for this.......

AND

No private International Shipping or HAZMAT Shipping just to help keep the Law off us.......

 

[gambleone]

I agree. Need some rules to go by, or we could end up in the mud...

 

[kelbro]

i agree with the trigger and ammo ideas.

Can a forum really be held responsible for a transaction between two private parties? If the forum does not broker the money nor title to the product, where is the attachment. If a member sells a defective rifle (either knowingly or un-knowingly), are they liable? Would any forum that it was listed for sale on be liable?

I would bet that there is case law on this with craigslist or backpage.

Whatever it takes to keep this forum up and running, I support.

 

[Preacher]

Seems like common sense to me, and I have wondered about the reloads offered on this site...

 

[bozo699]

i agree with the trigger and ammo ideas.

Can a forum really be held responsible for a transaction between two private parties? If the forum does not broker the money nor title to the product, where is the attachment. If a member sells a defective rifle (either knowingly or un-knowingly), are they liable? Would any forum that it was listed for sale on be liable?

I would bet that there is case law on this with craigslist or backpage.

Whatever it takes to keep this forum up and running, I support.

If anyone would know the answer to that question I think Paul would, we can't take any chances on loosing this forum over something so stupid! If you have a bad barrel cut it up and sent it to the scrap yard, same with any other defective gun parts, why would you want anyone to have them? same with 1/2 century old ammo, decommission it and discard it! These rules that Paul is compiling is just common sense good business practices anyway and shouldn't need pointed out but obviously they do. We have a unusual and very close nit family here with a lot of repeat buyer's and sellers that are top notch to deal with I have only had one deal I ever felt cheated on and when I found out he had macular degeneration I knew he didn't sell rusted Wilson dies on purpose especially after I talked with him on the phone, I sure am glad I never said anything to him! I do think that maybe a 30 day wait after being a forum member to use the classifieds wouldn't be a bad idea or something on those lines. Thanks for the great forum Paul and all you do to keep it up and running.
Wayne.

 

[people]

A 30 day wait would not be bad. Just not a 100 post count like on SH. On SH there are so many bad posts to get to 100 it is not funny. The sad part is most who have over 1k are posting the same junk and calling out those under 100 on it. Something about a pot and a kettel.

Do not think cutting a barrel will save you from litigation. I heard a story about a company who cut a Cincinnati press in two and took it to recycling. The recycling company sold it to some jacka$$ who welded it back together and put it to use until it let go and hurt someone. They then sued and sued some more and the company who originaly disposed of the brake was found liable. I would have liked to be on that jerry. I would have told that family to their face he got what he deserved in welding it back together.

It stinks that a person can knowingly know they are doing wrong and then sue and get paid for being an idiot. The trick to getting sued it counter sue.

 

[BillHocker]

How about a Winchester 52D trigger modified by Karl Kenyon and there are a number of them in use in the smallbore community?

 

[SShooterZ]

Scopes with broken internals can still be salvaged many times. Especially the likes of Leupold.

The re-loaded/unknown ammo piece is a no brainer. I can't believe someone would try to sell it, none the less, find a buyer. But it happens!

We did this on another forum, written from an attorney. Not sure how helpful it would be, but I'm sure there is an attorney or 2 here that could validate or discredit.

Disclaimer:
By listing an ad or responding to an ad you agree to hold XXXXX, its owners, employees and moderators harmless in all transactions and are agreeing to abide by all the rules set forth by XXXX. By posting or reading an ad, you are agreeing that XXXX will NOT be held responsible for the content of any message, the selling, buying, or trading of any item, product, or service. You also agree that in no way will XXXXX be held liable for any transaction at the XXXXXX Classifieds, including but not limited to injury and/or death. By creating a post, or making a transaction, you are agreeing to these terms. We reserve the right to ban a member, edit or delete any post for any reason.

Hope this helps!

 

[bheadboy]

i agree on the reloads - a no no.
i would also suggest no unsealed powder, never know the contents purity or condition.

Bob

 

[bozo699]

Scopes with broken internals can still be salvaged many times. Especially the likes of Leupold.

The re-loaded/unknown ammo piece is a no brainer. I can't believe someone would try to sell it, none the less, find a buyer. But it happens!

We did this on another forum, written from an attorney. Not sure how helpful it would be, but I'm sure there is an attorney or 2 here that could validate or discredit.

Disclaimer:
By listing an ad or responding to an ad you agree to hold XXXXX, its owners, employees and moderators harmless in all transactions and are agreeing to abide by all the rules set forth by XXXX. By posting or reading an ad, you are agreeing that XXXX will NOT be held responsible for the content of any message, the selling, buying, or trading of any item, product, or service. You also agree that in no way will XXXXX be held liable for any transaction at the XXXXXX Classifieds, including but not limited to injury and/or death. By creating a post, or making a transaction, you are agreeing to these terms. We reserve the right to ban a member, edit or delete any post for any reason.

Hope this helps!

Like maybe the OP ?
Wayne.

 

[alf]

I think maybe altered factory triggers could be added to the list.

Depends on the definition.

Hardly a 700 that hasn't been tinkered with.....

 

[bozo699]

I think maybe altered factory triggers could be added to the list.

Depends on the definition.

Hardly a 700 that hasn't been tinkered with.....

ALF my friend,.......Altered!,.......hasn't been tinkered with is factory and that is fine, but home grown smith bozo699 takes a horse rasp to his 700 trigger and it don't work when done like he thinks it should then he has no right trying to pawn it off onto you
Wayne.

 

[BoydAllen]

Soo...a single cut mill file would be OK?

 

[alf]

Soo...a single cut mill file would be OK?

Well sure....powered chainsaw file....probably not..... ;D

 

[bozo699]

Soo...a single cut mill file would be OK?

Well sure....powered chainsaw file....probably not..... ;D

Only if you use jeweler's rouge Boyd in conjunction with the mill file
Wayne.

 

[jasonf]

AND

No private International Shipping or HAZMAT Shipping just to help keep the Law off us.......

It is not necessary for the forum to regulate who sellers ship to. There are lots of items that can quite legally be shipped internationally, and sellers can and should be the ones to make that decision.

 

[jonbearman]

How about we send paul a copy of our current drivers license ,then we could end the ripoffs from time to time.