Folks I am sorry but what is going on. No primers no powder? WTH. It doesn't stand up for this long Uncle slanders is pulling something here! I cannot feasibly imagine they cant manufacture with 3 shifts and keep up! Think about it???No bullets for reloading? I want to see shipping manifest, production reports, and selloff records. This does Not measure up write your representatives! Free country my rear end! I could understand a loaded ammo shortage perhaps, but in peace time no components makes no sense at all! The purge is over? for now Hey Uncle Slanders where are the components! This Has gotten way out of hand I don't swallow it and neither should any of us! Wake up America I want a full investigation!
I do Not bye the shortage any longer
- Thread starter Valar
- Start date
dragman
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Well, I can tell you this much I watched the gun shop owner call a distributor today and they had most primers and maybe 33%of the powder they wanted BUT THEY would only sell the dealer 3lbs of each powder and 5000 of each primer. prices are at a premium on all ends if they had it I am sure they would have sold it because I told the owner I was in for another 5000 BR2's 5000 CCI 250's and I wanted some 8lbs kegs and I didn't mind if the price was higher! 8lb kegs went from $154 out my way too $179 I told them while they were on the phone I would pay $200 or more if they could get it cuz I am hurting but NOTHING.
I can imagine that with all the taxing and rationing schemes being cooked up by the legislatures of some states (e.g. CA, MA, etc) that shooters in those states would reasonably be trying to buy up all they could.
Also, manufacture of ammunition and components is not something where you just hire another shift and double production. It's a precision process that takes skilled and experienced workers. (At least, any components I'd want to buy are.) Manufacturers know the bubble will burst and aren't going to hire another shift of workers, just to have to lay them all off as soon as they're trained.
Also, manufacture of ammunition and components is not something where you just hire another shift and double production. It's a precision process that takes skilled and experienced workers. (At least, any components I'd want to buy are.) Manufacturers know the bubble will burst and aren't going to hire another shift of workers, just to have to lay them all off as soon as they're trained.
dragman
Site $$ Sponsor
DRNewcomb said:
agree, why buy new machines and hire more workers when you know it's going to end before the machines that cost millions are paid for and while the workers still need jobs. for years these businesses have been finding the most efficient way to make money and that means running at close to 100%. so when over night the demand hits 1000% of what you build it's a long term problem.
timeout
Silver $$ Contributor
Valar said:
We have scandal after scandal, followed by congressional hearing after congressional hearing. Have you gleaned any information in all of this? You may as well forget about an investigation. There could be some truth to rigging an artificial shortage. It has worked well over the years in the petroleum industry and with products such as anti-freeze. If some of this is profit driven by the manufacturer, there is nothing you or I can do about it anyway. I more likely believe the problem to be hoarding and truthfully, I can't really blame anyone for that. I went into a shop and bought some primers that were not my first preference, but with things as they are, purchased them anyhow. So, I guess I'm part of the problem.
It has been harder to get components, but not impossible and I have purchased the products at normal prices. Sierra 223 Match bullets I managed to get after a bit of a wait and I did get my hands on Lapus brass on two separate orders. Natchez just informed me they have Lapua brass available.
Sierra bullets said they manufactured a quantity of bullets in the first quarter of 2013 that matched or exceeded what they made in all of 2012. People are buying this stuff...at a record rate. Every week, people like the rest of us, are lined up in front of Big Five Sporting Goods on "ammo day", the day when ammo is stocked. They are there well before the store is open. And gun shows? Good grief, the line is forever and people are spending.
Phil
Sierra bullets said they manufactured a quantity of bullets in the first quarter of 2013 that matched or exceeded what they made in all of 2012. People are buying this stuff...at a record rate. Every week, people like the rest of us, are lined up in front of Big Five Sporting Goods on "ammo day", the day when ammo is stocked. They are there well before the store is open. And gun shows? Good grief, the line is forever and people are spending.
Phil
jonbearman
I live in new york state,how unfortunate !
I have good luck with powder valley and even though it takes a couple weeks to get anything it is worth the wait.
Forum Boss
Administrator
Gentlemen,
Don't freak out. Spend a little time checking various sources. In recent weeks, through a bit of advanced planning (and dedication) we were able to find Varget and RL15 powder (albeit in 1-lb containers), Berger 105gr hybrids, Lapua brass (6mmBR, 6.5x47, .308), and even some large magnum primers. All this was purchased online, with a delay of one to four weeks, depending on product orders.
We have forum members who work at major ammo and reloading component plants. They say the plants are running full capacity (night and day). We have had a massive increase in consumer orders since the October election -- an order of magnitude for some items. While government orders are part of the equation, I don't think we need to start screaming "conspiracy!"....
Don't freak out. Spend a little time checking various sources. In recent weeks, through a bit of advanced planning (and dedication) we were able to find Varget and RL15 powder (albeit in 1-lb containers), Berger 105gr hybrids, Lapua brass (6mmBR, 6.5x47, .308), and even some large magnum primers. All this was purchased online, with a delay of one to four weeks, depending on product orders.
We have forum members who work at major ammo and reloading component plants. They say the plants are running full capacity (night and day). We have had a massive increase in consumer orders since the October election -- an order of magnitude for some items. While government orders are part of the equation, I don't think we need to start screaming "conspiracy!"....
I have a cabinet full of bullets I will never shoot. I don't know why it never dawned on me to sell/trade those to possibly help out another shooter.
If you guys have a bunch of components you're not going to use, this would be a good time to clean it all out. I'm going to start tonight.
If you guys have a bunch of components you're not going to use, this would be a good time to clean it all out. I'm going to start tonight.
Forum Boss said:
Gosh. The voice of reason on a gun forum. Who'd a thunk it.
In the last couple of months I bought 1000 20cal Bergers, 500 17cal Bergers, 3000 Fed 205m SR primers (off the shelf), 4lbs of Benchmark, 4lbs of AA2200, 4lbs of IMR4198, and 2lbs of 8208xbr...basically everything I needed for the year. I had to wait a bit on some of it.
It's been a pain, but it's happened before and it'll happen again. A couple months ago you couldn't buy Hostess Twinkies either unless you went on the internet and paid $20 a box. Now they have started making em again and soon they'll be $2.99 again.
Increasing demand = decreasing supplies = higher prices. Basic economics, not conspiracy.
I did this a while back with some 1ce fired military brass that was cluttering up my shop. Figured I'd never use it, so I polished it up and sold it (for about half what the gougers were asking). I gave about 20 lbs of brass to a nephew who reloads and have been helping out buddies who find themselves in short of some component.mattlewis said:
Awww. My brain says that when the demand side goes up and the production side stays the same, things happen. I cannot buy into a conspiracy of the manufacturers in all this. I mean they are in a business to sell stuff right? I might be pushed into DHS over purchasing ammo, but I can't imagine DHS using it on the populace. I retired from DHS/US Customs and most if not all of the employees I worked with despised the current administration. Not the people mind you, but the policies.fl3gun said:
The problem is alleged to be no jackets. Sierras web site says they have no 224 or 243 jackets for sale; they do have some 30 cals. I don't understand why Berger supplies are dried up, because they own J4 jackets. You would think they would supply their own needs first.
In 30BR I shoot only custom bullets. Randy Robinet says he is taking no orders for those. I spoke to another custom bullet maker and he says he cannot get J4 jackets and is taking no orders. From talking to other shooters, that seems to be the situation everywhere.
Talked to a friend gun shop owner the other day. His distributor told him it may be two years before this situation levels out, but could not account for the reason supplies are short.
So the question is: Why are jackets impossible to get? time for new jacket makers to crank it up.
In 30BR I shoot only custom bullets. Randy Robinet says he is taking no orders for those. I spoke to another custom bullet maker and he says he cannot get J4 jackets and is taking no orders. From talking to other shooters, that seems to be the situation everywhere.
Talked to a friend gun shop owner the other day. His distributor told him it may be two years before this situation levels out, but could not account for the reason supplies are short.
So the question is: Why are jackets impossible to get? time for new jacket makers to crank it up.
My understanding of the DHS thing is that it's a multi-year delivery order contract. In other words, they say, "Over the next five years we may need X-zillion rounds of the following calibers. We will write the orders when (and if) needed and you have Y days to deliver at a preset price." This is a very common way for government agencies to write contracts. They tend to err on the high side because if they don't order it, there's no loss to the agency. If they need more than the contracted amount, then the contract has to be renegotiated which is a long, expensive process.dickn52 said:
In other words, it's much ado about nothing. But it is something for the "tinfoil hat" crowd to get worked up over. Same people who went nuts over the surplus E. German military trucks parked in a salvage yard in S. Mississippi. To them it was a sure sign the commies were about to take over. The owners having found no market for old E. German trucks, last of them has just been scrapped.
CatShooter
Valar said:
I constantly read posts on forums where people brag about finding a shop with some supplies, and buying them all... as long as we (all of us) behave that way, there will be shortages.
No company can meet the demands of piggies like those.
I have been told (for what that's worth) that there are only a few firms who produce bullet jackets in the US. The military no longer produces their own jackets but contracts with commercial bullet manufacturers. It is a trend in all industries to become more concentrated with only a few highly efficient suppliers producing key components. For instance, I was also told (again for what that's worth) that there are only a few companies actually casting AR receivers. Most of the suppliers actually have one of these few companies produce receivers to their specs and then stamp their brand and s/n on the completed product.tenring said:
Production of bullet jackets is one of the most precise phases of ammo production. It also normally requires custom-built stamping machines. Not something you can crank up overnight. However, there is a lot of production capacity around the world. It would seem to me that good jackets could be ordered in quantity from foreign producers.
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