Details on AR Tactical in NRA High Power (Midrange)

[Andy Legg]

Changing/Removing a Muzzle Break shouldn't be a big deal. I had to replace the Seekins Break on my 18" AR with an A2 Flash Hider for Tac-AR. I get it though....I took a long range shooting class last year and several of the guys had CRAZY loud Muzzle Breaks. Had Rocks & stuff spraying all over me,,,,,I much preferred laying down next to someone else with a can.

I think we harass the F-Class guys enough already throwing/ejecting brass around the line.

 

[anon]

I have shot this course of fire two times for record at Bayou on the 300 yard line and one time at the informal match at PSC on the 200 yard line with the appropriately reduced targets.

The two I shot at Bayou were with a Rock River upper that I bought about 2002 or so and never really shot for record prior to that, and used a 3-9 Leupold EFR rimfire scope. The first match, on the second relay I dropped a few random shots and figured out that the riser had loosened up on the upper. That relay was a 181-4 the other two were 194-4 and 193-8. The next month, with that now solidly mounted rimfire scope I shot a 589-12, picking up 21 points from the previous month even though it had developed some sort of extraction issue before the day was over. Both of those were shot with the 75 Hornady BTHP load that I shoot in Service Rifle. I have determined that I do best with only the Harris bipod and no rear support, just in my shoulder. I've shot better scores on that line in my coat with a sling and my service rifle. I'm not too sure about that old upper.

At the 200 yard line at PSC I used my current Service Rifle upper with its 1-4 Vortex. For ammo I used some old white box 40 count 45gr Winchester varmint ammo that was left over from Academy at 9.99 a box. I now have one box left. That, with a known good upper and a scope at 4 power was 596-32, still with no rear rest at all, just in my shoulder.

It is not fair to judge this class and target by my scores, or those of any other classified competitor. I've been shooting some form of High Power since 1997.

I have not seen a new, unclassified, never before competed shooter show up for this class. If the NRA wants this to be an entry level event, they need to promote it, and clubs need to promote it to their non-competitor members.

I went to the 2013 NRA Convention here in Houston. At the Bushmaster booth, after looking about for a while, I asked where the DCM rifles were. I was told they didn't have any because they did not sell. My response was that that was unfortunate because my first Service Rifle had been a Bushmaster DCM rifle. They did not care. Rock River was the only company there, at the NRA convention, with a Service Rifle and at least one person in the booth understood the discipline. This is an uphill swim.

My first Service Rifle match in 1997 was with a club owned Garand and inexpensive surplus CMP ammo. Does anything like that happen anywhere anymore?

I intend to shoot a carbine with an ACOG and no coat at future reduced walk and paste Service Rifle matches here so that I share all of the equipment handicaps of the new shooters that do occasionally show up. I have a large pile of Hornady 50gr zmax bullets for that endeavor. I'm happy to continue shooting the old Rock River upper with mag length 223 and its 3-9 EFR rimfire scope when it gets hot again. With my current work schedule it may be close to summer before I stop missing matches.

 

[Nowhere Man]

Is the NRA going to do anything with this or let it die on the vine?

 

[kzin]

According to what's in the book now it's due to be "revisited" in January.

 

[jrh84]

I sure hope it doesnt die off. I think it's by far the best way to get people into the sport. The NRA needs to promote it, and clubs need to promote it.

I talked a buddy from work into coming out to a match, and it set the hook deep. He had some shooting experience before (but nothing past 100 yards previously), and he's shot a clean at 300, and some high 190's at 600. I'm trying to talk several more into coming out, but it's like pulling teeth to get people to take that first step.

 

[Herzo]

I attended the CIHPRS 600 yard match at Camp Atterbury on October 27, to get my feet wet in the Tactical Prone, I'm only sorry it took me so long to get involved in this competition. I was heartily welcomed and encouraged by the sling shooters but was disappointed to find that I seemed to be the only one Tactical class. It was a practice match so it was for bragging rights only. I did run into a couple of shooters who sain that they hoped that some of their friends would shoot this match, but it is discouraging not to see more.

I understand the "mag length" rule, it makes perfect sense to me, however that we cannot use a "Bob Sled" or similar magazine substitute makes single loading unwieldy. I have no desire to use a loaded magazine in these matches. I hope that the NRA review in January ends in keeping this alive.

Thanks to Shawn for running a professional match, I eagerly await next year's schedule.

 

[GSS]

I attended the CIHPRS 600 yard match at Camp Atterbury on October 27, to get my feet wet in the Tactical Prone, I'm only sorry it took me so long to get involved in this competition. I was heartily welcomed and encouraged by the sling shooters but was disappointed to find that I seemed to be the only one Tactical class. It was a practice match so it was for bragging rights only. I did run into a couple of shooters who sain that they hoped that some of their friends would shoot this match, but it is discouraging not to see more.

I understand the "mag length" rule, it makes perfect sense to me, however that we cannot use a "Bob Sled" or similar magazine substitute makes single loading unwieldy. I have no desire to use a loaded magazine in these matches. I hope that the NRA review in January ends in keeping this alive.

Thanks to Shawn for running a professional match, I eagerly await next year's schedule.

I don't shoot this class ( Service Rifle Sling Shooter only so far here ) but we did have a few people entering this class in our Mid Range Prone matches this past (2019) season at the 600 yard range I manage in Southern New Hampshire.

It should be a great class for people to get started and I hope the NRA keeps it going now that it's 3rd and final trial year has gone by.

Myself and most others thing with bipod, rear bag and High magnification scope they should shoot on F class targets but that is a minor point.
I agree 100% allowing the use of a Bob Sled is a great pint and should be a no brainer to allow.

George
https://nfga.org/high-power-rifle/

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

Of course they should be using the F-class target but the NRA is too obtuse to realize that.

One day, they will come to their senses, when everyone who shoots in that class makes High Master after shooting two matches.

 

[Herzo]

I don't shoot this class ( Service Rifle Sling Shooter only so far here ) but we did have a few people entering this class in our Mid Range Prone matches this past (2019) season at the 600 yard range I manage in Southern New Hampshire.

It should be a great class for people to get started and I hope the NRA keeps it going now that it's 3rd and final trial year has gone by.

Myself and most others thing with bipod, rear bag and High magnification scope they should shoot on F class targets but that is a minor point.
I agree 100% allowing the use of a Bob Sled is a great pint and should be a no brainer to allow.

George
https://nfga.org/high-power-rifle/

I tend to agree that the MR1 seems to be a "chip shot" for these rifles, but it would be a long time until someone cleans the F class target. Then again, that's what the game is about. Not certain what the answer is.

 

[dcali]

I shot one of these a couple months ago. I cheated (used a bobsled), but I was the only one shooting the class, so... I took my service rifle (with a 4x scope), stuck a bipod on it and went to the match. That's it. I used a bean bag for a rear bag.

Two initial thoughts: First, the bob sled should be allowed. More specifically, you should be able to take a legal service rifle, put a bipod on it and be legal (and competitive).

Second, I shot at mid range (600 yards). I'm classified as a High Master in Mid Range F Class for reference. I shot a 583 on the big (sling) target. It would have been a 531 on the F Class target. Wind was light to moderate, and I had never shot this rifle off a bipod prior to the match (it's my service rifle gun), and I have never worked up a load for it. I just put a 77 on top of some varget and called it good. Long story short, the F Class target will be punishing, but I'm not sure the sling target is small enough- shooting in the 580s on your first outing while only taking it semi-seriously seems a tad too easy.

All that said, it was amazingly fun - more than I expected it to be. It's like F Class without having to worry about working up a load, and great wind practice for service rifles. Sort of in between the two disciplines, not surprisingly.

 

[Herzo]

I shot one of these a couple months ago. I cheated (used a bobsled), but I was the only one shooting the class, so... I took my service rifle, stuck a bipod on it and went to the match. That's it. I used a bean bag for a rear bag.

Two initial thoughts: First, the bob sled should be allowed. More specifically, you should be able to take a legal service rifle, put a bipod on it and be legal (and competitive).

Second, I shot at mid range (600 yards). I'm classified as a High Master in Mid Range F Class for reference. I shot a 583 on the big (sling) target. It would have been a 531 on the F Class target. Wind was light to moderate, and I had never shot this rifle off a bipod prior to the match (it's my service rifle gun), and I have never worked up a load for it. I just put a 77 on top of some varget and called it good. Long story short, the F Class target will be punishing, but I'm not sure the sling target is small enough- shooting in the 580s on your first outing while only taking it semi-seriously seems a tad too easy.

All that said, it was amazingly fun. It's like F Class without having to worry about working up a load.

I also cheated with a Bob sled (and was the only one shooting the class), it was strictly a practice match. I used a 6.5 Grendel that I have no other use for - I just thought it was a neat cartridge. Shot a 569 with a 186 on my 3rd string - the wind gave me an education.

The only other mid-range experience that I have is shooting the sniper match at Perry with a 6.5 Swede & a 4X Weaver. At my age, I need all the help I can get.

 

[kzin]

"This is not meant to be another form of F-Class competition."

It would be a bit lame to have this in the rules and shoot the f-class target.

Just about every shooter thinks of this class as f-class with more limited equipment.
Regardless, NRA has it under 'prone'(sling).

Pick 1 -

a. service rifle with bipod, big target

OR

b. f-tactical, small target

Both would be even better but I doubt the sport is in a good position to add every class that sounds good.

 

[GSS]

"This is not meant to be another form of F-Class competition."

It would be a bit lame to have this in the rules and shoot the f-class target.

Just about every shooter thinks of this class as f-class with more limited equipment.
Regardless, NRA has it under 'prone'(sling).

Pick 1 -

a. service rifle with bipod, big target

OR

b. f-tactical, small target

Both would be even better but I doubt the sport is in a good position to add every class that sounds good.

--------------

Just my Opinion but,,, Definitely B F Tactical = Small target

If it's legal to have unlimited power scope, bipod AND rear bag it should be on an F Class Target
As has been stated 90% of people shooting that rig on the sling target would make HM is 1st 3 - 4 matches.
What challenge is that ?

People should have to put effort in to make HM

But like I said, just my opinion

 

[Herzo]

Scope is limited to 12X, but your point is taken. I suspect that there would be few shooters making HM on the F target in that the 10 ring is 1 MOA barely within the capability of most service rifles - it then becomes another equipment race. Not what was envisioned.....tis a puzzlement.

 

[kzin]

I think 90% HM is extreme hyperbole.
30% master is probably more realistic.

But even as an f-class guy I think getting ANY prone(sling) classification off a bipod is wrong.

ps scope is 15x not unlimited. Very limited compared to 50 and 60x f-class scopes

 

[kzin]

Scope is limited to 12X, but your point is taken. I suspect that there would be few shooters making HM on the F target in that the 10 ring is 1 MOA barely within the capability of most service rifles - it then becomes another equipment race. Not what was envisioned.....tis a puzzlement.

Scope is 15x currently. It was originally 12 and went up last year.

 

[Herzo]

Had not caught the delta on the scope, I won't be changing tho, 12X seems more than adequate.

 

[dcali]

It really is its own thing. It's easier than service rifle, and not as equipment intensive as F Class. A typical service rifle cannot reliably hold the x ring on an F Class target. Most can barely keep inside the 10 ring. Scores will be low if F class targets are used. That's ok, but the classifications will be all jacked up unless a new one is created. Breaking 560 on an F Class target at 600 will be an accomplishment. On the other hand, sling targets will get cleaned quickly by shooters who couldn't do it with a sling with even a little effort, which is how we got f class targets to begin with (which arguably aren't small enough).

At the end of the day it doesn't fit in well with existing targets or classifications. Neither of those restrictions prevents it from being worth while to shoot.

 

[dcali]

Had not caught the delta on the scope, I won't be changing tho, 12X seems more than adequate.

Honestly, 4x does the job on a sling target.

 

[tflorman]

I say leave it on the bigger sling target. It's not like that class is full to the brim of shooters. If a new person shows up looking to give high power a try and they have a pretty common store bought rig with a cheap bipod attached... they certainly aren't in danger of getting their high master card after the first 2 tries. High Master's can read the wind... new shooters can't. Hell, even the high master sling shooter (damoncali) wasn't even close to cleaning it. FTR rigs are a far cry better than an AR on a harris bipod and a read squeeze bag. Sure, once folks get used to the gear, the potential exists for some great scores, but those shooters are probably good wind readers already.