Jan 2023 NRA Highpower RuleBook

[ljmontano]

The original rules were written years back things have changed in technology from the barrels,bullets,stocks,scopes. Maybe it’s time up date the rules. I don’t think a roller or a sand bag or a piece of felt is going to determine the match winner. It’s going to come to having a good shooting rifle, load development and the skills of reading the conditions. Yes there should be some limits within reason but like everything else technology has changed. If the new rules were in place in January of this year there should have been a crap load of shooter removed from the line at the SWN including myself. Of all the top shooters at the SWN in F Open no matter what rest they used I don’t think the results would be any different, it boiled down to their individual skills.

 

[Big_Daddy]

I am NO expert, by any stretch of the imagination in Highpower competition however a few of the matches that I have attended, at times, given all of the fancy $2000 front rests and other employed equipment, make it appear to be more of a reloading contest. Maybe there is nothing wrong with that.

As the President of a Club that shoots Highpower matches, I am concerned with rule changes that now eliminate or severely limit expensive equipment that has been previously purchased and allowed for years.

Does a fancy rest automatically make you a great shooter? I am living proof that it DOES NOT...LOL

Just my $.02 worth and it probably isn't even worth that much...

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Serious question...
What is the realistic moa of groups size to win a f-open match? Average winning group size in moa?

 

[memilanuk]

Serious question...
What is the realistic moa of groups size to win a f-open match? Average winning group size in moa?

200-20X

 

[Acyr]

@gunsandgunsmithing In F Class we tend to think in terms of 20 shot string performance versus an absolute group size. We have to consider that it may take 20 plus minutes to fire all 20 record shots with at least 7 seconds between shots. A killer 5 shot group at 100-200 yards doesn't usually guaranty a great group over the course of a 30-minute 20 shot string. Of course, a tight shooting gun will help your cause, but it won't prevent leaking shots out the side if you can't read the wind.

 

[Rset]

200-20X

And.....Exactly how many matches are you aware of that achieve that standard beyond a single string of fire?

 

[Rset]

The X ring is 1/2 MOA, and the 10 ring 1 MOA at all ranges. X's are 10 pts but counted separately for tie breakers, match records, etc.
200-20X would be 20 X's for 20 record shots. At 1000yds, you put 20 shots into a 5 inch ring.
Erik's winning score at SWN Long Range was 795-38X out of 800-80X.

Has there ever been a perfect X match recorded in sanctioned competition?
I don't care what previously legal equipment you have been using.

 

[memilanuk]

Depends on the distance, and the range (facility). Mid-range, plenty. Long range... conditions play a pretty big factor. Still a lot of cleans with high X counts.

 

[memilanuk]

Has there ever been a perfect X match recorded in sanctioned competition?
I don't care what previously legal equipment you have been using.

National record is 200-22X, so yes.

 

[Rset]

National record is 200-22X, so yes.

Single string. Not a match.

 

[Zilla]

The X ring is 1/2 MOA, and the 10 ring 1 MOA at all ranges. X's are 10 pts but counted separately for tie breakers, match records, etc.
200-20X would be 20 X's for 20 record shots. At 1000yds, you put 20 shots into a 5 inch ring.
Erik's winning score at SWN Long Range was 795-38X out of 800-80X.

Art, the winning score at SWN was 1241-60X out of 1250-125X. You forgot the Palma score.

 

[memilanuk]

Single string. Not a match.

Depending on the way the match bulletin is set up, each individual 'string' actually *can* be a match. But I get what you're saying. No, I'm not aware of any 600-60X match scores in Registered events. Again, some mid-range scores that have pretty damn close.

 

[Rset]

Depending on the way the match bulletin is set up, each individual 'string' actually *can* be a match. But I get what you're saying. No, I'm not aware of any 600-60X match scores in Registered events. Again, some mid-range scores that have pretty damn close.

I have personally posted a 600 52X in a non sanctioned mid range match, so high scores and x count are not the issue. My point is that the equipment has not exceeded the limits of the shooter. If it ever does, my suggestion would be to reduce the target area, not the precision equipment it takes to get there.
We don't need return to battery devices, etc. to get there, but within the old F-Class rules, we were dialing in on precision.

 

[Big_Daddy]

I personally watched one of our range members shoot a 350-34x shooting prone using an f-class bipod.
He was doing "load development" for his .223 at 500 yards.
He was firing quickly and had a 340-34x going until a "10" ring on his 35th round.
I think that would be my permanent load...LOL

 

[10XSHOOTER]

I now shoot Small Bore F-Class. have built a .308 to shoot midrange F-TR. I can no longer shoot HP_XC do to a shoulder injury. I shot my way to Master with a Navy M-14!
My opinion for F- Class. front rest or bipod OK. But, PUT IT IN YOUR SHOULDER! No rear Bags of any kind!
If we as Americans go to Canada to shoot. Play by their rules. If the Canadians want to come shoot in the US. they play by our rules. Alvin York may have rested his rifle on a log. But, it was still in his shoulder!

 

[rardoin]

Has there ever been a perfect X match recorded in sanctioned competition?
I don't care what previously legal equipment you have been using.

600yd National 3x20 F-open record is 600-54X (Shawn Broussard, 10/2/21, La. State MR Champs, Palo Alto)

That translates to 54/60 shots touching a 3" x ring over several hours time span of competition and shooting in constantly differing conditions. Seb NEO rest.

 

[sapper299]

Guys i just through most of the opinions they all make some sense in one way or another but i have to remind you folks that the f class was done to be a form of high power shooting. I think we are getting away from that. I believe that we have to be careful as to not get to far from that. we need to have a sport that requires a bit of shooting skills not just an ability to build a machine rest that we put onthe ground Lets rember that it is a shooting game.

Whatever happened to F Class is not prone bench rest? Not having been to a match in about 4 years, I now see some of the new rest designs seem way out of line with what the game was intended to be. I get it that someone is always looking for an advantage, to improve or better their scores, but F Class should not be an equipment race, it should be about bettering your marksmanship skills, not the design of a better mousetrap.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

I shoot a game where the gun and setup must be capable of teen aggs to be truly competitive. With that criteria, I don't believe that rollers or sandbag rules are the difference unless something about the setup is problematic. Does anybody believe this new rule is gonna give/take a competitive edge to or from someone? I've tested all 3 raptor tops and I think not, fwiw. So, what's the point of another rule against something that doesn't give any significant edge? I can see it if it actually made a person's setup significantly better than the field but it does not...ime. Yes, we need some rules in any game but I think one question should be asked by all whenever a new rule is proposed. That being, does it serve a real and practical purpose or is it just another restrictive move than makes it more expensive and difficult to participate. There are consequences to every rule. They are not harmless.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Whatever happened to F Class is not prone bench rest? Not having been to a match in about 4 years, I now see some of the new rest designs seem way out of line with what the game was intended to be. I get it that someone is always looking for an advantage, to improve or better their scores, but F Class should not be an equipment race, it should be about bettering your marksmanship skills, not the design of a better mousetrap.

What does this specific rule do to fix that? Denim sandbags might be a change but is that what competitors want and does it help the game?

 

[davidjoe]

Whatever happened to F Class is not prone bench rest? Not having been to a match in about 4 years, I now see some of the new rest designs seem way out of line with what the game was intended to be. I get it that someone is always looking for an advantage, to improve or better their scores, but F Class should not be an equipment race, it should be about bettering your marksmanship skills, not the design of a better mousetrap.

JMO but that was a tagline included in the rules because early Fclass shooters had been High Power shooters, knew how challenging that really was, and between it and benchrest, wanted to identify much more closely with High Power. If we are being honest, completely transparent to the core, we all know in F-Class that we are benchrest on the ground. We don’t hold up the gun whatsoever, let alone steadily. Most of us today never shot actual sling High Power. Guys that have never tried it, really can’t opine as to how close it is to F-Class. Lay down prone and hold that rifle out there watching the 4x scope bounce all over the place, while you get hot, take the scope off and see what it looks like. Guys that started F-Class but mainly shot high power, I understand sentimentality, but this isn’t a form high power. Heck, high power also involves standing on your two hind legs shooting, kneeling and sitting.

This is benchrest for ranges that can’t have benches. It doesn’t sound so physically involved cast that way, but that’s what it is, flattering or not. It’s incredibly challenging and competitive “mentally” like benchrest, and rewards the eye for subtleties and detail and preparation, but we are being clingers when wanting to attach to high power.