Cold Barrel Flyers

[K22]

This is a followup to a previous post on this subject; First Shot Flyers.

First, thanks for all the input. I took "Timbertoes" suggestion and went to Rimfirecentral.com. In the CZ forum section they describe the exact same problem I've been experiening with my CZ 452 - 22 rimfire rifle. They explain in detail the technical reason for this condition if you're interested. Their proposed remedy basically involves removing the hardened lead in the throat area.

I followed their remedy, (using JB Bore Paste), and it eliminated the extreme cold barrel flyers at least so far. But the remedy was painful and time consuming. They offered no information on how to long the remedy will last or how to maintain the cold barrel flyer free condition but if I have to go throught their JB routine before ever time I shoot, my rimfire rifle days are going to come to an immediate end!

 

[jbpmidas]

I guess, with the type of competing I do, the fliers don't bother me. We have unlimited sighters. I usually take 4-6 to get the weapon ready for my scorers. Although, this last match, it took more and I went to my score target before the gun was ready. What type of shooting are you doing?

 

[timbertoes]

It may be time then, to contact CZ USA. Bascially it boils down to this:

the good reputation of CZ's 22 rifles are deserved, and a cold barrel flyer is not part of the equation.

If you will give them a call, and be patient with them, you can have this resolved in your favor.

 

[K22]

In response to "jbpmidas", I'm a hunter so random cold barrel flyers are a non-starter for me.

As suggested by "Timbertoes," I will contact CZ but I doubt if they will be willing to resolve this for me. First, I had an after market trigger installed and second, the rifle is several years old and I wouldn't expect them to honor this as a warranty issues at this late date.

This rifle always performed this way, I just decided this year to get serious about solving it one way or other. The really sad thing is that it's shoots great from a hot barrel and the new trigger I had installed is unbelievable. It's also a beautiful rifle and handles well in the field.

If I could be assured that a new barrel would correct the condition, I'd glady paid to have it done but I don't want to spend more money on this rifle without some certainty that the problem can be corrected. I've been chasing this problem for three years by changing scopes, different brands of ammo, and different cleaning methods, etc.

 

[hogpatrol]

K22, I'm a rimfire hunter also. My advice: Junk the .22 & go with a .17 hmr for hunting. It has dead nuts accuracy out to a hundred yards, first shot, fiftieth shot. May sound sacriligeous but .22s are an anachronism, a cheap and poor substitute compared to todays modern .17s. Fiddling with a hunting gun and fifty types of .22 ammo is definitely a NON STARTER. I have a CZ 453 and 452, and an Annie in .17 & my two .22s are collecting dust. Good Luck HP

 

[K22]

Hogpatrol:

Considering a move to the 17HMR since I'm sick and tired of spending money on my 22 with no results.

 

[hogpatrol]

K22, If you can borrow a .17 hmr that is dialed in with its best shooting ammo, you'll be sold. The only limiting factor is the price. You can go with an entry level Savage or full monte Anschutz. The CZ's I have are tack drivers, the Annies' have the advantage of better triggers. If all you are shooting are squirrels at short range, check out the .17 hm2s. With most guns and Eley ammo, they're one holers @ 50-75 yds. I have a nice Annie 1502 that is my go to squirrel gun. Head shots are a must as that little 17 vmax can do some damage. The CZs in 17hmr I use for woodchucks. HP

 

[K22]

Hogpatrol:

Anschutz is out of my price range. The CZ sounds good. I hunt squirrels and woodchucks. 95% of my woodchuck hunting is done with a 223 and 22 250 at distances 100 yards and over but there is a farm where the majority of shots are short range under 100 yards and noise is an issue.

Does the 17 HRM reliabilty drop a woodchuck up to 100 yards? Again, thanks for you're advise.

 

[hogpatrol]

K22. I've dropped chucks as far away a 192 yds, lasered, with my annie 17 hmr. Head shots are lights out. Body shots can be a crawl-away. I have the heavy barrel fluted and the sporter model in CZ. Both are supremely accurate with 20 gr Hornady XTPs. Each .17 has a mind of its own but a little experimentation with different brands/weights, and I'm sure you'll be satisifed with the results. As an aside, am using Sightrons SIIBS in 4-16. Good Luck.

 

[K22]

"HogPatrol" - As soon as I amass the funds I'm going into the 17 world.

Thanks again for the advice.

 

[hogpatrol]

The CZ is a good compromise between the Savage & Anschutz. Good Luck. HP

 

[DOGCAPPER]

I have a CZ in 17 MII...Used as backup Pdog shooter....Dead nuts out to 125+...Good for meat hunters...No damage to meat but deadli on P dog sized targets...CCI most powerful ...Most accurate in mine...Cheaper to shoot than HMR....

 

[hogpatrol]

Dogcapper, Good choice. I have a CZ and an Annie in HM2. Both deadly 100 yds and inside on groundhogs. Cheap ammo too!

 

[bheadboy]

K22
i am a 22 hunter, everything from 25yd to 100+ including on short range pd out west

i have not had a problem with flyers as you describe and all shooting has beed done with either Rem 541, 541t, 504's with cci mini mag hp - i have owned at least 5 of the above mentioned rifles.

Go to gunbroker and find a used 541 , compare the accuracy and then sell the CZ

Bob

 

[Dave T]

I am also a .22 rimfire hunter and low scale competitive shooter. I have a Clark Custom 10/22 squirell gun and it shoots great. I also have a Remington 541T that has trigger tuned and stock bedded and barrel floated, this gun is a real shooter. I have no serious flyers with either of these guns, if any it's first shot. I also shoot bench rest center fire, and first shot flyers are as common as hot dogs. So if I were you K22 I'd do what timbertoes suggested and have your gun looked at, instead of taking advice from hogpatrol who has an obvious prejiduce against rimfires and making a decision on his feelings in one little forum post. We shoot more rimfire ammo, we sell more rimfire ammo then any other round in America and there is a reason for that, Americans love and grow up on rimfires, I know I did....
Just my opinion I could be wrong.
Dave T

 

[hogpatrol]

Dave, the .17s are rimfires, don't have first shot flyers, cold barrel flyers, shoot 1/2 to 1 inch groups right out of the box at a 100 yds. without any additional gun work, bedding, tuners, etc. and for hunting where the first shot counts will hit the mark every time. It does take a little experimenting with the four different types of ammo but after that, look out groundhogs! I have three .22s that are basically safe queens since I bought my first .17 hmr rimfire, a CZ 453 fluted heavy barrel. It works on everything from squirrels to fox. The .22s have their place for short range target, plinking and introducing new shooters to the sport. For hunting, I'll stick to the .17s. Best, Hog

 

[Dave T]

I know what a 17HMR is....
Dave T

 

[CZ_BRShooter]

With a good barrel you should not be getting much lead buildup in the throat. That said, ammo can make a difference as a lot of cheap ammo is just plain nasty. Good ammo especially match grade brand name ammo is so much cleaner and the bullets tend to be better made.
I would talk to CZ myself, they make a nice rifle but once in a while even with the best manufacturers one slips through that is not up to specs. A bore scope would tell you a lot about your barrel if you have a gunsmith that has one.

 

[K22]

Had the gun examined by a gunsmith, there was lead in the throat area. Use JB compound and removed it. The smith suggested using Shooter's Choice Lead Remover as part of my cleaning procedure. I'm a novice rimfire shooter and I was told not to clean the barrel since cleaning ruins the accuracy.

I haven't had a chance to do any testing since every free minute I have I've been groundhog hunting with my centerfire rifles but I'll report back when I can get to the range and test.

 

[Dave T]

K22, how's the groundhog hunting going? Finding many targets? I live in WV and there seems to be a few more groundhogs this year but the numbers just aren't there. What state are you in?
Dave T