My new 6.5x47 Borden

[Evan]

It may be an unreasonable standard, but my 22BR showed me some regular 0.375" groups at 300. Not agg 0.375, but maybe every 10th group or so, I'd see it drop down there. A ho-hum kinda day was 1". The problem with that gun is that it blows up bullets, so it's not much of a competition rifle. I'm holding this rifle to that standard of accuracy. I'll ultimately be disappointed if I can't find sub 0.5" groups at 300 with it but it is looking like it has it in it.

 

[Sandstorm]

Try RL17 or H4350 I hear people all the time praising those powders....Didn't work for crap in my barrel however.
But they get .3 groups out of them....and beat me @ 600 lol

 

[Longrange57]

330 yards today. Mid-50s and high humidity at 6am. Wind was very mild and progressively grew into a 8mph headwind that swung left to right. That said, I think I've got some interesting results:
View attachment 1195766

If we look at this target and assign rows numbers 1 through 6, and the columns letters A through F, we can talk about specific targets and groups. So the first group at the top left of the target would be 2A, for example.

The 153.5 Hybrid
I loaded 153.5 Hybrids 0.010" out of the lands, and laddered down from 40.5 to 40.0gns of RL16 in 3 shot groups: 40.4gns is 5A, 40.3gns is 5B, 40.2gns is 5C, 40.1gns is 4D, 40.0gns is 5D.

If we look at the distance from the center of the group to the center of the dot on each target, it looks to me like 40.4 and 40.3 are somewhat flat and then it rapidly drops and stays stable for maybe 40.2 through 40.0. I don't necessarily think these are two nodes, but it is a pretty stark and noticeable shift in POI.

3C is the 153.5 loaded 0.015" out of the lands and 3D is loaded 0.020" out of the lands, both at 40.0gns. We can see the POI is consistent and low, just like with 5D, the other 40.0gn load at 0.010" out of the lands. 5D, in this 3 target group, looks REALLY good with just one shot out of a tight little dot. 3C and 3D are both bigger in shape but if I explored even further out of the lands, I imagine that it would come back in to a tight group again somewhere maybe around 0.025" out of the lands. Given how compressed these loads are, I will do some fine tuning around 0.010" out of the lands and see how it goes. At this point, I will also use 5 shots instead of 3.

Many of these groups hovered right around 0.75-1.00 inch, with a few of them threatening to be much smaller without one of the three shots ruining a good thing.

The 144 Hybrid
I loaded the 144 Hybrids 0.010" out of the lands, and laddered from 40.5 down to 40gns of RL16 in 3 shot groups. 40.5gns is 4C, 40.4gns is 3A, 40.3gns is 2A, 40.2gns is 2B, 40.1gns is 2C, and 40.0gns is a 5 shot group on 2F.

The POI on these groups seems stable all the way until I get to the 5-shot 40.0gn group at 2F. A quick note is that wind was getting challenging at this point and I think that is why groups got bigger and uglier at 1.25 to 2.5 inches.

Seating depth was tested at 40.5gns of RL16, again going 0.010" out (4C), 0.015" out(3F), 0.020" out (3E), and then also 0.025" out (3B). This really is a wash. Nothing stands out to me here. Maybe 0.025" out of the lands (3B) looks better than the rest, but it's just not showing the same promise 153.5 is.

Where to next?
Ultimately, I've got a nagging feeling that RL-16 isn't the powder. It seems to hold some promise with the 153.5, but not with the 147ELD or the 144 Hybrid. I may in the near future start venturing into other powders: RL-17, IMR-4350, SW Long Rifle. See if one of these suddenly tightens it all up. I've got a couple matches next weekend at CRC, so I'll report how the 153.5 does at 1000 yards after that.

I have shot 10's of thousands of rounds through with this caliber and a dozen different barrels,and its hard to beat H4350 and RL-16. Also shot many other powders trying to get where I wanted to be. 140 gr and up my best and most consistent groups have been H4350. Lighter bullets, especially 123 scenar, Varget is the ticket. I dont blame you for experimenting but this is probably where you will wind up. Very nice rig you have! You will get it going!

 

[North Fork]

You should try the 140gr berger elite hunter

 

[Evan]

1000 yards, 106 degrees is what my car said as I drove home. Windy, but seemed to stay centered up well. Won best target and LG Group Agg. Peterson brass on it's 4th reload, weight sorted CCI450, 40gns of RL-16 behind the 153.5 Hybrid jumping 0.010" to the lands. This load is too hot. It needs to come down more. It's leaving brass smears all over the face of the bolt when it gets hot. 24MOA to get it centered from 100 yard zero makes me think I'm going more than 2800fps!

6.5x47 for BR
Pros: stays centered very well compared to my 22BR with the 95SMK at 3050fps.
Cons: significantly more recoil makes gun management more work than with smaller cartridges.

 

[SG4247]

Thats really great!

Can you add any weight to the stock to help reduce recoil?

 

[Evan]

Thats really great!

Can you add any weight to the stock to help reduce recoil?

Nope, I'm kissing 17# right now. Have to remove the sunshade and scope caps to make weight. It's not bad, it's just significantly more than BR size cases.

 

[Sandstorm]

Yes..a little more and way worth it in the target. Nice job my friend. Bravo.

 

[sdeal5]

Good job Evan. Think I’m going to have to try the 153.5’s after seeing that! Congrats

 

[RallyFan]

View attachment 1197286
1000 yards, 106 degrees is what my car said as I drove home. Windy, but seemed to stay centered up well. Won best target and LG Group Agg. Peterson brass on it's 4th reload, weight sorted CCI450, 40gns of RL-16 behind the 153.5 Hybrid jumping 0.010" to the lands. This load is too hot. It needs to come down more. It's leaving brass smears all over the face of the bolt when it gets hot. 24MOA to get it centered from 100 yard zero makes me think I'm going more than 2800fps!

6.5x47 for BR
Pros: stays centered very well compared to my 22BR with the 95SMK at 3050fps.
Cons: significantly more recoil makes gun management more work than with smaller cartridges.

153.5 with a 24moa come up from 100 yards puts the velocity about 2928fps.

 

[Evan]

153.5 with a 24moa come up from 100 yards puts the velocity about 2928fps.

I'm at 5000ft and 100degrees, air is a bit thinner. I came up with 2840fps. Either way... really cooking!

 

[Evan]

So, I decided I shouldn't sugar coat it. Conditions got worse yesterday as the day went on and here are the HG groups:

Today, we had our second match and I shot the 144 Hybrid behind 40gns of RL16, 0.025" off the lands and managed to win best group with another 4", but didn't get Agg or any other awards. It was a pretty competitive day.

And HG was again worse:


Overall, looking pretty good! I will continue load development with both the 153.5 and the 144. They shot very similarly at 1000 yards.

 

[Sandstorm]

I too like the 144gr and it shoots as well as the 140 BT LR I used to shoot all the time..
I may have to try the 153.5 at a 1000 as well....thanks for the foot work.
Its too bad im at 2000 feet instead of 5.....just need to work a bit harder at it and i wont be dialing no 24moa..lol

 

[Evan]

Sorry for the hack: picture of a laptop screen. It was the fastest way to get it here.

I went out shooting at 4:30 this morning. Just got my shotmarker and the wind was supposed to be good, which it was. 50 degrees, gentle breeze, target at 450 yards!

I shot a whole bunch of stuff: 144, 153, 147ELD, all propelled by RL-16, RL-17, IMR-4320, IMR-4064, Shooter's World Precision, and Long Rifle. Most all combinations shot a 1" group at some point. The attached picture is showing my groups with the 153.5 Hybrid and RL-17. That's a 0.6" group at 450 yards. I got another 0.6" group with the 144 and RL-17 too, but I'm still looking for it in the saved targets. I'll post it when I find it.

I'm going to pursue RL-17 a little. That's ~0.125MOA by my quick mental math!

 

[Evan]

Oh, and I'd like to add that I like the Shotmarker very much! Definitely made shooting out at distance WAY more productive with having immediate feedback. If it fits your budget, it's worth it.

More groups with the 144 Hybrid:

Again, sorry for the hack photo, haha.

 

[Sandstorm]

You saw Rallyfan,s post with RL17 and
140 Bergers @ 3100 plus...amazin stuff

 

[Evan]

So I got to shoot at 1000yards yesterday morning. 70-75 degrees, almost no wind, a little bit of humidity. I used the shotmarker again and have to say that it changes the game: seeing every shot and correlating it to the conditions is really good for practicing.
I shot the 153.5 Hybrid behind my usual load of RL-16 and got some fair groups - 6" or so. But the star of the show today is RL-17:

Yep. several 3 inch groups with long stretchy ones in between. I am pretty excited about this! Reloder 17 just flat shot smaller than Reloder 16, side by side in the same conditions yesterday. If this holds across conditions and days, across 5 and 10 shot groups, then this will be highly competitive!

I also have a pile of 147ELD on hand (my RPR liked them a lot so I bought a case; I think I have 600 or so left). I wanted to see what they will do.

Nothing eye-popping there, although it's all pretty solid. This was at the end of the day as heat was picking up, but conditions were still good. Overall, I'm feeling a lot more excited about the 6.5x47. This gun can shoot!

 

[Sandstorm]

Only problem I found with RL17 was the Summer temps in Arizona...its just too
temperamental out here...Id keep my loads in a cooler on the line and bring them out when I was ready to fire..Big hassle.
It would spike real bad and the vertical was out of control at a 1000 yds unless chilled. Its 100 to 108 by 9:00am sometimes.
Went back to Varget...

 

[Evan]

Only problem I found with RL17 was the Summer temps in Arizona...its just too
temperamental out here...Id keep my loads in a cooler on the line and bring them out when I was ready to fire..Big hassle.
It would spike real bad and the vertical was out of control at a 1000 yds unless chilled. Its 100 to 108 by 9:00am sometimes.
Went back to Varget...

Yeah I'll have to work with it some and see how it does for me. I'm not normally shooting in super hot weather, but it does start at 70 in the morning and finish at 90-100degrees in July and August. May just need to have morning and mid-day tunes loaded and ready to go so that as things warm up I can switch over.

 

[260AckImp]

@Evan Ive got a 260 AI that has a long freebore. Im currently shooting Berger 140 VLD's at 2900 out of a 28" 1-8 twist Krieger.

Ive got a long freebore which is why im shooting the 140 VLD's, was thinking of trying the 144 LRHT because I thought they would setup with more of the bearing surface in the neck but am I correct in understanding that the 144 is shorter?
Maybe I should try the 153.5's?

Cheers