Hard carbon removing, help!

[Longtrain]

Carbon is always a challenge to remove. I can open a store with all the “Witches Brews” that I bought that said they would remove carbon. Maybe, I said maybe, some may help soften or loosen the carbon. I have no real proof that’s true, but for some reason I flush my barrels with one or another of these products. Then, I always turn to any of the abrasives mentioned. JB, a time proven favorite, but removing the black goo it leaves behind is almost as bad as removing the carbon in the first place. Iosso and ThorroClean both work and be sure to switch arms as you’ll want to work your biceps equally. My current favorite is Flitz, maybe it’s just the nice green color, but on a nylon brush or a tight patch it will, as others, get the carbon out.
Watching the Hornady Podcasts on cleaning, they make me laugh, a patch or two, no abrasives and you’re good to go. I thought we were going to get a real lesson in cleaning, nope, smoke and mirrors. I don’t know why abrasives and their use are considered taboo. If you want the carbon gone, use one, or spend three weeks soaking and using enough patches to make a quilt.

 

[Turkeytider]

Thanks for the advice, could you link me to the discussion you're talking about?

Guys..... This has been beaten to death but you have to watch how your using abrasive cleaners! Here is a 223 barrel with 800 rounds on it. Cleaned after every 75 rounds fired. I know the pitting is from a chemical reaction but I didn't get the whole story. It was cleaned approximately 10-12...
https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...wayne-cleaning-and-abrasive-cleaners.7183723/

 

[Turkeytider]

Thanks for the advice, could you link me to the discussion you're talking about?

Well, it’s linked several times below! Enjoy. One thing I’ve learned is that there’s essentially no consensus on this subject. Frank’s an owner of Bartlein Barrels.

 

[Bora72]

Carbon is always a challenge to remove. I can open a store with all the “Witches Brews” that I bought that said they would remove carbon. Maybe, I said maybe, some may help soften or loosen the carbon. I have no real proof that’s true, but for some reason I flush my barrels with one or another of these products. Then, I always turn to any of the abrasives mentioned. JB, a time proven favorite, but removing the black goo it leaves behind is almost as bad as removing the carbon in the first place. Iosso and ThorroClean both work and be sure to switch arms as you’ll want to work your biceps equally. My current favorite is Flitz, maybe it’s just the nice green color, but on a nylon brush or a tight patch it will, as others, get the carbon out.
Watching the Hornady Podcasts on cleaning, they make me laugh, a patch or two, no abrasives and you’re good to go. I thought we were going to get a real lesson in cleaning, nope, smoke and mirrors. I don’t know why abrasives and their use are considered taboo. If you want the carbon gone, use one, or spend three weeks soaking and using enough patches to make a quilt.

I will try one of these products, hoping that just one will be enough

 

[AlNyhus]

I will try one of these products, hoping that just one will be enough

If your barrel has carbon in it as you describe, save your time and money. Nothing works as easily, effectively...and safely...as an abrasive designed for the purpose.

Respectfully, this is not that difficult.

 

[JEFFPPC]

If your barrel has carbon in it as you describe, save your time and money. Nothing works as easily, effectively...and safely...as an abrasive designed for the purpose.

Respectfully, this is not that difficult.

Lol, except obviously it is.

 

[AlNyhus]

Lol, except obviously it is.

It can be daunting for someone that's never done it before....I remember my uneasiness the first time I used JB to get rid of the hard carbon in my 220 Swift barrel Fortunately, I had a good mentor that walked me through the process. That process is what I use to this day.

Just last week, I JB'd the bore of a used 308W. Via the Hawkeye bore scope, it had been cleaned well of the powder fouling but had plenty of carbon in there. JB corrected the situation easily.

Good shootin' -Al

 

[Dgd6mm]

I will try one of these products, hoping that just one will be enough

When?

 

[Longtrain]

I will try one of these products, hoping that just one will be enough

Anyone will work, as mentioned. My Dashers live for at least 2500 rounds and are cleaned every 150 rounds down to steel. They’re accurate until their final day. Never turned one into a musket.

 

[Steve Donlon]

A friend gave me a AR15 pistol, 10.5" barrel. The barrel was all black inside. I thought there was something wrong with the borescope light. All hard carbon. I could have spent the rest of my life trying to get it out with C4. This morning I spent about 20 minutes with Thorroclean and a bronze brush and it was gone, but the barrel I don't think will ever look like a chrome lined barrel. There is a place for abrasives.

 

[JEFFPPC]

Anyone will work, as mentioned. My Dashers live for at least 2500 rounds and are cleaned every 150 rounds down to steel. They’re accurate until their final day. Never turned one into a musket.

You bring up an interesting point. So good on their final day.....why take them off? So I have been saving good barrels for years until I get old. So now at 78 the last two years I have shot old barrels on my ppc. Both sill shooting great, I have won with both of them. I have a 6BRX barrel with 4000 rounds laying here. I have been told in the past its a hummer. I might get it out next year. So much to learn and do forgetting conventional wisdom...or is it?

 

[Link]

My 2 cents - this horse has no hide left on it. Abrasives are the ONLY thing that will remove hard carbon. Your barrel doesn't have to look like it did when new, never fired -
I looked at a respected smith - shooters barrel w a borescope before a match, it had a slight dark blue for the 1st 4 '' or so. He did very well..

 

[Fire Dog]

Hello,
I just finished clean the barrel one second time on this two days.
On the rifling, throat, neck area and about 6" from the muzzle I can't remove hard (backed) carbon.

I've used KG1, Rimfire blend, Bore Cleaning foam, but not lucky for me.
Patch and first use bronze brush.

I read an old thread that the miracolous blend are citrid acid aka Lemi Shine.

Thread 'Another cleaning post' https://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/another-cleaning-post.4021319/

Have you some report about?
If the citrid acid are usable for removing hard carbon, how I can neutralize this on the chamber/barrel?

Thanks

Someone mentioned JB blue & red paste, I find that my two versions are really grey & purple…
Anyway, I have found Bore Tech C-4 to be an excellent product and for really serious carbon, then, as advised, put a bore guide onto your cleaning rod first, then wrap a patch around the brush, wet with C-4 plus the grey/blue JB and give bore 30 strokes.
Finish with the red/purple, same technique. Throughly clean out all residue of the JB with wet then dry patches and have a look. You should see a bright to bare metal bore. I have only ever used the JB when things get serious near the end of the barrel’s life and the fire cracking in the throat area is collecting a lot of rubbish even with as few as 25-40 rds.
I clean with the C-4 and Cu+2 after @ match and find that carbon just is not an issue and usually barrel is clean at the 4-6 patch level. A patch with some Extreme CLP and it goes back into the safe. This product is also good:https://www.boretech.com/chameleon-gel-2oz-tube/

 

[madmixerman]

When you guys put JB or Iosso on a patch wrapped brush, do you exit the muzzle and pull back across the crown?

 

[jelenko]

I only work JB/Iosso/Flitz etc in the first 3-4 inches. The rest of the barrel comes out really clean with just bore solvent and bronze brush.

 

[gdbleb]

When you guys put JB or Iosso on a patch wrapped brush, do you exit the muzzle and pull back across the crown?

No. I use a hockey puck as a jag stop. But you really don't need to use abrasives very much on the far end of a barrel as most of the copper & carbon accumulates in the 1st half. So spend most your strokes there.

 

[ELR LVR]

I’ve sometimes wondered if these are the folks who come back later asking how to get rid of baked in carbon . I use the Kroil and JB around every 300 rounds or so, and when I do about 30 strokes total with the JB. Not trying to go to bare metal.
Frank Green from Bartlein Barrels has some instructive experience and opinions on barrel cleaning . There’s a long thread on Sniper’s Hide.

Frank Green is definitely a guy to listen to, has much more experience than most of us in every aspect
from building guns to shooting them.

 

[ELR LVR]

When you guys put JB or Iosso on a patch wrapped brush, do you exit the muzzle and .......

.......pull back across the crown?

I dont even do that period with anything,
Chance of nicking the crown or pulling the debris you just pushed out back into the bore at the crown
Same as lapping
If you go back and forth, the ends will bell out
If you only go one direction, everything should remain uniform inside
-------------------------------------
I push out the muzzle, unscrew, return to breech, screw back on, push forward again
not really a big deal even though it seems tedious
I usually ony have to make 5 passes with each different step
Jag to wet, Bore brush with sweets, bore brush with sweets, Jag to wet and clean out sweets
Jag for dry patches
so maybe 30 passes one direction total

 

[Turkeytider]

Frank Green is definitely a guy to listen to, has much more experience than most of us in every aspect
from building guns to shooting them.

Frank is definitely not in favor of using abrasive with brushes. Patches only.

 

[ELR LVR]

Frank is definitely not in favor of using abrasive with brushes. Patches only.

Cool, good to know,
I dont use abrasives at all personally, dont need to once I started cleaning my barrels every 50 rounds
But we dont want our bore too polished, is another reason why i shy away from abrasives if at all possible.
Flitz, Iosso etc, Polish bores over time or if a guy gets too happy with it.