inletting a used long range br stock with no mill

[AlNyhus]

It's too bad you didn't open up the I.D. of the pillars before knocking the bedding over them out.

 

[762plinker]

al...the bedding is directing the action. moving the holes just puts it all in a bind.
the bedding is sideways..and it is all there less the little at the pillars.
put the screws in it,pull tight..sideways
i see no way it is getting better???

 

[spike-55]

don't know what the bottom of the stock looks like??/ but like Al says you may have to way overbore the pillars or pull them out and remake, then get the action straight in the stock with new bedding, then you can re-center your pillars to match the action bedding. to cover the bottom holes (which now are likely off as well) if there are eschusions you will have to pull them out an remake them to match the new pillar centers. if there are none, easy button, just fill the previous hole and make eschusions to hide the damage??? wont be perfect but like you said - you are trying to salvage a well used stock and are likely going to have to paint it anyway??? JB Weld and Bondo will fix most anything in the South!!!! long as you have bailing wire and duct tape to hold it together!!!
stan

 

[AlNyhus]

al...the bedding is directing the action. moving the holes just puts it all in a bind.
the bedding is sideways..and it is all there less the little at the pillars.
put the screws in it,pull tight..sideways
i see no way it is getting better???

Respectfully, you're missing the point on the action screw inner dimension.

By your pictures, there are three areas...either individually or combined...that are likely candidates for the issue. A fourth is how/where the barrel was supported. -Al

 

[762plinker]

don't know what the bottom of the stock looks like??/ but like Al says you may have to way overbore the pillars or pull them out and remake, then get the action straight in the stock with new bedding, then you can re-center your pillars to match the action bedding. to cover the bottom holes (which now are likely off as well) if there are eschusions you will have to pull them out an remake them to match the new pillar centers. if there are none, easy button, just fill the previous hole and make eschusions to hide the damage??? wont be perfect but like you said - you are trying to salvage a well used stock and are likely going to have to paint it anyway??? JB Weld and Bondo will fix most anything in the South!!!! long as you have bailing wire and duct tape to hold it together!!!
stan

one last time.it aint the pillars. the action and bbl have been in and out of the stock lots of times while i was leveling and clearing the previous bedding...lots of care went into CENTERING and SQUARING the action screw holes in the stock prior to cutting the pillar holes. that is why i cut the bedding away from the pillars..and will remove more bedding without touching the pillars.

 

[762plinker]

Respectfully, you're missing the point on the action screw inner dimension.

By your pictures, there are three areas...either individually or combined...that are likely candidates for the issue. A fourth is how/where the barrel was supported. -Al

tell me more...but the bbl support from under only was used to set the pillar and bedding on the rear screw after confirming the forward pillar was square. tight hole means it cannot rock out of alignment

 

[AlNyhus]

tight hole means it cannot rock out of alignment

Nothing could be further from the truth.

 

[WillyTP]

Have you checked to see if the stock is straight?

 

[762plinker]

Have you checked to see if the stock is straight?

yes the stock is straight

 

[762plinker]

so yesterday and today i removed some of the new bedding. taking it just below the pillars.
the attached pic shows the bbd/action screwed to the stock, and the slip of paper shows the bbl is free floating..(and centered)
so yes the pillars are straight,aligned and level.
will do some more clean up and then rebed..maybe today

 

[762plinker]

i do often use the bbl, wrapped to center the action in the stock,
BUT this is a used abused stock. i do not have a nice clean half circle bbl channel
half circle at the recoil lug and at the fore stock end,,,but both have been painted and sanded.. not longer nice fresh guides for the bbl

 

[X Count]

there s not issue with the pillars and this is a USED ABUSED STOCK
there is no comparison to bedding a new rifle with a fitted stock and bbl'd action, to trying to salvage a used LONG RANGE benchrest stock to a new action and a new bbl

Doesn't matter if it's used and abused stock it's still the same concept.

Take used and abused stock, bog up / sand back / straighten in letting to get the action and barrel to FIT in the same way you would have to with a flat top. Yes there may be more work to prep the inlet than a new stock but the actual bedding process should be identical as your trying to achieve the same result.

Then follow the process of how the article describes bedding the pillars and action in one go. That is how you get "stress free" pillar bedding. If there is need to open us holes and modify the contact points of the bedding to straighten things out you have real problems.

FWIW on target guns where there is usually more clearance in the barrel channel I will wrap the barrel with tape at the forend and by the reinforce with sufficient thickness to centralise the barrel in the channel and set the correct height. From there you can put whiteness marks on the tape that align with the top of the forend at 4 points. During bedding just realign those marks to get the correct rotation.

 

[762plinker]

Doesn't matter if it's used and abused stock it's still the same concept.

Take used and abused stock, bog up / sand back / straighten in letting to get the action and barrel to FIT in the same way you would have to with a flat top. Yes there may be more work to prep the inlet than a new stock but the actual bedding process should be identical as your trying to achieve the same result.

Then follow the process of how the article describes bedding the pillars and action in one go. That is how you get "stress free" pillar bedding. If there is need to open us holes and modify the contact points of the bedding to straighten things out you have real problems.

FWIW on target guns where there is usually more clearance in the barrel channel I will wrap the barrel with tape at the forend and by the reinforce with sufficient thickness to centralise the barrel in the channel and set the correct height. From there you can put whiteness marks on the tape that align with the top of the forend at 4 points. During bedding just realign those marks to get the correct rotation.

you do not have a clue...please go away....you have not paid attention to what has been going on

 

[X Count]

If you knew what you were doing you would be here begging people to answer your questions.

The only mistake I've made is trying to offer assistance to someone that just wants to do the opposite of what everyone else is telling them.

Good luck with your project!

 

[762plinker]

so we have success. i have had the bbl'd action in and out of this stock multiple times, torqued in place and all was square. add the viscosity of bedding material and it goes sideways. i decided to block the bbl from moving side ways with fixed thickness shims based on gap of torqued in place action.
this morning i have excellent bedding and a straight bbl.
i have never seen this in all the stock i have done,,,,oh well move on.
clearence for the trigger and trigger hanger...wait for the correct action screws and finish the build.

 

[LVLAaron]

Credit to Al for this one. Makes alignment super easy.

Amazon.com

Drill your pillars out to 5/16 - insert these... put a 1/4-28 threaded rod into your action... and that will keep the action aligned while you're setting it up and things are drying.

 

[762plinker]

not in my case
yes but...i had my action TORQUED in place and all was fine...
my action screw holes were only a couple thou over the screws/and studs i use.
but it all moved when bedding was added...the thickness/viscosity what ever was enough to
force is sideways...never happened before ..and no i am not opening my 1/4 holes to 5/16..

 

[AlNyhus]

Amazon.com

Drill your pillars out to 5/16 - insert these... put a 1/4-28 threaded rod into your action... and that will keep the action aligned while you're setting it up and things are drying.

LVLAaron, those flanged sleeves get ahead of a lot of issues with bedding. They provide for perfect alignment to the pillars and the action screws end up centered perfectly in the pillar hole with .031 clearance around the action screws.

I do a fair amount of pillar bedding work...and correct 'problem child' jobs. Counting the Top 10 bedding problems on my fingers, inadequate action screw clearance comes early on the first hand.

Correcting a bedding job that's clearly stressed by adding additional stress to force it where we want it to go...rather than allowing it to naturally rest in a stress free position where it needs to go...will never allow the barrelled action to return to it's natural 'neutral' position after firing.

This basic tenent (returning to a natural neutral position) is what accuracy bedding is all about. Unfortunately, it's also the single most misunderstood piece of the basic concept of accuracy bedding.

Good shootin' -Al

 

[GenePoole]

It is for this reason that I always make my own pillars and escutcheons from 304 stainless.

 

[762plinker]

Nothing could be further from the truth.

then bigger holes mean it can rock further out of alignment...sorry physics and math gets in the way of your opinion.
as i stated with my pillars, my screws, my action//bbl, TORQUED IN PLACE the bbl was straight and level.
the shims used in the final bedding were to ensure no stress was imparted by the viscosity of the bedding material. strange in the end it came out straight....
each to their own..i am happy and done