Please explain action "timing"

[powderbrake]

I have read some posts here about action timing, but I do not understand what action timing actually is. Will someone please tell me what it means, and how it is accomplished, and what difference it makes to the shooter/accuracy?

 

[joshb]

Layman terms: Action timing has to do with primary extraction, or if and when your bolt handle hits the little ramp on your action to begin pulling the cartridge out of the chamber. The "ramp"is angled and acts like a wedge to help pry the fired brass out as you lift the bolt. Some bolt handles are attached in the wrong position and "miss" the ramp.

 

[Rtheurer]

 

[Fast14riot]

There's two types of timing generally, extraction timing and ignition timing. Search for posts by @Alex Wheeler for some in depth discussions and explanations on the subject.

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

In addition to timing the primary extraction, the handoff of the striker to the sear should be timed to avoid cocking-on-close (makes the bolt unnecessarily hard to operate) while retaining full firing pin fall (essential for consistent ignition).

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Go to my facebook and web page if you want to see what ignition/trigger timing is. I have before and after videos. I also have videos on extraction.

 

[rkittine]

So, what did it mean when I paid to have Jim Borden, "Install and Time" the Jewel Trigger he put in my Borden Action, when I first got it? Assume this is the Ignition part.

Bob

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

So, what did it mean when I paid to have Jim Borden, "Install and Time" the Jewel Trigger he put in my Borden Action, when I first got it? Assume this is the Ignition part.

Bob

Jim is a stickler for getting the ignition timing right so that the action operates with the minimum effort required for consistent ignition. Since Jim doesn't control the dimensions of the sear on Arnold Jewell's triggers, each trigger has to be timed individually.

 

[Brians356]

Revolvers also have analogous critical timing issues, especially double-action ones.
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[DirtySteve]

And when asking the wife about a new rifle. Timing is the key.. lol..

 

[swd]

And when asking the wife about a new rifle. Timing is the key.. lol..

I thought timing was what you do to sneak in that new rifle you didn't tell her about, lol.

 

[cdhbrad]

I thought timing was what you do to sneak in that new rifle you didn't tell her about, lol.

I've gotten pretty good at that "timing", the rest I will leave to qualified smiths.

 

[Drolds72]

So, ignition timing, is moving the trigger fore/aft to get the most efficient use of it, and then adjusting the firing pin fall, which was affected by the moving of the trigger? Is this correct?

 

[powderbrake]

I understood the extraction timing, it was the ignition timing that I was not understanding. I saw from the Bullet Central video how moving the trigger backward and forward effects the cocking and effort required.

I had looked at the Wheeler videos, but did not understand them, until I read the replies and questions on the videos. I now understand that it is an interrelated situation between adequate firing pin energy and cocking effort. I also understand that Alex Wheeler says it is not a DIY project, and may require re-cutting the cocking cam helix in addition to other steps, so I probably won't be trying that.

Thank you to all who responded, Accurate Shooter.com is the best place to go for the answers to your questions, and the people here are gentlemen.

 

[joshb]

I thought timing was what you do to sneak in that new rifle you didn't tell her about, lol.

That kinda timing is critical! Yesterday, not one but two new scopes came in the mail. Luckily, she was in the head when the doorbell rang! She had only "blessed" one scope purchase.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

So, ignition timing, is moving the trigger fore/aft to get the most efficient use of it, and then adjusting the firing pin fall, which was affected by the moving of the trigger? Is this correct?

In a nut shell. Once the mods are done to get smooth closing of the bolt, you usually have significantly reduced pin fall. What is unique about what I do is I re work the bolt to get back that firing pin fall. Certain actions like Bordens have been this way for a long time. Others are catching on. I time the actions on almost all of my builds. I am a stickler for smooth actions AND ignition energy.

 

[Drolds72]

In a nut shell. Once the mods are done to get smooth closing of the bolt, you usually have significantly reduced pin fall. What is unique about what I do is I re work the bolt to get back that firing pin fall. Certain actions like Bordens have been this way for a long time. Others are catching on. I time the actions on almost all of my builds. I am a stickler for smooth actions AND ignition energy.

Thanks for the explanation. I have a second hand BRM with a Jewell trigger. It *seems* to be timed. Also just had your Joint venture bolt shroud installed, but the the entire action is so incredibly smooth, it’s really tough to see if I gained anything from it! No bolt jump for sure! Maybe it will help me call the wind better!

 

[spitfire_er]

Just got done going through Alex's facebook page which is a nice place to look at some great rifles btw. I just learned tonight that I have been "ignition timing" my rifles for the past 10 years when I started messing with rifle building. The guy I learned from did it since the late 60's. I always knew what the goal was behind doing it, but never heard the term "ignition timing".

Not a simple procedure, but sure does make these rifles much more pleasant to shoot! I can't stand "clunky" bolts after running a timed one!

 

[370bc]

I saw my first custom action, some years ago, and I can't remember correctly exactly which brand it was at my local gun club. It ruined me. Opening and closing that brightly polished action was indescribable. And the jewel trigger was amazing. (We don't get too many rifles like that At the club). You could almost say it was a religious experience. The smoothness of the opening and closing was magical. I know that sounds crazy, but that's what is was.
I had a buddy that had a custom 243 HV with a jewel trigger that was set at a super low setting. 'Standing' behind a concrete bench table top, on gravel, (We have concrete now), I proceeded to put 4 shots in the same hole. I believe it was a tight neck chamber. I pulled the 5th one that opened the group to about a 1/4''. Both of these particular events were seared into my mind. When my funds will allow, I plan to put together a hunting rig that is almost has smooth, with a very nice aftermarket trigger.
When you use a system that is great quality and put together right, it's unlike anything you have ever used before. Maybe Someday I will get one too!

 

[jfseaman]

Go to my facebook and web page if you want to see what ignition/trigger timing is. I have before and after videos. I also have videos on extraction.

Ahhh, he says as the light bulb over his head starts to glow.

Thank you @Alex Wheeler very informative.