Investing in the firearms industry

[louielouie]

Now that I can roll my 401K into an IRA, what firearm-related companies or publicly-traded commodities can I look into investing my money in? Freedom Group, ATK, etc.
As we know, Obama has been instrumental in fabulous growth of the firearms industry and I'd like to invest in somthing that I believe in.

 

[GSRswapandslow]

i think the bubble seen after the scare is just about done....if not going to pop. Look at the AR industry...so flooded with different manufacturer's and products that prices have plummeted to the point that Walmart won't even bother carrying them due to more supply than demand.

Biotech, technololgy, medical is where a lot of money is...and although the past few months have been tough...it's done ok in the longer term game.

 

[Terry]

SWHC and RGR. These should be traded. Very volatile.

 

[Berger.Fan222]

If I recall correctly, ATK has split off their military businesses from their sporting businesses (including firearms). http://www.startribune.com/alliant-techsystems-to-split-in-two-sporting-ammo-and-defense/257162051/ Earlier this year, the sporting company became Vista Outdoor. http://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2015/2/10/atks-sporting-group-becomes-vista-outdoor-inc/ It is not clear to me which company has the small arms contracts with the DoD (Lake City arsenal, etc.) The managment competence is not yet clear.

Freedom Group has made a number of bone headed moves, but it was hard not to have huge sales in the current climate. They need to get manufacturing costs down, improve quality, and better shield themselves from liability to be a solid long term investment.

I've made a lot of money in Ruger, which is a well managed company. The stock price is a bit over valued now.

 

[wyoming .260]

Now that I can roll my 401K into an IRA, what firearm-related companies or publicly-traded commodities can I look into investing my money in? Freedom Group, ATK, etc.
As we know, Obama has been instrumental in fabulous growth of the firearms industry and I'd like to invest in somthing that I believe in.

When ATK split the Vista outdoors ( vsto ) is the company with the ammo and government ammo contracts ( Federal, Speer, CCI , Alliant, Weaver, Bushnell, Outers, Lake City and others) , ATK has the missile , rocket, aero-space industry stuff.

 

[rayjay]

Eley or Lapua ???? [tongue in cheek ]

 

[Catfur]

Now that I can roll my 401K into an IRA, what firearm-related companies or publicly-traded commodities can I look into investing my money in? Freedom Group, ATK, etc.
As we know, Obama has been instrumental in fabulous growth of the firearms industry and I'd like to invest in somthing that I believe in.

When ATK split the Vista outdoors ( vsto ) is the company with the ammo and government ammo contracts ( Federal, Speer, CCI , Alliant, Weaver, Bushnell, Outers, Lake City and others) , ATK has the missile , rocket, aero-space industry stuff.

And, as an idea of where he thinks the profit lies (or at the very least, which business he prefers), the President of ATK prior to the Orbital-ATK/Vista Outdoors split went with Vista Outdoors, not the defense conglomerate.

 

[jonbearman]

Our economy is based on credit so that bubble is about to break or at least cause panic here so I would buy some gold and silver in case the bubble pops. I am not saying to go out and buy 100,000.00 worth of gold but just enough in case of a crisis to fall back on.

 

[GSRswapandslow]

Our economy is based on credit so that bubble is about to break or at least cause panic here so I would buy some gold and silver in case the bubble pops. I am not saying to go out and buy 100,000.00 worth of gold but just enough in case of a crisis to fall back on.

why would you buy precious metals? We're not a gold backed economy anymore..and I feel like gold will continue to plummet. It has been on a steady downturn since late 2011...and I doubt it makes a big comeback, ever. I do, though, think silver will rise in the new 15-20 years.

 

[mjtripper]

lead futures?

 

[louielouie]

I looked ATK and it seems to have growth potential but after looking at Ruger, S&W, etc. and reading this article, this may be a more volatile market than I imagined - too volatile for me to risk my retirement with.
You'd think ammunition would be a safer bet considering the gun sales in the last few years and maybe that's why ATK (Lake City Arsenal?) seems to be steadier.

 

[hogpatrol]

IMHO, the easy money's been made in SWHC and RGR. SWHC was around two bucks when Obama was first elected. It's hovering around 17 now. Here's the chart:

https://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=SWHC+Interactive#symbol=SWHC;range=my

Same with Ruger RGR, went from 6 to 75 and then has backed off to around 50.

https://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=RGR+Interactive#symbol=RGR;range=my

Agree with a previous post, these are both trading stocks. I would keep a keen eye on which way the political winds are blowing. If the next POTUS is another Democrat, it may be time to nibble on these two stocks.

On another note, the bottom has dropped out of the AR market but handguns are still in demand.

 

[SHootSTraight22]

Our economy is based on credit so that bubble is about to break or at least cause panic here so I would buy some gold and silver in case the bubble pops. I am not saying to go out and buy 100,000.00 worth of gold but just enough in case of a crisis to fall back on.

why would you buy precious metals? We're not a gold backed economy anymore..and I feel like gold will continue to plummet. It has been on a steady downturn since late 2011...and I doubt it makes a big comeback, ever. I do, though, think silver will rise in the new 15-20 years.

Because the BRICKS nations will soon annouce a gold backed currency.. All the silver and gold is moving east at this moment preparing for the future.. Plus everyone's getting ready for our economy "petrol dollar" to collapse, that's why everyone is asking for their gold back or out of storage in New York.. They don't trust the US to hold it with what's to come.. Even Texas announced building a bullion depository there and publicly asked for their gold back as well... I could go on and on.. Silver and Gold and sit back and wait.. Don't expect to play in the casino Wall Street anymore without loss... Those that had 10-20% of their net worth in gold during the Great Depression made it out richer.. Joe Kennedy is one example... History and trends will lead you in the right direction.. Study history and where this country is moving and you will be safe..

 

[SHootSTraight22]

Now, something smart at the moment would be for researching the defense industry stocks to invest into whatever may go up the highest percent during times of war.. In this case get in on the bottom now and get out during the coming World War 3... With the Special Forces troops now publicly deployed in Syria you can bet the "house" their going to be used as the "sacrificial lamb" for Obama and the media to call on the American people to back them in war against Russia... These troops will be bombed/killed on purpose by a Russian jet and Obama/media will try to make the American public rally against Russia and call for war... World War 3!!! Guys in JSOC are talking about this senerio right now and they know their being set up for kill... So guys when this happens don't look at Russia as the evil one because it's us... Now for "war profittering" invest in whatever company that may provide something specific that both sides of the war may need... Like Ford did in World War 2 providing the Nazis with things..

 

[Macropod]

Our economy is based on credit so that bubble is about to break or at least cause panic here so I would buy some gold and silver in case the bubble pops. I am not saying to go out and buy 100,000.00 worth of gold but just enough in case of a crisis to fall back on.

why would you buy precious metals? We're not a gold backed economy anymore..and I feel like gold will continue to plummet. It has been on a steady downturn since late 2011...and I doubt it makes a big comeback, ever. I do, though, think silver will rise in the new 15-20 years.

Because the BRICKS nations will soon annouce a gold backed currency.. All the silver and gold is moving east at this moment preparing for the future.. Plus everyone's getting ready for our economy "petrol dollar" to collapse, that's why everyone is asking for their gold back or out of storage in New York.. They don't trust the US to hold it with what's to come.. Even Texas announced building a bullion depository there and publicly asked for their gold back as well... I could go on and on.. Silver and Gold and sit back and wait.. Don't expect to play in the casino Wall Street anymore without loss... Those that had 10-20% of their net worth in gold during the Great Depression made it out richer.. Joe Kennedy is one example... History and trends will lead you in the right direction.. Study history and where this country is moving and you will be safe..

It might pay to invest in BRICS nations then.... They are infrastructure driven and if they can't finance their own projects then they have cooperative arrangements.

Not hard to see why the British empire hates their guts.. It makes it harder to loot the crap out their economies. That's why the Brit's were given an ass-kicking in the US in the first place. History does tend to repeat...

Patriotically, I can understand why you want to invest in your own country.

 

[SHootSTraight22]

Macropod, I feel ya but this isn't our country anymore... It's been hajacked and taken over.. And, as long as fiat money is printed like toilet paper and high speed trading algorithoms /programs manipulate the system I wouldn't advice to invest like someone would 25yrs ago, but to have a certain strategy with gold/silver (physical not ETF's you don't own it unless you can touch it) being part of it... Gold and silver is for long term.. Just look at it as your savings account that when you need money to spend you would sell some... Knowing whats in the bank or safety deposit box is legally theirs and not mine during a bank "bail in" I wouldn't leave anything in a bank but would take note of the very wealthy right now buying cash at least... Keep that cash outside the bank in something that want legally claim it as part of the up coming "bail in.." Americans will lose their 401K's during these "bank bail in's" so that money needs to be put into a "self directed IRA" or other self directed retirement/investment program,, that will allow you to invest in physical gold/silver, guns/ammo,food/water, things that will go up plus aid your family in the near future... Research...... "The whole proposed "net neutrality" will sensor the internet before long and you want be able to read postings like this because this site will be off line...

 

[Macropod]

Agreed! When I tell people about the bail in process I often just get looks as if I was on an other planet. That precedent has already occurred in Cyprus. In Australia the legislation has been snuck in through the back door to enable bail in action to be taken by the banks. Our former Howard government sold off two thirds of our federal reserve gold stocks and managed to pee most of that up against the wall in bungled foreign exchange deals. The state government where I live did a similar thing with mining royalties. For a decade it was raining gold bars, but instead of putting it back into the state with major infrastructure projects, blew the lot in stupid investments resulting in the state being heavily in debt. No doubt some members of the state government profited handsomely along with foreign banks.
No doubt similar outcomes happened in the States. I feel your frustration... Gold may well be the safest investment provided it isn't kept in a bank. At least it is a tangible asset.

 

[hogan]

No such thing as "investing" anymore.
Old Whole Life insurance policies paying 4% guaranteed forever look like the smartest thing since toast...

A fool and his money etc, etc,

If you ain't looking for Return OF your money, you don't grasp the realities.

There is no "industry" here. Even the big names are all but shutdown during ShotShow; name me any decent operation that shuts down for a trade show...

Not many publicly held and traded gun companies these days. Savage really reinvented themselves, but who else? The money spigot for gun related gear is mostly close-held. Is Brownells public, MidWay? No...

There ain't a lot of money in the gun manufacturing end of it. Look how Cerebus has ruined every gun manufacturer it bought out... Cheapen the product to get another few bucks per product out the door.

Flash crash happens all too often, volatility works for the manipulator to fleece the "investors".
If you don't know who the chump at the poker table is, it's you!

No better way to lose money than to think there is still an investment mode you can park funds with and not worry. Consider the Genl Motors bondholders, defrauded because they were in the way of a Govt buy-out/in... Until the GM debacle, Bondholders ALWAYS were the superior and protected creditor of any corporation. NO Longer...

Gonna invest in guns? Get an FFL and buy/sell.

 

[Ohio Varmint Shooter]

I'm a CFP (Certified Financial Planner), a ChFC (Chartered Financial Consultant) and am considered a 'professional investor'.

It is really entertaining to read all the responses to the OP question. (the good, the bad, and the crazy)

If you want to invest in the firearms industry, what you need to do first is build a time machine. Go back to 2008 when Obama was first elected. THEN invest in every gun company. The firearms industry promoted the idea that Obama was going to stop/halt/regulate/slow gun sales...and spread the 'better buy your guns now before Obama stops gun sales'. People bought into the fear, and gun sales skyrocketed. Obama has been the best gun salesman ever!

But with the massive gun sales of the past 7 years, I would question buying into gun manufacturing firms now. They already had their time of glory. People can't keep up this pace of gun sales. Eventually, sales will taper off. Profits will fall..investors will loose money. Like buying beanie babies after everyone had one.

Now, for all those people who've bought guns over the past 7 years. What do they need? AMMO!!! A disposable product that cannot be reused and needs to be replenished! They have to keep buying it...over and over and over. So there's an idea!

But in general, people shouldn't invest in individual companies. They loose money. People don't diversify, they're emotional (both greed and fear), they make bad decisions. You should see the reports I've seen that show the investment returns of the average person....they're shockingly bad.

 

[hogpatrol]

I'm a CFP (Certified Financial Planner), a ChFC (Chartered Financial Consultant) and am considered a 'professional investor'.

It is really entertaining to read all the responses to the OP question. (the good, the bad, and the crazy)

If you want to invest in the firearms industry, what you need to do first is build a time machine. Go back to 2008 when Obama was first elected. THEN invest in every gun company. The firearms industry promoted the idea that Obama was going to stop/halt/regulate/slow gun sales...and spread the 'better buy your guns now before Obama stops gun sales'. People bought into the fear, and gun sales skyrocketed. Obama has been the best gun salesman ever!

But with the massive gun sales of the past 7 years, I would question buying into gun manufacturing firms now. They already had their time of glory. People can't keep up this pace of gun sales. Eventually, sales will taper off. Profits will fall..investors will loose money. Like buying beanie babies after everyone had one.

Now, for all those people who've bought guns over the past 7 years. What do they need? AMMO!!! A disposable product that cannot be reused and needs to be replenished! They have to keep buying it...over and over and over. So there's an idea!

But in general, people shouldn't invest in individual companies. They loose money. People don't diversify, they're emotional (both greed and fear), they make bad decisions. You should see the reports I've seen that show the investment returns of the average person....they're shockingly bad.

A light in a sea of darkness. I have to disagree on ammo though. Too much global competition and the AR frenzy at the gun clubs has tapered off. In a few years or the next recession, whichever comes first, that fad will fade and you'll be able to pick one up at a gun show or pawn shop for a couple hundred bucks. I remember the gun frenzies going back to the Kennedy assassination and the black panther movement. Same old story. Buy guns, buy gold, buy land, the country's going down the tubes. BTDT, it never happens. We just keep chugging along, making money, fighting wars, trading with other countries, making treaties, enduring stock market crashes, disease scares, yada yada yada. Remember when the market crashed in 1987? The Dow then was 2216, fell 508 points, 22.6 percent. END OF THE WORLD AS WE KNOW IT they said. A depression is nigh. Two years later it was back over it's previous high and except for a few blips is now at 17, 758. The naysayers, the doom and gloomers, the economists, the market gurus, the gold bugs, the survivalists were all WRONG. They ALWAYS are. Bottom line, invest your money in the market with good companies with a few growth stocks thrown in to diversify and you'll retire early while your doom and gloom buddies work until they drop dead all the while claiming there's only a few years left for the good old U.S. of A. :