Interesting conversation!

[MrMajestic]

I just bought a 24" 8tw Criterion Bull barrel for a new upper build using a DPMS Low Pro upper receiver. 80 grain Nosler CC loaded to 2.505" COL are just short of the lands with 2.513" being jam. Using Varget and BR-4's produced a .404 MOA 5 shot group at 100 yards and I will load more looking for consistency and velocity. I noticed that Fulton Armory offered the same tube in 12tw so I called to see if they had the reamer print hoping there would be less freebore for Mag length loaded lighter bullets. I was first told not to use reloads as it was not safe! I tried to assure him that I kinda knew what I was doing and asked again about the freebore. He told me that I would have to measure it with a Stoney Point. I don't have the barrel to do this and wanted to know before the purchase! He finally said it was the same reamer as the 8tw but the freebore can change due to the barrel extension! He then said they won't give out that information, which I still don't think he knew what I wanted, and went back to the reloading and said it's not the powder but the headspace I should be worried about. I once again assured him that I measure it with a Larry Willis gage, probably didn't know what that was, and adjust my dies accordingly. I thanked him for his assistance and hung up. Whew, at least the barrel seems to be a "Keeper"!

 

[jonbearman]

Most places don't have anyone to answer tech questions worth a darn with the exception of a few out there that actually know what they are talking about.

 

[Greyman]

sounds like the guy is a fountain of information, be sure to check back often.LOL

 

[flatlander]

Those guys at FA have a long history of .... well, my mother was always trying to get me to adhere to the principle of "If you can't say anything nice about someone, don't say anything at all". Suffice to say that I've never felt the need to go to them for anything shooting related.

 

[thefitter]

Had similar conversation with JGS about their chamber dimensions.

 

[IdahoSharpshooter]

IMHO; a lot of these companies are going to file for bankruptcy shortly. There are currently over 200 companies building/selling AR-15's, and I think half of them's last job was as a wallyworld greeter.

 

[butchlambert]

I've heard the term "bull barrel" used a lot. What does it really mean? Does it have horns? I also do not know what a Larry Willis gauge happens to be.

 

[carlsbad]

Amazing. I found a good deal on a fulton armory barrel in a faster twist and slapped it on my AR. Shoots sub 1/2 moa groups so I'm very happy with the barrel.

You can see a lot of those answers are designed for the newby AR fanboys...which appears to be their target market. Might be just chance that they chose a good barrel manufacturer.

--Jerry

 

[LarryDScott]

I've heard the term "bull barrel" used a lot. What does it really mean? Does it have horns? I also do not know what a Larry Willis gauge happens to be.

Butch, I think Remington actually used that term when they
first introduced their Varmint Barrel. LDS

 

[carlsbad]

Ruger uses it on their heavy barreled Mark III pistols. --Jerry

 

[jdh47]

When you call and talk to someone in a shop it could be anyone. Most people have their job to do and they know it well. You could have talked to just about anyone from the hand that drills, reams or sweeps the floor.

Remember the guy you talk with does not know you either. He will likely avoid saying anything that could get the company in trouble. In this day of incognito internet wizards it is easy to get trashed for just about anything. It is a loose- loose situation for the poor guy answering the phone. That's no bull.

Joe

 

[MrMajestic]

I also do not know what a Larry Willis gauge happens to be.

http://www.larrywillis.com/

 

[shoot4fun]

Some manufacturers use specs that are kept proprietary and then others have legal departments telling them not to provide the end-users with too much info. At one time one of the brands I worked for had all their twist rates posted in the spec sheets of their catalog. Then, not only did it disappear, they stopped even providing that info at all.
Lastly, and sadly, there are people who work in the industry who just don't know anything and their primary focus at customer service is issuing call-tags for warranty returns. When I first started working for (insert name here) we had the very best and most knowledgable CS people in the industry. They mostly had 30-40 years experience in all facets of building our guns and could diagnose 99% of issues over the phone. They treated customers with respect and held the company's reputation in highest regard. Most all have been replaced with temps or new-hires and the only training they have is how to answer the phone.

 

[hogpatrol]

I've heard the term "bull barrel" used a lot. What does it really mean? Does it have horns? I also do not know what a Larry Willis gauge happens to be.

With your purchase of said barrel, It means you get the fecal matter associated with it but not the bull and no extra charge.

 

[gotcha]

http://www.larrywillis.com/

Thanks Mr. Majestic ! ......... Like Butch, I didn't have a clue either. I get by with my humble Hornady gauge.

 

[SheepDog]

It used to be that a "bull" barrel had no taper from the chamber to the muzzle. That is no longer true in today's market place. Now if you wat a bull barrel you order a cylindrical barrel with a diameter of the breech, other wise you can end up with just about any heavy barrel taper that is called "bull". (and I call "bull" on that!)

 

[Ggmac]

The term Bull barrel was actually named after a guy , I can't remember the details , but either his nickname or last name was , you guessed it Bull .
Freeman R Bull of Springfield armory in the 1800 s .
His heavy barreled gun was used standing at long ranges . I think this was the first use , at least it's someting I read in one of the Springfield history books .

 

[M-61]

Few years ago I purchased a STAG (m16/AR-15). Trying to get into the 21st century I guess. Had a problem and called STAG. Once I mentioned 'reloads' he said they do not honor any warranty for their products which have used re-loaded ammo. Never made it to my problem at all.
The STAG (and AR's) and I parted company almost as fast as my conversation with them lasted.
Not meant to bash AR's but merely to relate a story. (Maybe it's the same with all of the manufacturers?) IT was a bull barrel.

 

[jwink]

I've heard the term "bull barrel" used a lot. What does it really mean? Does it have horns? I also do not know what a Larry Willis gauge happens to be.

Maybe it is referencing the dimensions of the bull's.... ah, never mind.

 

[243Mendoza]

Fulton has been warning against handloads at least since the 90's when I bought a M1A from them. I think it's their liability policy in case a customer damages one of their products because of slamfire or overload. It would be a more customer-friendly policy it they said that they will not make any recommendation for handloads.