You beat me to it...I posted the same thing after reading the OPs post.
ATF data base
- Thread starter COLT45SA
- Start date
shortgrass
Silver $$ Contributor
According to gov statistics, there were over 15million NICs checks in 2024. Your state DMV has ALL your info, age, height, weight, hair color, YOUR PICTURE, date of birth, make model and year of your vehicles, your address where you live and in most states if you have auto insurance. The IRS has your address and how much money you earn and where it came from. Your state criminal data base will have you listed if you were pulled over for not wearing a seat belt or failed to produce insurance verification. If you committed a federal offence, you are in the federal criminal data base. These days, people respond to the 'click bait'.
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hoz53
Gold $$ Contributor
and isnt there another form filled out if a certain number of handguns are purchased by one buyer?
The GAO said a few years ago that the ATF 'LOST" handguns and laptops at more than twice the rate of another government agency. What does that say about the ATF? They arrested some pencil pusher at the ATF for stealing and selling confiscated firearms that were in the ATF impound. With fast and Furious the ATF Airforce, Ruby Ridge, and Wayco and all the other crap they pull, they should not have enough credibility to convict anyone.
shortgrass
Silver $$ Contributor
( a check on possible gun trafficking)
COLT45SA
Silver $$ Contributor
Interesting. All I really know is that I filled out a federal form that asked all kind of personal information including my SS#. When the FFL holding dealer made the call I honestly don't know what information from that federal form he revealed on that call.
So if that form is just kept in the dealer's file, I apologize to you and every one of the people who read my post for talking trash about those nice people at the ATF~!
ShtrRdy
Silver $$ Contributor
There's probably something seriously illegal about that approach.
I had discussion with IRS once about some back-taxes. They knew every date and address I had ever lived. Even for 3-weeks I was couch-surfing at friend's house one summer at university! WTF!@#! I never signed any paperwork, never had change-of-address to that location, paid my rent with cash. How did they know???
xr650rRider
Silver $$ Contributor
Not even a little bit. It is exactly how it's done.
"........those nice people at the ATF~!"....you are going wayyy too far there. I had an FFL for a long time and luckily, I never had any trouble with the ATF. About 3 days after Biden took office, I had a surprise audit by them....the first audit I had been subjected to in 13 years.
The agents were local people that just happened to be ATF employees and they were very friendly and professional. I had 2 very small technical mistakes that I fixed under their supervision. As they were leaving, I stacked up my bound books and 4473s and handed it all to them. I told them I could see the writing on the wall with the incoming administration and was surrendering my license effective immediately. They indicated I wasn't the only one that felt that way, then they wished me well and left.
A friend who is an FFL and who had a license for as long as I remember with not even a single small mistake was audited 2 times in the last administrations 4 years (prior to that he would get audited once every 6-10 years). He kept his license because he was also an SOT with a lot of personal NFA stuff but, he paid for it with harassment. The ATF isn't now and never will be our friends.
DirtySteve
Gold $$ Contributor
If you think he is wearing a tin foil hat you don't know the history of your government. They may not have make, models and serial numbers. But they know you bought pistols, rifles, ect...
The government has used it's subjects for medical experiments for decades. They used mostly black Americans until recently. I forget the name of the program but the infected/mistreated blacks with syphilis. Just to see what happened to them... Don't make me put on my C-19 tin foil hat... So nothing is beyond them, nothing... Were is the Epstein list? Giselle Maxwell or what ever her name is was convicted. Epstein was Indicted by a Grand Jury.. No client list? I maybe rambling at this point...
The government has used it's subjects for medical experiments for decades. They used mostly black Americans until recently. I forget the name of the program but the infected/mistreated blacks with syphilis. Just to see what happened to them... Don't make me put on my C-19 tin foil hat... So nothing is beyond them, nothing... Were is the Epstein list? Giselle Maxwell or what ever her name is was convicted. Epstein was Indicted by a Grand Jury.. No client list? I maybe rambling at this point...
ELR LVR
Silver $$ Contributor
Same as NV
Walk in, buy, walk out
Your CCW IS your background check
Should be this way in all States
Maybe thats the agenda that should be pushed
If President Trump, supports the second amendment, he should look into repealing ALL gun control laws starting with the 1968 G.C.A. NONE of these gun control laws have worked other than costing money, and infringe the rights to keep & bear arms, as stated in the Bill of Rights.
shortgrass
Silver $$ Contributor
Field agents and inspectors are people with a job to do. Give them the same respect and cooperation as you would a client/customer and they will respond to you in the same, respectful manner, has been my experience. Treat 'um like they are the "enemy" and expect them to react just as a local police officer, sheriffs deputy or state trooper would if you resisted them. I have been inspected 2 times in 25yrs with no 'violations' in my procedures and follow the procedures set forth by the regulations, and any contact I have had with field agents/inspectors has been in a respectful manner. What happens in Washington is a completely different matter, those are politicians. By law, when you pass a NICS check the record of that check is to be deleted within 24hrs. If you fail the NICS check, the record of that check is kept for 90 days. Don't like the law? Get your reps in congress to change it! By the way, your SS# was voluntary, NOT required on form 4473. If someone out there has a better idea of how to keep the "dirtbags" in check, I'm sure your congressman/senator would like to hear about it. It is not perfect, but what is?
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When Bill Clinton passed and pushed local governments to only allow FFLs to operate in a brick and mortar store front zoned for retail sales thousands of FFLs were revoked and businesses were closed. When that happened the hardbound books were confiscated and they have that data and what ever they can get ahold of. But even that is more than they are allowed.
Who cares (even though this is probably not 100% accurate)? I've got a CWP. Nothing gets called in.
I've got over $4k in tax stamps. Do you REALLY think I'm worried about the ATF's (imaginary) registry regarding firearms?
What you should be concerned about is all the the amount of dark web hackers with your SSN. They could screw you over MUCH HARDER than the ATF ever could.
ATF = buy a new dog.
Hacker fraud = cannot afford a new dog because you're bankrupt.
Just so ya know, 4473's never totally disappear.
I've got over $4k in tax stamps. Do you REALLY think I'm worried about the ATF's (imaginary) registry regarding firearms?
What you should be concerned about is all the the amount of dark web hackers with your SSN. They could screw you over MUCH HARDER than the ATF ever could.
ATF = buy a new dog.
Hacker fraud = cannot afford a new dog because you're bankrupt.
Just so ya know, 4473's never totally disappear.
HandgunHTR
Gold $$ Contributor
You obviously don't purchase many firearms from licensed dealers do you?
Exactly. In most free states, if you have a concealed carry license (or equivalent) you are not required to complete the NICS call because the CCW permit requires a full background check to be completed in order to receive it. Possession of a valid CCW proves the same result as the NICS. So, all that is required is a completed 4473 and you are good to go.
I do have, what I believe to be a better way. I have written letters to my state and federal legislatures and I have never received a call, letter nor any other communication back.
Once again, in my opinion , our representatives are too busy doing what they think is best for THEM to worry about what's best for their constituents.
Why would they stick their necks out and rock the boat on a controversial topic when they can keep lining their pockets without fighting for what's right?
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ABRUNO
Gold $$ Contributor
This is NOT correct. The ATF does not ask for the make, model or SN of anything. Ever.
The form does but when you call they do not ask these questions. I wish they did. Then when they need something they don't have to bug the dealer for it.
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