Recently, I have run into some concentricity issues. I’m considering lubing my necks with the Redding dry lube. Then am planning on wiping outsides of these necks and lubing the outside of the cases with Imperial wax, sizing, then charging with powder. Does anyone else do this? Does anyone see a problem trying this? Thanks for your thoughts.
Neck lubing ?
- Thread starter Topwater
- Start date
If you're pulling them back over and expander ball or running them over a mandrel, I highly recommend doing exactly what you're considering. The dry lube inside the neck does not contaminate powder nor cause it to hang up in the neck. 
D-4297
Gold $$ Contributor
May I recommend using the Imperial wax first to prep the outside of the case , followed by the "Dri-Lube" being put inside with a Q-tip . Then ; run it through your sizing die . If you're doing everything the same as always in your process , and just now developing a concentricity issue , there may be another issue at hand .
jepp2
Gold $$ Contributor
What is OD of your sized necks before expanding? And after expanding?
I spent a lot of time, effort and $ to improve my case neck runout. One thing I found was even when I lubed the inside of my case neck, used a carbide expander, and set my expander as high as possible, - if the expander had to enlarge the case neck 0.002" or more, it WILL pull the case neck off center.
I eventually wound up honing my FL sizing die case necks to the diameter I needed, straight necks resulted.
bozo699
Gold $$ Contributor
jepp2
Gold $$ Contributor
DIY. Key was getting the correct hones (my experience with the flex hones was a zero).
I "stole" shamelessly from Rick Averill. I already had the Clover lapping compounds.
https://rickaverill.com/projects-past-and-present/lapping-reloading-dies/
I do wrap the shaft with tape to stay centered since this is a hand operation. I use pin gages to guide my progress, then start sizing cases toward the end. You need to know your desired endpoint.
Jepp2, Thanks for sharing the website. Lots a great info.
Through the process of elimination, I suspect the major cause was in my use of dies. It’s a long explanation but here goes.
My initial goal was to load the fifty finest reloads possible with the equipment I have. I prepped 200 new Norma 6XC brass. I did not trim or neck turn any. I sorted BERGER 107s by base to ogive then sorted those by weight to 1/20 th. Of a grain. I then sorted Federal GM210M primers by weight and hand primed with the Frankfort Arsenal tool. I threw light powder charges of H4350 with a RCBS Loadmaster. Then I trickled up to weight each charge to 1/20 gr. Finally, I am ready to seat Bullets.
I set up my Forster Benchrest seater, loaded the first round long then adjusted accordingly by 0.001”. I seated three and checked for my desired length, CBtoO. Satisfied, I loaded the other forty seven.
These fifty were beautiful to behold. I could hardly wait to prove to myself that all the meticulous work would shave some size off my groups. Ah ha, one step remained, concentricity check with my Sinclair tool.
The first round read 0.007 out! WHAT ?? I continued. They were all terribly disappointing. They ran from 0.004 to 0.007 out of concentricity. I went back to my previously loaded fifty rounds and checked them. They were from almost dead on to 0.002. I pondered why in the world there was such a difference. I’m not sure, but, do believe that I may have used my 6XC Redding Competition dies to seat those better rounds. I just find it hard to believe that such disparity could exist between the two die sets. I really don’t want to have to invest in a set of inline dies. I am only four years into “benchrest” reloading and things that affect this as opposed to plain old hunting ammo, still perplex me. Back then, three shots under an inch at 100yds. was absolutely fine. Obviously I’ve slipped over the greasy edge of the black hole that is precision reloading but it does keep me off the streets.
My initial goal was to load the fifty finest reloads possible with the equipment I have. I prepped 200 new Norma 6XC brass. I did not trim or neck turn any. I sorted BERGER 107s by base to ogive then sorted those by weight to 1/20 th. Of a grain. I then sorted Federal GM210M primers by weight and hand primed with the Frankfort Arsenal tool. I threw light powder charges of H4350 with a RCBS Loadmaster. Then I trickled up to weight each charge to 1/20 gr. Finally, I am ready to seat Bullets.
I set up my Forster Benchrest seater, loaded the first round long then adjusted accordingly by 0.001”. I seated three and checked for my desired length, CBtoO. Satisfied, I loaded the other forty seven.
These fifty were beautiful to behold. I could hardly wait to prove to myself that all the meticulous work would shave some size off my groups. Ah ha, one step remained, concentricity check with my Sinclair tool.
The first round read 0.007 out! WHAT ?? I continued. They were all terribly disappointing. They ran from 0.004 to 0.007 out of concentricity. I went back to my previously loaded fifty rounds and checked them. They were from almost dead on to 0.002. I pondered why in the world there was such a difference. I’m not sure, but, do believe that I may have used my 6XC Redding Competition dies to seat those better rounds. I just find it hard to believe that such disparity could exist between the two die sets. I really don’t want to have to invest in a set of inline dies. I am only four years into “benchrest” reloading and things that affect this as opposed to plain old hunting ammo, still perplex me. Back then, three shots under an inch at 100yds. was absolutely fine. Obviously I’ve slipped over the greasy edge of the black hole that is precision reloading but it does keep me off the streets.
Topwater, You're absolutely on the right track however take it from an old stool shooter who has made every mistake in the book. You took the time to check the BTO on three case, at that time you should have also checked the runout. Your problem would have shown itself and saved you from loading all the others. Much easier to pull three bullets that 50, take it from a guy who knows. If you're serious about going down the rabbit hole, buy the best equipment, (that doesn't always mean the most expensive), be methodical, and test, test, test. Oh yeah, before you purchase instrumentation, put the time in, do the research ask knowledgeable shooters and buy the best to meet your needs, you won't be sorry, don't throw good money after bad. Oh yeah, those inline dies will surely be in your future if you want to compete at a high level or produce the best ammo you're capable of. Good luck my friend.
Was the new brass fl sized & with what die?
1.Redding Competition Bushing Neck Die Set includes a Competition Bushing Neck Sizing Die, a Body Die, and a Competition Bullet Seater. Neck Sizing Die and Seater feature micrometer adjustments.
Or
2. The Redding Type S Match Bushing Full Die Set contains a Type S Bushing Full Sizing Die and a Compeition Seating Die.
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243winxb, These are twice fired and resized in a Whidden 6XC FL Bushing die. I only use the Forster or Redding dies for seating the bullets. The Forster is for my GH rifle and the Redding for my competition rifle. The Redding set I have is not the Competition set as stated above but the Type S Match. I think the only difference is the micrometer adjustment on the sizer.
Tonight I browsed my Redding catalog. I see that they make a carbide expander button kit. According to their information, this carbide button is “free floating”. Could this possibly help my situation? I wonder if I would turn all the necks after sizing with this carbide upgrade, if that might help by eliminating a variance in neck thickness. I wouldn’t feel comfortable trying to hone the necks in my dies.
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
Do not lube the neck or shoulder and itll turn out much better. Consistent and concentric
Neck turning and sizing 1/2 of the neck with a fl bushing die, may help accuracy. I dont use the expander.
The Redding bushing needs the stamped size facing the case mouth.
My Redding type S fl bushing die allowes testing with & without the expander. Unturned necks get the expander. Use a bushing that just gives light drag as expander is pulled thru the lubed neck.
I lube the outside of the necks very lightly with RCBS 2 lube, thats on my fingers from picking the case off the pad . The inside of the neck get very little lube from brushing with a RCBS nylon brush. Cleans the neck.
I have never checked runout. But Redding has said sizing a fired case neck down more then .008" at a time can cause runout.
The target will tell you what works best.
I have never tried the Lee Collet Neck sizing die, with a Redding Body die. Its said to work ok?
You can partial neck size with the Lee Collet Die by getting a washer of the thickness you want and hole large enough to loosely fit over your case. Place the case in the shellholder, put the washer down over it, and resize. Whatever thickness of washer you use will leave that portion of the bottom of the neck unsized.
The Redding bushing needs the stamped size facing the case mouth.
My Redding type S fl bushing die allowes testing with & without the expander. Unturned necks get the expander. Use a bushing that just gives light drag as expander is pulled thru the lubed neck.
I lube the outside of the necks very lightly with RCBS 2 lube, thats on my fingers from picking the case off the pad . The inside of the neck get very little lube from brushing with a RCBS nylon brush. Cleans the neck.
I have never checked runout. But Redding has said sizing a fired case neck down more then .008" at a time can cause runout.
The target will tell you what works best.
I have never tried the Lee Collet Neck sizing die, with a Redding Body die. Its said to work ok?
You can partial neck size with the Lee Collet Die by getting a washer of the thickness you want and hole large enough to loosely fit over your case. Place the case in the shellholder, put the washer down over it, and resize. Whatever thickness of washer you use will leave that portion of the bottom of the neck unsized.
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