Labradar

[whatsupdoc]

We found the Labradar was less accurate with 223 and more accurate with 308. It seems to have a hard time seeing smaller projectiles.

Curious as to how this was determined?
What device was used to check the labradar?

 

[divingin]

I love mine but just tonight I was getting pretty erratic readings in the cold with it. Probably the battery going dead maybe?

mother than that they’re worth every penny.

I had mine refusing to go into armed mode. It was a balky connection to my battery bank (pretty sure it wasn't the cable, as that worked after reconnection.) I've never gotten weird readings due to low battery (though also haven't gone into a low battery condition very often.) I am a little leery of the Micro-USB connector - those things seem pretty flimsy to me.

For me, the lack of having to go out front to set the thing up is worth it. Set up rifle, plop the LR and tripod just in front of the bench, line it up, and shoot. If pistol, drop it on the bench, point it at target, set height, and go to town.

I bought an inertial trigger, despite not having a real reason to do so. I can say that, since getting the trigger, the only time the LR triggered when I didn't fire was when I pulled the trigger off to show it to a buddy and put it back on (magnetically attached to the action.) Two shots where it couldn't track the bullet. Deleted those and got back to where I was.

If you plan on doing a lot of work with small, fast projectiles, the LR is not for you. Or it is, but you'll need another unit as well.

 

[Charlie-NY]

The benches on 'my' range are far also enough apart too to avoid my neighbours tripping my Labradar too with most rifles. However, have someone with a muzzle brake equipped rifle take up an adjacent bench and one of his or her shots in three will falsely trigger the machine. This also applies to some short-barrel conventional sporting rifles chambered for magnum cartridges or even a hot 243 Win load.

If I understand your post correctly; you're saying that using the inertia trigger prevents the LabRadar from triggering off the blast of another rifle.

My understanding is that the use of the inertia trigger does not interfere with the normal blast sensor triggering mechanism. I'm told that if you plug in the inertia trigger but leave the devise sitting on the bench the LabRadar will still register the shot if the unit is set up properly.

I'm a relatively new user of the LabRadar and may not have a full grasp of its workings but my understanding of using the inertia trigger is as above. I observed another shooter who simply wrapped the wire from his inertia trigger around the scope (letting the sensor hang) and it appeared to work well but I can't be sure what actually triggered the radar.

 

[Laurie]

If I understand your post correctly; you're saying that using the inertia trigger prevents the LabRadar from triggering off the blast of another rifle.

My understanding is that the use of the inertia trigger does not interfere with the normal blast sensor triggering mechanism. I'm told that if you plug in the inertia trigger but leave the devise sitting on the bench the LabRadar will still register the shot if the unit is set up properly.

I've always assumed that's the case as the Labradar manual says in its Settings section for 'Trigger Source':

"Select the source of the event triggering the measurement. The user can select from the following:
• Trigger : Use the internal microphones built in the product’s enclosure or an external Trigger device."

The word 'or' has always made me assume it works on one or the other, but you may be correct and it works on both together. Even there, comments on the UK available device, the RAT (Recoil Activation Trigger) say that the trigger sensitivity value can be turned well down and still work reliably. That would cut out most or all false triggering from adjacent shooters. Most comment on forums about the RAT or JKL are for the other problem, one that after a bit of initial experimentation, I've not suffered from - failure for the muzzle blast / noise to trigger the device.

I've considered buying an inertia trigger, but so far don't really need it. If someone starts to set up on the next bench and takes a braked rifle out, I politely ask him to move to another bench and explain why.

 

[Redrocket]

Totally worth it ... haven't opened the case for my MagnetoSpeed since it arrived. Make sure you get the Recoil Trigger ... it's a "must have" accessory.

Labradar Trigger Gen 2

This is the gen two trigger for the LabRadar chronograph. It will work on anything from a 22LR to a big bore rifles. The trigger works great with suppressors and crowded ranges. The new, removable …

jklprecision.com

Ditto on the recoil trigger. Sometimes you can't the unit where you need it depending on your bench set. That and recoil trigger is great. Best to velcro it on or rubber band it.

 

[Ned Ludd]

Curious as to how this was determined?
What device was used to check the labradar?

I have also noticed the LabRadar seems to struggle a bit more with .224" bullets. I'm not sure for the results I've obtained the term I would use to describe it would necessarily be "less accurate". What I have noticed is that the aim of the LabRadar has to be absolutely perfect when measuring velocity iof .224" bullets. Otherwise, it may fail to read bullet velocity at the farthest distance setting (or two) with 90 VLDs. I don't actually know what sort of "error" this introduces into the final velocity output, if any. Nonetheless, it's problematic if you're trying to estimate BCs for .224" bullets from velocity decrease data, as I often do for comparative purposes. The validity of such estimates is already compromised to a certain degree because you're using velocity drop data from such a short distance (i.e. < 100 yd). So you really don't want the chronograph failing to pick up the farthest distance or two. I pay special attention when aiming the LabRadar at the targets for .224" bullets, and it seems to help with this issue. The unit is clearly less sensitive to how it is aimed with larger .30 cal projectiles.

When I first obtained the LabRadar, I checked it a couple times simultaneously using a MagnetoSpeed chronograph. There was a small but noticeable difference between the two velocity outputs, about 5-6 fps or so. However, the velocity trends from shot-to-shot were identical with both chronographs. For that reason, I can't tell you which of the units provided the more "accurate" velocity measurement. Frankly, because the differences in the two outputs were so small (i.e. less than the typical SD for 5 shots), I don't worry about it. I use the LabRadar data and don't become overly concerned whether it may be off by just a few fps. Predicted drops using estimated BCs and velocity data from the LabRadar are quite good and are well within the expected limitations of such measurements.

After years of using a MagnetoSpeed, I have now become accustomed to using the LabRadar. As others have mentioned, I purchased the JKL Kinetic Trigger, and made my own magnetic mount, which has made a huge difference in the ease of use of the unit. It rarely ever "drops" a reading, and adjacent shooters muzzle reports no longer interfere with my measurements. How critical the JKL Kinetic Trigger may be with the use of the LabRadar will likely depend on how busy your range typically is, and how close you are positioned to adjacent shooters. The primary benefits of the LabRadar are its ease of use, and the fact that it doesn't attach to the barrel, potentially affecting barrel harmonics.

 

[jaytee]

I have also noticed the LabRadar seems to struggle a bit more with .224" bullets. I'm not sure for the results I've obtained the term I would use to describe it would necessarily be "less accurate". What I have noticed is that the aim of the LabRadar has to be absolutely perfect when measuring velocity iof .224" bullets. Otherwise, it may fail to read bullet velocity at the farthest distance setting (or two) with 90 VLDs. I don't actually know what sort of "error" this introduces into the final velocity output, if any. Nonetheless, it's problematic if you're trying to estimate BCs for .224" bullets from velocity decrease data, as I often do for comparative purposes. The validity of such estimates is already compromised to a certain degree because you're using velocity drop data from such a short distance (i.e. < 100 yd). So you really don't want the chronograph failing to pick up the farthest distance or two. I pay special attention when aiming the LabRadar at the targets for .224" bullets, and it seems to help with this issue. The unit is clearly less sensitive to how it is aimed with larger .30 cal projectiles.

When I first obtained the LabRadar, I checked it a couple times simultaneously using a MagnetoSpeed chronograph. There was a small but noticeable difference between the two velocity outputs, about 5-6 fps or so. However, the velocity trends from shot-to-shot were identical with both chronographs. For that reason, I can't tell you which of the units provided the more "accurate" velocity measurement. Frankly, because the differences in the two outputs were so small (i.e. less than the typical SD for 5 shots), I don't worry about it. I use the LabRadar data and don't become overly concerned whether it may be off by just a few fps. Predicted drops using estimated BCs and velocity data from the LabRadar are quite good and are well within the expected limitations of such measurements.

After years of using a MagnetoSpeed, I have now become accustomed to using the LabRadar. As others have mentioned, I purchased the JKL Kinetic Trigger, and made my own magnetic mount, which has made a huge difference in the ease of use of the unit. It rarely ever "drops" a reading, and adjacent shooters muzzle reports no longer interfere with my measurements. How critical the JKL Kinetic Trigger may be with the use of the LabRadar will likely depend on how busy your range typically is, and how close you are positioned to adjacent shooters. The primary benefits of the LabRadar are its ease of use, and the fact that it doesn't attach to the barrel, potentially affecting barrel harmonics.

Well I don't have to worry about other shooters at the range because I shoot at my own range on my farm. Like I had stated very early on in the thread, my biggest concern is the 3900 fps limit since I'm shooting a lot of Swift stuff right now and the vast majority of my shooting will be done with 22 centerfires but the Swift is the only one that might be reaching the outer limits of the Labs capabilities. And in all seriousness, I'm not sure how many loads I'll ever have worked up that are 3900 or faster but I'll be pretty close on several of them I'm sure and I'm just not sure if I want to take the chance that it works or if I'll always second guess its accuracy, if that would even be an issue at the upper limits. Maybe its an all or nothing sort of deal, IF it captures it then it will be accurate. Dunno. Guess I'll have to give this some more thought or maybe consider an Oehler 35 or something similar.

 

[Charlie-NY]

I've always assumed that's the case as the Labradar manual says in its Settings section for 'Trigger Source':

"Select the source of the event triggering the measurement. The user can select from the following:
• Trigger : Use the internal microphones built in the product’s enclosure or an external Trigger device."

The word 'or' has always made me assume it works on one or the other, but you may be correct and it works on both together. Even there, comments on the UK available device, the RAT (Recoil Activation Trigger) say that the trigger sensitivity value can be turned well down and still work reliably. That would cut out most or all false triggering from adjacent shooters. Most comment on forums about the RAT or JKL are for the other problem, one that after a bit of initial experimentation, I've not suffered from - failure for the muzzle blast / noise to trigger the device.

I've considered buying an inertia trigger, but so far don't really need it. If someone starts to set up on the next bench and takes a braked rifle out, I politely ask him to move to another bench and explain why.

All good information - thanks.

 

[JimSC]

one thing that I have noticed now that I pay more attention to velocity numbers is how much a couple of feet difference of where my chono is set up matters in the velocity. If I were to switch to the LR and if I was all that concerned about getting exact FPS the first thing I would do is make a jig to ensure that the angle of the LR to the rifle was exactly the same each session. That and make a wind proof/vibration proof mount for it

Honestly though I am a lot more concerned about my lack of wind reading skills than any inaccuracies of my chronograph

 

[Papa Charlie]

one thing that I have noticed now that I pay more attention to velocity numbers is how much a couple of feet difference of where my chono is set up matters in the velocity. If I were to switch to the LR and if I was all that concerned about getting exact FPS the first thing I would do is make a jig to ensure that the angle of the LR to the rifle was exactly the same each session. That and make a wind proof/vibration proof mount for it

Honestly though I am a lot more concerned about my lack of wind reading skills than any inaccuracies of my chronograph

I have not seen any impact on the reading for the LR with regards to minor differences in the position or angle of the LR and in most cases you will be within inches as most benches or how you set up prone will determine that. One of the big differences from traditional chronographs. You set the distance from the LR that you want to take the measurement of the round in the programing.

I have the Mag Sport chronograph and haven't used it since purchasing the LR. Don't even know why I keep it.

 

[eschafer]

I had trouble picking up 140 grain Fed Trophy Bonded Tip bullets with my Labradar.. These bullets are very shiny (polished nickel finish) and have an engraved like stamp on the base of each bullet.. My guess is this engraving and the shininess of the bullet creates a distorted reflection back to the Labradar.. Merely colouring the base of the bullets black with a Sharpie seemed to help somewhat... The RAT recoil trigger helped with missed recordings too... Now have no issues that are not my own fault.. Love my Labradar...

 

[JimSC]

I have not seen any impact on the reading for the LR with regards to minor differences in the position or angle of the LR and in most cases you will be within inches as most benches or how you set up prone will determine that. One of the big differences from traditional chronographs. You set the distance from the LR that you want to take the measurement of the round in the programing.

I have the Mag Sport chronograph and haven't used it since purchasing the LR. Don't even know why I keep it.

For those here that worry about such things here is a good read by a member of the US Rifle Team on the importance of consistency in the setting up of the LR. A few inches can make a difference of several feet of where the LR starts tracking the bullet and several feet equals several FPS

Ray's New Labradar — US Rifle Team

Like many people, I instantly wanted a Labradar the very moment that I saw the first mention of its possible existence. Even though my CED chronograph had fallen into disuse, I really wanted this new thing. I put my order in and waited. The day before Thanksgiving, mine finally arrived.

www.usrifleteam.com

a quote from the article

The first time I took it out, I had it set up 12-15” from the barrel and it did not start tracking my bullets until about 20 yards down range and stopped reading at about 70 yards. Now I try to set the unit up within about 4” of the barrel and somewhat behind the muzzle. With that setup, the unit will start tracking my shots about 6-7 yards down range. The folks at Labradar tell me that it is possible to begin tracking even closer. I have positioned the rifle within an inch of the unit and six yards seems to be the closest reading I can muster.

As I said getting exact FPS is the least of my worries, I am not designing a new bullet, I just want to get a value to use to get on paper at long range. As long as I am on paper the groups will tell me all I need to know about whether the load is good or bad

 

[Laurie]

As I said getting exact FPS is the least of my worries, I am not designing a new bullet, I just want to get a value to use to get on paper at long range. As long as I am on paper the groups will tell me all I need to know about whether the load is good or bad

Yes, same here.

We on the other side of the Atlantic are more likely to have Labradar tracking problems as we're not allowed the US radar power and our devices are permanently fixed on the low-power setting. Even so, I'm delighted with mine which was a very early import to the UK some four or five years ago.

 

[divingin]

If I understand your post correctly; you're saying that using the inertia trigger prevents the LabRadar from triggering off the blast of another rifle.

My understanding is that the use of the inertia trigger does not interfere with the normal blast sensor triggering mechanism. I'm told that if you plug in the inertia trigger but leave the devise sitting on the bench the LabRadar will still register the shot if the unit is set up properly.

I'm a relatively new user of the LabRadar and may not have a full grasp of its workings but my understanding of using the inertia trigger is as above. I observed another shooter who simply wrapped the wire from his inertia trigger around the scope (letting the sensor hang) and it appeared to work well but I can't be sure what actually triggered the radar.

Hmmm. It was my impression that plugging something in to the trigger jack on the unit disabled the blast-trigger. I can verify that this weekend (3-12, 13.)

 

[Fire4Effect]

Well I just checked out their website and damn, it kinda sucks that it stops at 3900 fps. I'm working up loads for my 220 Swift and not sure this is gonna work.

Mine can measure to 9,200 fps.

 

[6BRA]

What shoots 9200 fps

 

[rijndael]

What shoots 9200 fps

It's an error.

 

[Charlie-NY]

Mine can measure to 9,200 fps.

Yeah, but look at the velocity drop-off in the first 20 yards !! Looks like my 45-70 with 600gr bullets.

 

[jaytee]

Wonder why the limitation of 3900 fps? Is that a shortcoming of Doppler or is it something that has been predetermined by software limitations or something else?

 

[divingin]

Mine can measure to 9,200 fps.

Did you buy the Navy's discontinued Rail Gun project?