gotcha said:
Jerry1, The "industry standards" for shell holders are pretty loose. I had a problem similar to yours recently & ended up ordering several new S/H's from a variety of Mfg's. The measurements were all over the place. Interestingly the LEE S/H was closest to the "industry standard" in all dimensions. Which blew me away ;D I ended up using 400 grit, a piece of plexiglass, a little oil & the figure 8 motion. Ended up w/ a perfectly square to the die S/H. Something that can't always be said of run of the mill S/H's. I've often wondered how the out of whack S/H's end up effecting bump & how many people true bolt faces to no avail because of them.
jerry1 said:
I am having trouble getting to the correct headspace on a 6BR die. No matter how I do it there is just no enough set back. Rather than pitch the die has anyone faced off a die about .010 and using shims? Any thoughts on the subject would be helpful. I have never had this problem before.
Thanks,
Jerry1
Yes, for years the die and or shell holder has been ground off, for the same number of years the reloader has not been able to determine the length of the of the chamber from the shoulder of the chamber to the bolt face. When sizing a case the ability of the case to resist sizing is never a consideration, in the perfect world new cases would be used, after new comes once fired cases, resistance to sizing is progressive, still in the forum world of reloading the instructions go something like “The case must be fired at least 4 times (then necked sized 3 times) before it is fully grown, after fully-grown it is necessary to full length sized the case and start overâ€, in that statement nothing is said about the case becoming more resistance to sizing.
Resistance to sizing, this can happen to a case that has been fired once, I have fired cases that after being fired once had no memory of its own head stamp.
It has not been necessary to reduce the deck height of the shell holder and or base of the die, a bench rester should have enough skill to form cases. I form cases for short chambers, I form cases for long chambers, I do not grind dies, I do not grind the base of a die, as I said, “IT is not necessaryâ€,
I form cases that are .012†shorter than a minimum length case from the shoulder to the head of the case without grinding anything, I form cases that are longer than a field reject chamber by .002†without Redding Competition shell holders, that is .006†beyond the .010â€+ capability of the Redding competition shell.
$45.00 a set? I have the #6 set, I paid $5.00 for the set at a gun show in Mesquite, TX.. Redding competition shell holders are nice but not necessary. Any thing a reloader can accomplish by grinding I can accomplish with the feeler gage, same for the Redding Competition shell holders.
“The "industry standards" for shell holders are pretty loose†How many thousandths in a pretty, and what is loose? That statement has no value, I have a standard for shell holders, my standard for a shell holder deck height is .125â€, I have shell holders that go back to the late 50s and early 60s, .125†back then manufactures made shell holder to my standard. Pretty loose? if there was such a thing as pretty loose, there is something called pretty tight. The difference between the tow is measured in thousandths.
Difference in shell holders, I have shell holders that allow me to insert a case that is new and or once fired, the same shell holder will not allow me to insert a case that has had the memory knocked out of it. A very fine builder/shooter/reloader ask me for forming a few hundred wildcat cases based on the belted magnum, he asked me to bring the other #4 type shell holder, seems he had 40 plus Weatherby, Browning and etc., cases that would not fit his shell holder, I dug out a small gasket cutting ball peen hammer, the little hammer is great for encouraging chases with upset heads to fit the shell holder they were designed to fit. The extractor rings were expanded .008†and the case body ahead of the belt was expanded .011â€, The cases with the upset case heads would require a bigger hammer to fit my ‘pretty tight ‘shell holder. That feat would not be possible without cutting metal.
favorite shell holder: My favorite shell holder is the RCBS, the deck height is .125†if the deck height is not .125†RCBS will replace it, (think about it) If I had a shell holder that did not have a deck height of .125†I could use it as a competition shell holder.
Loose? Can a shell holder fit and be loose? yes, my RCBS shell holders have a deck height of .125â€, BUT! Because they are loose? I can raise the deck height .012†+/- a few by placing a feeler gage between the deck of the shell holder and bottom of the case head, WHY? would I do that, I an a reloader, I am not the one that has to grind a shell holder and or die to increase the ability of the die, shell holder and press to reduce the length of the case. But, let us say what I do is beyond reloading and bench resting, if I did decide to grind the die and or shell holder my methods would allow me to determine how much grinding was necessary in thousandths.
Adding to the length of the case from the shoulder to the head of the case, again, I use the feeler gage, I adjust the die off the shell holder with the feeler gage, the feeler gage is a standard, it is a transfer, and it is also verifier, for those that take wild-guestimates in fractional turns of the die, verify the wild guess with the verifying tool, the feeler gage. Or continue through like, grouchy.
F. Guffey