How many firings before trash can?

[Bill Norris]

I do not compete in matches but I do shoot a lot. I never anneal cases. However, I do keep track of number of firings for each piece of brass and make sure it all is fired equal number of times. Once I sort brass and load the first time my brass finds a home in one particular spot in the box and it will go back into that same spot every firing and reload. Probably leaving accuracy on the table but if I am I can't tell it. LOL. Pic is 10 shot group at 100 yds. recently.

 

[JFrank]

Ok, let's talk small groups. I think that it's crucial to have the same velocity in order to get small groups. If I don't anneal and keep track of number of firings within a batch of cases, how would it affect my match results if I take to the match 20 rounds loaded with 5 times fired unannealed brass?

Certainly we track our brass firings, I can wear out a barrel on 100 pieces of lapua 6 br cases.
I dont track ES SD only small groups.

 

[Bill Norris]

I do not put alot of stake into E S S D s either. Not when I shoot a 5 shot group all in the same ragged hole measuring less than 1/4 inch with an E S of over 100 FPS on the chrono.

 

[JFrank]

Neck collet and digital caliper

Yeah well now my Radar just went up.

 

[garandman]

Yeah well now my Radar just went up.

I have no idea what that means. Should I call somebody for ya....???

The measurements are very consistent, across the board.

 

[INTJ]

Neck collet and digital caliper. When I set it back 2-3 thou bolt close was hard. The 7 thou setback, bolt closed same as on an empty chamber.

Virgin brass measured 1.687. Fired - 1.703. SIzed, to be able to close bolt easily - 1.696.

That is likely because when you get to .007" you are sizing the body of the case enough so it has clearance on the chamber. I see this frequently when there is a chamber/die mismatch, usually due to a custom chamber.

Measure the diameter of the case body about .200 up from the base, and measure the shoulder diameter on fired cases as well as on the ones sized .007". I would expect that the .007" sized cases are smaller in diameter at the base than the once fired cases.

 

[jimmymac]

Not a 6BR guy, since I play different games. Recently shot a 512 in UBR with 11x brass that was annealed once at 8x. In all those firings, I only had to trim twice. My brass doesn’t move much from fired to sized. My die is working great. No telling how many firings I’ll get out of this.

 

[jimmymac]

Forgot to mention that my primer pockets are also holding up great and I’m shooting pretty hot like most guys.

 

[meatbag]

I got 25-27 reloads(some reloaded more than others in the same batch) on some ADG 28 Nosler brass before it started to show signs of separating but from what I can tell this is not normal.

 

[Falfan2017]

I’ve had 6br/bra/dasher brass go at least 20 firings with no annealing and no problems. I just start with fresh brass on a new barrel.

 

[M-61]

Ok, let's talk small groups. I think that it's crucial to have the same velocity in order to get small groups. If I don't anneal and keep track of number of firings within a batch of cases, how would it affect my match results if I take to the match 20 rounds loaded with 5 times fired unannealed brass?

Ok. I agree with velocity etc. I can take unannealed, more than 5x shot for sure, but those 20 unannealed brass all have been fired the same number of times fired on them, and shoot in the 2's and sometimes in the 1's. I consider this great for me. I'm not a championship shooter but those groups are nothing to sneeze at. I believe this is the best I can shoot. Most of what's not going in the 1's is ME. So that's my results for not annealed brass.

 

[M-61]

Sure it's one of my best but it's shot with not annealed, 13x shot, 30BR.
For me it's fabulous. 100 yard, Berger's, Bushnell scope, Bartlein barrel, Savage action

 

[marchx]

View attachment 1287393
Sure it's one of my best but it's shot with not annealed, 13x shot, 30BR.
For me it's fabulous. 100 yard, Berger's, Bushnell scope, Bartlein barrel, Savage action

Verba volant, exempla trahunt. Thanks!

 

[rjtfroggy]

View attachment 1287393
Sure it's one of my best but it's shot with not annealed, 13x shot, 30BR.
For me it's fabulous. 100 yard, Berger's, Bushnell scope, Bartlein barrel, Savage action

IMPOSSIBLE!
Savages can't shoot.

 

[JFrank]

I have no idea what that means. Should I call somebody for ya....???

The measurements are very consistent, across the board.

I suppose im not familiar with that tool, because I had a similar experience a few years ago using a tool that was a poor match of shoulder angle i couldn't get a real sense of what was going on or where the tool was actually contacting the shoulder. Now I knock out the primer and use a .30 comparator insert to monitor case growth from base to .300 datum avoiding the CSJ or NSJ I also monitor the Radial expansion at the base/.200 as well as the case shoulder junction.
My curiosity is the .007 you mention is beyond the difference between no and go gage so if your truly having to move that much I would be concerned with future case head separation. @Stan Taylor should be able to add clairity if you need a good neighbor.

 

[bozo699]

I’ve got some 6brx cases with over 30 firings, single digit es/sd when I first started never checked it again but when I retired them from competing at 25 firings they were still competitive. I annealed evening firing from new. Groundhogs don’t seem to notice any difference now.
Wayne

 

[Shooter13]

I would not anneal unless I used an Amp or salt bath. Both were consistent in my experience. Lapua 6br brass is readily available so annealing it to extend life may not be a great return. The main thing is that if you do not anneal, keep your brass on the same firing cycle.

No turn neck is easier and guys shoot small groups with no turn. I am testing a no turn Dasher now to see if it is more accurate. I have shot 100 rounds and so far see no significant difference.

I see where you are coming from but for me annealing is not about more case life it is about consistency. Yes I would like my brass to last forever but in reality it won't so while I get life out of it the most important is that consist seating and release. There I said it

 

[NorCalMikie]

IMPOSSIBLE!
Savages can't shoot.

That was my first thought.
A 5 shot group that can be covered with a dime? PRICELESS.
I think one advantage is I use Precision Bushing Bump Dies and the brass doesn't hardly get moved when sizing. Don't think I've ever lost a 6BR case due to a loose primer pocket.
Remington .221 Fireball? A couple, till I figured out how hot NOT to load them.

 

[JFrank]

In the future I may or may not began annealing depending on my brass history results, if and when I do it will most likely not be for longevity purposes rather cycling freely during the life span. A performance based decision...

 

[Jennb]

As a long range competition shooter consistent neck tension makes a difference. I annealed for years with a propane annealer with no problems. I purchased an AMP more for the convenience of being able to stop and start whenever I wanted without resetting flames and such. It is definitely more consistent and seriously more convenient.