Most People Are Fooling Themselves.....

[F Class John]

You sir seem like a genuinely decent person! One that can handle the broad spectrum of encounters and remain extremely upbeat, a dying breed so to speak.
I by nature am a helpful person too. It has gotten me into a lot of no win situations. Helping someone zero a scope turns into a spotting job after, which in turn yields a not so accurate load, now you are a mentor. All because you had 10 test loads to shoot.

Very kind of you to say. Admittedly I have my a$$hat moments too but we probably all do. I just do my best to keep them to a minimum. And yes I agree that sometime no good deed goes unpunished but at least an attempt to help was made. It’s a lot easier to look down then it is to look up and I just do my best at the range to treat everyone who doesn’t understand and wants to learn about my discipline the same way I would hope someone like a three gun guy would treat me if I showed up with my off the rack A.R. 15, a Beretta 92 and a marine 870.

I don’t know everything but I’m willing to learn.

 

[wbm]

And yes I agree that sometime no good deed goes unpunished but at least an attempt to help was made.

Ever do what I call the "Yoda Test."? You cautiously ask a few questions or make some subtle comments to see if the potential "Jedi" is really wanting to know or learn something. At 75 I do that more now. Gave up, well trying anyway, giving advise that upon reflection was not requested. Have a young neighbor, well a mile, but a "close neighbor" by New Mexico ranch definition, that said to me one day, "I really want someone to teach me about my Savage rifle and how to shoot." After a couple of weeks, I decided he was serious. Over the summer, he watched and listened as I took apart both Savage 110's and Axis models, showed him how to switch barrels and gave him lots of stuff he needed to make both more "shootable". At the range, well the "range" here is 17000 acres of open range, I discovered he already can shoot...he's "a natural" just needed someone to tell him that and build his confidence. What took me several years to learn I taught him in a few weeks. At least I can pass on knowing I have passed things on. That is after all what it is all about. IMO

 

[Nature Boy]

Helping someone zero a scope turns into a spotting job after, which in turn yields a not so accurate load, now you are a mentor. All because you had 10 test loads to shoot.

After the zero help is when you say, "...there you go,....you got it now,.....good job....." and stuff your ear plugs in and go back to shooting.

Then 5 min later when the inevitable, "hey, I got another question" comes up you can:

1. case up your equipment, help the dude with his next issue, give marital advice, financial investment tips, generally be a big brother.

2. pretend like you can't hear him

3. realize he's still standing behind you after 20 min and either see 1. above or 4. below

4. Save you last round, use it on yourself and end the suffering

 

[spaniel]

In general I'm fatigued on all the negativity and division so I don't spend it on other shooters. Safety issues cannot go unchallenged and I don't like people hunting who lack the skill to do so, but it's not my job to impose my accuracy standards on others. I grew up in an area where we were forced to use shotgun slugs in the days when there was no such thing as an accurate slug gun, but within 100 yards, they made for a lot of dead deer because a 4 MOA gun was totally sufficient in practical terms.

I have a private range, but when I shot public ones I was happy to help IF it was requested. Being on the receiving end of unwanted advice several times by well-meaning but ill-knowledged range "residents", I struck up conversations with those in need of some help to see if a door opened, and if not, I went back to my own business.

I recently had to replace the 100 yard target frame on my private range due to the damage done by a decade of entertaining people in need of help. Have to say with some patience, I have a pretty good record for turning around people who are inexperienced, but interested, and WANT help. Even if they start out ignorant but thinking they know it all.

The local gun shops should thank me, I've probably turned a dozen people from non-shooters or only very occasional shooters to regular shooters with a stable of firearms.

There are those who are beyond hope. But remember the future of our sport relies on the size of the voting block defending our rights.

 

[natdscott]

All I know is, for all that's been laid out in this thread, there better be a big ol' pile of hellacious shooters in here.

 

[fredo]

They have no idea that a true “quarter inch gun” will group more often in the ones than the twos. They have less of an idea on the shooting techniques required to get that performance out of a rifle.

I Agree!
Just thinkin out loud here, but...
That'd be the PERFECT opportunity to offer them YOUR rifle to shoot on YOUR target. Then, when ya go down to check targets @ CEASEFIRE, and they see their group against yours...that's when the "teachable moment" occurs...
Best part is, ya don't hafta say A WORD. They baked their own 'humble pie', and choking down a piece in front of you should be a sobering enough experience. How they react after that will tell ya if your "teachable moment" sunk in, or not...

Just sayin, where there's a will, there's a way!

 

[Steve Ladino]

So my yard has been wikkid noisy the last few weeks..... perty much every nite there's someone "sighting in for hunting season" and/or "checking their zero"

A few are trying out the 450 and 600yd targets to "find out if the marks in my custom turret are accurate"

They're all shooting factory rifles with factory ammo because "they don't have time to get into reloading....."

And most of them call me about an hour after dark on their way driving home and ask "what do you think the problem is with my......???" whatever

And "do you think we could fix this before hunting season?" because "600yds...."

It's depressing.

On every modern hunting show "600yds" is a chip shot...

All the guns "tested" in the glossy mags shoot "1/2moa with XXX ammunition"

On the forums and blogs EVERYBODY ELSE can get their gun to shoot "1/4 minute" by just squidging the whojummawhat'chit a fuzz-lick to the left......

I LIVE ON A RANGE.....

I BUILD CUSTOM RIFLES!!

WHY is it so hard for ME to "get any bullet to shoot" and to "tune any barrel" or to "find that magical factory ammo that shoots everything into 1/2 inch "when I do my part???"

I'm headed down the range in about 15 minutes to engage in hand-to-hand with a certain rifle I'm fighting to waterline..... there ain't nuttin' ON IT that's factory..... ain't nuttin' ON IT that didn't cost hunnerds of dollars......and it ain't shootin' 1/4moa at 600 (bugholess at 100 BTW....ES in the dust on the floor...)

.....and since it's a one-off I can't even go down to Walmart and get any magical factory loads from the chart in OL, LOL

I'm probably gonna' have to re-cut the throat, I'm trying several bullets of which I've only got a few hunnerd left cuz I'm friggin' DESPERATE.....I'll be going down my list of "stuff" before setting aside a BRAND NEW Krieger (which will probably bughole on another platform.....)


OK



Rant OFF




Just prep'ing for battle



I ain't even asking for help, just venting a liddle!


LOL


al

I think it all depends on a proper and enjoyable introduction to shooting by a Father, brother, or maybe a Scout leader which brings sensibility to shooting a gun.

 

[clunker]

Wish I had some of you at my range when I got started in March. My friend was at the same range a few weeks ago, and another member offered some advice on shooting position. His groups were cut in half after a few minutes of help from someone who knew what they were talking about.

Speaking of range safety! When I finally got my Creedmoor back, I went to the range and set up my typical prone position at the 100-yd mark. Something in the ground was jabbing into my ribs, so I sat back and saw I was laying on a bunch of cases under the grass. While picking up the cases, I found 4 live rounds. One was a misfire .22. The other 3 were unfired, and two of them looked like they had been rusting since last year. I'm not so much worried about laying on top of live rounds as much as I am worried about the guy who mows the grass.

 

[SSL]

A few years back, a guy that worked with my wife called me to see if I knew anyone with a good, used .30-06 for sale. A good friend of mine had a Winchester 670 with a pretty good Weaver scope that he had picked up cheap and had me work on it. I had glass-bedded the action, floated the barrel, tuned the trigger and developed a good load for it that gave 1.00" and less 3-shot groups at 100-yards. Right after I returned it his neighbor offered him a real good deal on a Browning and he grabbed it up. He had decided to let the Winchester go. I got the buyer and my buddy together and the sale was made at a very good price, including the box of 50 loaded rounds I had given him.
The next Saturday the buyer came racing into my drive and got out waving the rifle while calling me every name in the book. He accused me of working with my buddy to sell him "A piece of sh## that couldn't hit a barn", showing me a target with a single hole in the upper right corner, the final result from 20 rounds. I told him to calm down and give me a moment. I looked the rifle over and saw nothing wrong. I ran a dry brush through it a few times followed by a couple dry patches.
Taking the box of ammo from him, I walked out to my benchrest and proceeded to fire 3 shots at a 100-yard target. When I retrieved the target, there were 2 holes touching 1 1/2" high with the third 1/2" away. I handed him the rifle, showed him the target, then folded it up and stuck it in his shirt pocket, telling him to get the hell off my property and if he chose to give my wife any attitude at work he would have more problems than he could handle.
A few days later I came home to find a case of beer and a note on my porch. He had apologized and asked if I would be willing to help him figure what he was doing wrong. I gave it some thought (with input from my wife who is much more forgiving than I ) and called him. We ended up spending a day working on sight picture, trigger and breath control, head and body position and etc. He ended up a fairly decent shot and continued practicing at a local range. We are now, while not buddies, at least on friendly terms.
Oh, and since I don't drink, the beer went to my buddy.
Moral is; helping others isn't always easy!

 

[joshb]

All I know is, for all that's been laid out in this thread, there better be a big ol' pile of hellacious shooters in here.

There are!

 

[CT10ring]

A few years back, a guy that worked with my wife called me to see if I knew anyone with a good, used .30-06 for sale. A good friend of mine had a Winchester 670 with a pretty good Weaver scope that he had picked up cheap and had me work on it. I had glass-bedded the action, floated the barrel, tuned the trigger and developed a good load for it that gave 1.00" and less 3-shot groups at 100-yards. Right after I returned it his neighbor offered him a real good deal on a Browning and he grabbed it up. He had decided to let the Winchester go. I got the buyer and my buddy together and the sale was made at a very good price, including the box of 50 loaded rounds I had given him.
The next Saturday the buyer came racing into my drive and got out waving the rifle while calling me every name in the book. He accused me of working with my buddy to sell him "A piece of sh## that couldn't hit a barn", showing me a target with a single hole in the upper right corner, the final result from 20 rounds. I told him to calm down and give me a moment. I looked the rifle over and saw nothing wrong. I ran a dry brush through it a few times followed by a couple dry patches.
Taking the box of ammo from him, I walked out to my benchrest and proceeded to fire 3 shots at a 100-yard target. When I retrieved the target, there were 2 holes touching 1 1/2" high with the third 1/2" away. I handed him the rifle, showed him the target, then folded it up and stuck it in his shirt pocket, telling him to get the hell off my property and if he chose to give my wife any attitude at work he would have more problems than he could handle.
A few days later I came home to find a case of beer and a note on my porch. He had apologized and asked if I would be willing to help him figure what he was doing wrong. I gave it some thought (with input from my wife who is much more forgiving than I ) and called him. We ended up spending a day working on sight picture, trigger and breath control, head and body position and etc. He ended up a fairly decent shot and continued practicing at a local range. We are now, while not buddies, at least on friendly terms.
Oh, and since I don't drink, the beer went to my buddy.
Moral is; helping others isn't always easy!

you, sir , are why I think shooters are maybe - the best of the best. Too bad the media doesn't understand the goodness of so many who shoot. The rest of us will.
I had a fellow at my house with a 6 pack today - to say " sorry". Bet many of us have learned from the generosity of others. I sure have. Thanx for the post.

 

[SSL]

Thanks. The real credit goes to my wife. She convinced me to give him a chance. She is far more forgiving and soft-hearted than I. Probably one reason we have been married 47 years. Only one who can put up with me!

 

[Falfan2017]

Our range is split into a long range competition side that goes 100 to 1000 yards and a short range 25 to 200 yard side for pistol and whatever else people want to do at short range. There's no physical barrier between the two but you aren't allowed to shoot across for obvious reasons. The bullet could leave the side of the range and not hit a berm and end up off property.

We were doing a club 600 yard benchrest match and these unexplained holes kept popping up on a couple targets. Turns out two jokers with ar15s were taking pot shots at the targets while we were very clearly in the middle of a match.

 

[natdscott]

There are!

...but you know what they say about Pride.

Because shooting really well requires the sharpened edge of confidence, it's a funny balance. I'm trying to work on that one myself. I won't throw stones too hard, but some of what has been said in this thread is why the 'average Joe' has a hard time approaching target shooting. True in spades for the 'average Jane'.

I'm above average in shooting nearly every shooting sport. A legend in my own mind.

...but aren't we ALL above average drivers as well?

 

[joshb]

...but you know what they say about Pride.

Because shooting really well requires the sharpened edge of confidence, it's a funny balance. I'm trying to work on that one myself. I won't throw stones too hard, but some of what has been said in this thread is why the 'average Joe' has a hard time approaching target shooting. True in spades for the 'average Jane'.

I'm above average in shooting nearly every shooting sport. A legend in my own mind.

...but aren't we ALL above average drivers as well?

Oh, I wasn’t adding myself in the group. My nickname is Grasshopper! You’re right about balance. It’s a daily struggle between having confidence and being the “know it all”. I try to only speak when asked and then, only on subjects I have personal experience with. Just don’t ask me about women! I still don’t have a full understanding of that subject!

 

[spitfire_er]

I thought it was kinda sad after a family member got a new custom drop turret for his off the shelf A-Bolt with factory ammo, and suddenly he was a 5-600 yard shooter. For hunting mind you. I've spent over 10 years, building, improving, shooting, competitive shooting, and re-loading. With my custom rifles even though they are more capable than most off the shelf rifles, I have a hard time feeling good about a 5-600 yard shot on an elk.

On a side note, I am still working to make my custom 6br shoot tight little groups.

 

[linekin]

In an earlier post I mentioned my son-in-law's buddy wanted me to check his rifle after having missed a nice buck last year. Didn't touch paper at 100, at 50, & was 5"low & 3" to the left at 25.
I knew I was correct about him not sighting it in after it was boresighted when he gave me the box he was using last year. 3 bullets were missing!
I got him fixed up yesterday & had him show me he could actually hit the target too. He did.
Its his job now to overcome the "Buck Fever". Makes me wonder how far away from that deer the bullet actually was!

Keith

 

[riflewoman]

I’ll bet in the grand old days, most of the missed deer attributed to “buck fever” were actually from rifles that weren’t sighted in at all. People haven’t changed much and I remember every year reading Jack O’Connor and all of the gun writers pleading with the public to go sight their rifles in.

 

[muleman69]

I’ll bet in the grand old days, most of the missed deer attributed to “buck fever” were actually from rifles that weren’t sighted in at all. People haven’t changed much and I remember every year reading Jack O’Connor and all of the gun writers pleading with the public to go sight their rifles in.

Buck fever can be a factor ,most people have had it and the others are not telling us the truth.....lol

 

[swd]

I think most deer back in the ol days and now are missed by hack hunters who just can't shoot. Just go to a public range and see all the targets, I mean paper plates, set up at 25 yards that don't even have a shot that would be in the kill zone even at that distance. They think shooting ability is something that some how just comes natural and doesn't need to be practiced.