Yep.. good bye to Klamath dams....watch and see if it helps fish.... according to the old-timers,they put the first dam in several miles above where salmon could make it .....I lived thru the protesters in humco .. Darrell and Judy, and the lot.....just as bad as Hamas supporters.
Electric Cars -- anyone own one?
- Thread starter muleman69
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Remember popular mechanics??? In an issue yrs ago they had plans to use a pinto!!! Install a single cyl engine w several alternators and electric motor drive.... Pre Prius....
Yes. Lol
I had a Nissan leaf for six years. We called it the Nissan leash because of the short range but that didn’t really matter because it was basically an around town car. That thing got 4.5 mi. per kWh over long stretches of Miles. That meant that it only cost us about $150 per year to drive it 7500 miles given electricity rates of nine cents per kilowatt hour in Utah.
The benefits of an EV for the average person are the low cost of driving and maintaining it, and the super fun acceleration. For a car like the Nissan Leash, you don’t really even need a level two 240 V charger, you could just plug it in every night on 110 and be fine. as the batteries get bigger (over 30-40 kWh) and the range longer, you really do need the level two charger to keep up.
We now have a Tesla model Y and put 15,000 miles on it in the first year, double the Leash because we can take it on long-distance Interstate trips. It averages 3.5 mi./ kWh, significantly less than the Nissan leash because of its increased weight. But it is still markedly cheaper than driving a gas or diesel vehicle. It cost us $400 in electricity to drive it 15,000 miles last year. That is equivalent to about 160 miles per gallon if you were driving a gas vehicle depending upon the price of the gas or diesel.
Realistically, for the average person, unless you are a dedicated electric vehicle nerd, you really need to have it as a second vehicle with another vehicle for when you want to go on long trips or haul anything, because the range is just not there even with modern large battery packs. Especially in the cold, especially at speeds over 70 mph, especially if you have even just a bike rack on the back.
Finally, if you do actually want to go on long trips on the interstate and such, you absolutely must have a Tesla. There is no other charging network that can hold a candle to it in terms of speed and reliability and there being one most anywhere you would want to go. It remains to be seen whether the likes of Ford and General Motors, after they adopt the Tesla standard later this year and go onto the network will be able to charge as seamlessly as a Tesla around which the entire system was designed. It is a completely different set of affairs than just plugging an appliance into the wall. The vehicle and the charger have to communicate with one another and the payment system has to work. All of that works all the time with Tesla cars on their chargers. It is markedly less reliable with any other vehicle and any other charger work.
Buy one for around town, I bet you’ll like it. The other reason you will is because the Tesla will smoke anything in your town in 0 to 60 times. There is no competing with the torque of those electric motors. You will blow the doors off of mustangs, hellcats, Ferraris, you name it, if you get a model 3,X, S, or cyber truck. if you get the model Y and want to go fast, get the performance version. The model Y is the slowest of the bunch because of its weight but it will still beat 95% of the cars on the road in acceleration.
The benefits of an EV for the average person are the low cost of driving and maintaining it, and the super fun acceleration. For a car like the Nissan Leash, you don’t really even need a level two 240 V charger, you could just plug it in every night on 110 and be fine. as the batteries get bigger (over 30-40 kWh) and the range longer, you really do need the level two charger to keep up.
We now have a Tesla model Y and put 15,000 miles on it in the first year, double the Leash because we can take it on long-distance Interstate trips. It averages 3.5 mi./ kWh, significantly less than the Nissan leash because of its increased weight. But it is still markedly cheaper than driving a gas or diesel vehicle. It cost us $400 in electricity to drive it 15,000 miles last year. That is equivalent to about 160 miles per gallon if you were driving a gas vehicle depending upon the price of the gas or diesel.
Realistically, for the average person, unless you are a dedicated electric vehicle nerd, you really need to have it as a second vehicle with another vehicle for when you want to go on long trips or haul anything, because the range is just not there even with modern large battery packs. Especially in the cold, especially at speeds over 70 mph, especially if you have even just a bike rack on the back.
Finally, if you do actually want to go on long trips on the interstate and such, you absolutely must have a Tesla. There is no other charging network that can hold a candle to it in terms of speed and reliability and there being one most anywhere you would want to go. It remains to be seen whether the likes of Ford and General Motors, after they adopt the Tesla standard later this year and go onto the network will be able to charge as seamlessly as a Tesla around which the entire system was designed. It is a completely different set of affairs than just plugging an appliance into the wall. The vehicle and the charger have to communicate with one another and the payment system has to work. All of that works all the time with Tesla cars on their chargers. It is markedly less reliable with any other vehicle and any other charger work.
Buy one for around town, I bet you’ll like it. The other reason you will is because the Tesla will smoke anything in your town in 0 to 60 times. There is no competing with the torque of those electric motors. You will blow the doors off of mustangs, hellcats, Ferraris, you name it, if you get a model 3,X, S, or cyber truck. if you get the model Y and want to go fast, get the performance version. The model Y is the slowest of the bunch because of its weight but it will still beat 95% of the cars on the road in acceleration.
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jds holler
Gold $$ Contributor
I've lived my entire life enjoying the Klamath River and the reservoirs created by the dams. The stretch closest to K Falls is already a primo trout fishery. I maintain that the reservoirs provide holding water for fish survival during the real low/warm water periods. Without them the river will become a very small creek in the late summer, and likely the large trout simply won't survive.
The way our weather and water situation is these days, I wouldn't be surprised to see the river go dry in August. There has also been a great whitewater rafting recreation and business on the river in the spring and early summer. It was the result of the electric power facility holding back water in the evening and turning it loose in the daytime for power production down stream. It turned the river into a first class rafting river every day for a couple months of the year. - Class 5 rapids. That will now be a thing of the past.
I think it will be indeed a rare possibility that we see salmon coming up to the stretch that will be affected by the dam removal. I think it will also be a rare possibility to find the trophy 3 to 5 pound trout that we can now catch in the river below the Keno dam. jd
I was looking at an EV as a third knock around car, but it just does not pay for me. First, our electric rates are 15 cents per KWH. Second, have you looked at the used EV market lately? They are very hard to sell, and prices are dropping fast. You have to factor the loss of value into the cost of owning one. And, once they get 100K miles on them, no one will buy it at any price. There are a bunch of Chevy Bolts on the market right now with 20-25K miles on them, asking price $15,000 and no takers. They have lost a dollar a mile in value. Not good.
Larry Koch
Silver $$ Contributor
Just think if all this stupid money was invested in gas vehicles efficiency.
My 2018 f150 get 24 mpg are better. By now they could be getting 30 mpg if they were not chasing the electric pipe dream.
My 2018 f150 get 24 mpg are better. By now they could be getting 30 mpg if they were not chasing the electric pipe dream.
My EV buying/selling experience with my Nissan Leaf was different than what you guys are saying
We bought in June 2017 when there was a 7500 tax credit AND $10,000 off dealer incentive. After all that I had the car for about $15,500 out the door new.
Then we drove it 7500 miles a year for 6.5 years at an annual electricity cost of about $150 (which was “free” bc we have enough solar that we never pay an electricity bill). The ONLY maintenance cost was a set of new tires and I had to rotate tires annually and put in washer fluid. NOTHING else.
Then I sold it for $13,500 cash when we got the Tesla MY. TOTAL cost of owning it was about $3500 for 6.5 years or $538 per year or $45 per month. You can’t even fill the tank of an f150 ONCE for $45 and that was my TOTAL cost each month over 6.5 years of ownership INCLUDING Maintenance and depreciation!
Like anything, you have to be a saavy and shrewd consumer if you wanna make rather than lose $$$
If you do buy a used one, a better gauge of vehicle health than the mileage is the battery health indicator. Our Leaf was 85% when we sold it. There are lots of great deals on used EVs right now.
Remember also these cars have 7-10 year warranties on the battery.
To each his own
We bought in June 2017 when there was a 7500 tax credit AND $10,000 off dealer incentive. After all that I had the car for about $15,500 out the door new.
Then we drove it 7500 miles a year for 6.5 years at an annual electricity cost of about $150 (which was “free” bc we have enough solar that we never pay an electricity bill). The ONLY maintenance cost was a set of new tires and I had to rotate tires annually and put in washer fluid. NOTHING else.
Then I sold it for $13,500 cash when we got the Tesla MY. TOTAL cost of owning it was about $3500 for 6.5 years or $538 per year or $45 per month. You can’t even fill the tank of an f150 ONCE for $45 and that was my TOTAL cost each month over 6.5 years of ownership INCLUDING Maintenance and depreciation!
Like anything, you have to be a saavy and shrewd consumer if you wanna make rather than lose $$$
If you do buy a used one, a better gauge of vehicle health than the mileage is the battery health indicator. Our Leaf was 85% when we sold it. There are lots of great deals on used EVs right now.
Remember also these cars have 7-10 year warranties on the battery.
To each his own
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Larry Koch
Silver $$ Contributor
I rather drive my gas-er than push my electric.
It's funny to me how politicized EVs have become.
It's liberal conspiracy! Can't trust them! I'll burn gas till I'm burned up and dead before I'll sit down in a goddamned EV that might catch fire!
Meanwhile your iphone is spying on you and facebook is tracking your every click and eye movement and Amazon is manipulating the shit out of your consumer behavior, and Alexa is listening to you. And not a worry in the world about that!
Then there are the guys who won't buy a suppressor because they "don't want to be on a list"
People amaze and confuse me
It's liberal conspiracy! Can't trust them! I'll burn gas till I'm burned up and dead before I'll sit down in a goddamned EV that might catch fire!
Meanwhile your iphone is spying on you and facebook is tracking your every click and eye movement and Amazon is manipulating the shit out of your consumer behavior, and Alexa is listening to you. And not a worry in the world about that!
Then there are the guys who won't buy a suppressor because they "don't want to be on a list"
People amaze and confuse me
It'd be far less so, if it weren't by force. Sad, that it is.
Bans of gas-powered devices. Legally committing a state to a path of erasure of a whole market segment of products for political reasons, forcibly taking choice out of the hands of buyers. All prior to having thought through the whole industry-wide ramifications of such a change on such a timescale.
I'm all for better mousetraps showing the benefits on their merits. Else, failing to do so. By force, though, is an entirely different kettle o' fish.
Could fix an annual percentage "pollution" tax on petroleum products used as fuels. Say, somewhere in the 5-20% range annually. Could require an absolute filtering/capture process at the point sources, for poisonous and "greenhouse" emissions, with severe financial fines for failure to accomplish such. (Which large power plants could implement, but where individual vehicle operators likely could not.) It'd shift the incentives fairly quickly, over a schedule of time industries and people could accommodate. And it wouldn't be "by force" in the same way outright forcible edicts are. Might be more palatable, but would achieve roughly the same goal: near complete reduction in atmospheric damage from emissions.
Of course, it's gonna be an ugly transition. Transitions often are. And, with this one, it's global in its effects.
NorCalMikie
Gold $$ Contributor
I need to do a little more checking BUT, the across the road neighbor called yesterday. Mentioned her and the rest of the family were all sick but getting better. Mentioned getting a PG&E bill (electricity in Nor Cal) for something like $400.00???
She called to see what could be done about and was told, "you need to buy an EV"????
Like I said, more checking is in order.
She called to see what could be done about and was told, "you need to buy an EV"????
Like I said, more checking is in order.I think the Chevrolet Bolt EV is a good 200 mile round trip / commuter vehicle. Hybrids make more sense for longer distances. The big issue for me (I own neither) is the way they are being forced upon us. Create a vehicle and the infrastructure that makes sense and works, the Government won't have to legislate EV's into existence.
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Larry Koch
Silver $$ Contributor
This makes 5 Cargo ships set on fire by EV cars and Trucks
Cars are being reported to be just going up in flames just like this one
nextdoor.com
So there is a risk. A ticking bomb. Gas safer for the planet and you too.
My wife and I are all for the advancement of technology for the benefit of mankind. What we do not like is something forced on us where the technology isn't ready and just a big money grab. For 2024 we are going to burn as much high octane non corn gas in the corvette as possible. We will probably have to keep the top up as the country that once smelled so sweet stinks to high heaven now. In July the aerial spraying is so heavy they would dump a boatload right into the car.
NorCalMikie
Gold $$ Contributor
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