Anybody ever had a Powder Explosion?

[jelenko]

I have about 5 pounds of 4166. I have checked it looks and smells fine. But due to a recent personal experience with a house fire, I think I will be very cautious and take it out and burn it. Not worth the chance.
Sunday night/Monday morning, 5-13-2024, the home that I grew up in caught fire and is a 100% total loss.
The really hard part is that I lost my only child (son) in the fire. The last 10 or so days have really been rough.

I am so sorry for your loss. Words can't express.

 

[Murray Brook]

@KMart
I am so sorry for your loss. Just can't imagine how you feel. Prayers for you and your family.

 

[jds holler]

And so just today I loaded some H380 that can't be a day less than 70 years old.

Kmart, I'm so sorry to hear about your tragedy and loss. May the Lord help you and your family recover from this horrible loss. jd

 

[Bill Norris]

Prayers for You and your Family.

 

[Wild Bill IV]

Thank you for this information. Reloaders can propagate misinformation quickly.

I keep my powders in complete environmental control, between 25 to 45 % humidity. My 8lb containers are dispersed into one lb containers for use and never poured back into the 8lb jug.

I frequently scan my powders with a laser thermometer for consistency. I'm not sure if this will give me an early indication of powder deterioration.?

I just checked my Enduron IMR powders for smell and visual conformation, they all are perfectly fine.

I am lucky!!! I live in western Kansas where the humidity is low except for passing storms!! Even with snow on the ground, the low temperatures and wind keep the air fairly dry!! My reloading room is in the basement with 8" unipour concrete walls, 1-1/2" furring strips, filled with 1-1/2" foam board, plastic vapor barrier, and 1/2" sheet rock!!! The ceiling is suspended 2'x4' recessed sound tile!!! Another good thermal insulator!! Very stable temperature and %H20 in the room and the whole basement!!! The powder is kept in an upper cabinet where drafts from central air don't affect temperature of the powder!!!

I always shut the HVAC vent off and set the powder on the bench the night before a reloading session!!? It eliminates drafts on the ADI scales/V4 trickler and allows powder thermal equilibrium to the room temp!!

 

[Wild Bill IV]

I have about 5 pounds of 4166. I have checked it looks and smells fine. But due to a recent personal experience with a house fire, I think I will be very cautious and take it out and burn it. Not worth the chance.
Sunday night/Monday morning, 5-13-2024, the home that I grew up in caught fire and is a 100% total loss.
The really hard part is that I lost my only child (son) in the fire. The last 10 or so days have really been rough.

May God be with you!!!
Keep looking to the sky and stars, your answers are there!! It's tough, really really tough!!! Pull yourself up, stand tall like your son wanted!!! Look into your heart, his love is there!!! Be proud of being his father and cherish his love for you!!! Feel that love!!! Stay on that path of love that the Shepard is leading you down!!! Let go!!! Fill the love around you, people you don't know are praying for you!! My prayers are with you!!
STAND TALL!!! STAY TALL!!!

 

[DLT]

Well this thread sure made me stand up and take note. After reading it last night, I hot footed out to the shop to check the 8133 and 7977 I have.
The partial can of 7977 smelled a little "off".
Not quite acidy or acrid but it just didn't smell right.
Compared it to a fresh, unopened can and there was a noticeable difference. I'll have to dispose of the partial can and keep an eyeball on the others.

More info: I just cracked open (another) new can of 7977 bought back in 2016. The fumes that came out of the can almost stopped breathing. Very acidic odor came from the can.
This stuff has me concerned. I just pulled all 8 lbs of enduron powder out of the shop.
I don't need any "middle of the night " surprises.

Give them a few days. I checked today where I was vs the sunshine and i thought i was in the shade but that was not correct. Full sun till it popped

 

[Wild Bill IV]

I’ve heard that about dynamite which is probably same thing.

I remember dynamite in the wooden crates!!! The sticks that were sweating were the most dangerous!!! Find a stump, drill a few holes into the roots, drop the sweaty sticks with fuses, light the fuses and run!!! Some of the sticks were light blasts, and others were more powerful then dry stick!!! But, the sweaty sticks were all destroyed along with the stump's grip in the earth!!!

 

[jds holler]

I own, and still use a lot of the old Hodgdon powder from both surplus WWII stock, and manufactured in the 50's and 60's. What I've found regarding long term storage, is that the stuff that is stored in the metal cans with screw caps, seems to last forever. I've got both 4895, and 4831 that was purchased in bulk from war surplus stocks, and stored in old metal Wesson Oil, and paint thinner cans. They're in great shape. -- better than the metal 8 lb jugs used in the seventies with the plastic spouts (that don't seal as well)

I also live in a generally cool dry climate which must be pretty good for storing almost anything.

I'll admit to also buying and shooting a lot of new stock - for exorbitant prices, but it's been nice to have the old stuff to fall back on, and it always seems to work fine. jd

 

[Fast14riot]

I'm still working off the last keg of XMR4350 for my 6-250. It must be 30+ years old. Have some old surplus H4831 I've shot a lot, too. All stored in my basement at a relatively constant temp and humidity.

I've posed the question a while ago about using a purge gas in powder containers, only to be told its completely unnecessary, and short of being scoffed at, was a ridiculous idea. I have dry 134A purge gas available to me through work, used for urethane foam resins which react with moisture in the air and go bad. I may just start using it, along with saran wrap over the mouth before closing it back up. Better safe and ridiculous than sorry.

RE: the "explosion". Degrading powder into nitrous acid, rain and aforementioned deteriorated seal, adding water to acid = exothermic reaction that reached ignition temperature. A long version of simple chemistry. Good news, you caught it in time and it was in a safe space at the time of failure.

 

[KMart]

Just finished up burning off the 4166. I also had about a pound of Tubal 3000 that would never be used for anything, so it went too. The burn rate for the T-3000 shows to be in the area of 8208.
An observation I made that may or may not mean a dang thing was, when burning similar amounts of the 2 powders, the 4166 took 1-2 seconds to burn off. The T-3000 took 2-4 seconds.

 

[Walt Krafft]

I have a pound of 4166 and 4451. Offered for sale at a swap meet with no takers. They will join about a pound of mixed pull down powder in starting the next dozer deck on fire. I am done with imr powder.

 

[358WCF]

The newest meds have screwed with my sense of smell, but it seems to be coming back after stopping them 2 weeks ago. There's a 2019 can of 4166 here. I dont get the usual gunpowder smell, but a faint smell like maybe chlorine? The jug of 4451 doesn't smell like this.

Maybe the remaining 4166 would be good for starting that burnpile of brush & tree limbs in the back yard. The wind is down & rain this afternoon they say. Unimpressed with the Enduron powders so far anyway.

 

[hpshooter]

I have about 5 pounds of 4166. I have checked it looks and smells fine. But due to a recent personal experience with a house fire, I think I will be very cautious and take it out and burn it. Not worth the chance.
Sunday night/Monday morning, 5-13-2024, the home that I grew up in caught fire and is a 100% total loss.
The really hard part is that I lost my only child (son) in the fire. The last 10 or so days have really been rough.

Prayers for you and your family in the loss of your son.

 

[DLT]

I have a pound of 4166 and 4451. Offered for sale at a swap meet with no takers. They will join about a pound of mixed pull down powder in starting the next dozer deck on fire. I am done with imr powder.

Between this and imr 4350 for $74.99 at the local cabelas I’m not going to get anymore

 

[tiny68]

This is was my experience with IMR 4007 SSC from earlier in the year. Read to down to that last posts in the thread for the update.

https://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/imr-4007-ssc.4028217/#post-38863349

Tim

 

[Kracken McGraw]

I have a pound of 4166 and 4451. Offered for sale at a swap meet with no takers. They will join about a pound of mixed pull down powder in starting the next dozer deck on fire. I am done with imr powder.

This is somewhat worrisome. I have a pretty good investment in both of these powders. Maybe I should put them in a good container in the outside cellar.

 

[rijndael]

This is somewhat worrisome.

Why is it worrisome?

People who haven't tried them don't want to invest time and bullets/primers in to load development if they can't get any more. If it weren't for covid supply issues, I wouldn't have tried 4166.

 

[Kracken McGraw]

Why is it worrisome?

People who haven't tried them don't want to invest time and bullets/primers in to load development if they can't get any more. If it weren't for covid supply issues, I wouldn't have tried 4166.

I really like the 4451 in the 6x47L and the 6.5 Creedmoor. The worrisome part is that I store it in plastic utility boxes in my house connected garage.
Dry climate though and not really any chance of moisture contact.

 

[Kracken McGraw]

But it wasn't discontinued for safety reasons.

This is my feeling too, but this thread is stirring up a storm( so to speak) and maybe unjustified.