Any Of you Playing with Cast Bullets ?

[mikeinct]

Powder... Yes Sir, I'm going to try Red Dot in a smaller dose than Unique I have been using. After that I'm going to try a reduced load of 4895 & some filler.. Then a new mold...

 

[243winxb]

Barrel condition is most important to me.

My Rem 760 in 3006 was so rough from the factory, it fouled to badly with cast.
The Tubb FinialFinish kit, may be something to try?

My 1903 Springfield with the orginial, well used barrel, was not much better. Back in the day, new surplus barrels were $25. Cost $5 to have it head spaced. Made a great fun shooter out of it.

The Win 94, 30 wcf did ok, not great.

 

[lazyMlazyK]

I cast .311 bullets for a .30-30 and a .30-06, and also cast for my 9mm. Everything gets powdercoated and gas-checked. I've found that I really enjoy plinking loads in the .30-30 and .30-06 using Unique, and actually get pretty good accuracy out of the .30-06 with it. 1" at 100 yards, scoped. Might have to run it over a chrono one of these days, but I'm guessing it's around 1600-1700fps. Would be great fun for rabbits or squirrel!

 

[XTR]

I just took delivery on a Ruger #3 with #1 furniture that I bought specifically for shooting cast bullets.

my experience before this one I've only cast for my 45-70s. This is to be a hunting rig and at some point I do plan to start powdercoating. In rifles I'd agree with the post above, soft alloys for expansion and gas checks, at least for my application. I'm looking for a MV that sort of simulates the original 30-40 loads but a tad faster (the Ruger is a different beast than the original Krag) Something on the order of a 170 to 200 gr bullet at about 2000fps. I'm getting a couple of molds for experimenting.

If you are running faster than about 1400FPS you will need either gas checks or paper patching.

 

[Louisiana Shooter]

Paper patching has the added benefit of smoothing out a bore over time too. I've got one barrel that looks like a mirror with a bore scope. It is a factory barrel. H&R 45-70......You don't have to worry about leading at all. Big bores arre easier to patch of course.......but any of them can be patched.

 

[451whitworth]

Barrel condition is most important to me.

My Rem 760 in 3006 was so rough from the factory, it fouled to badly with cast.
The Tubb FinialFinish kit, may be something to try?

I have a 1894 Winchester 25-35 made in 1918 that has a rough as a cob bore from corrosive ammo. It was way too rough for cast as is so I tried the Tubb Final Finish kit in it last summer. It worked pretty darn good as I was skeptical since the bore was so bad although the rifling is strong. The Tubb FF knocked the major roughness out and now you can push a cotton patch down the bore and it doesn't come out all fuzzed up like before. The instructions say the max amount it will remove is 3/10,000" (.0003"). I have fire lapped a few barrels with cast bullets and the LBT lap kit but there needs to be some semblance of acceptable barrel condition before hand.

 

[Wolfdog91]

Did some testing yesterday with cast and powder coated .223

 

[fatelvis]

These are an absolute must for accurate cast rifle loading:

.312 x .308 Exp. Plug | NOE Bullet Moulds

noebulletmolds.com

 

[Wolfdog91]

These are an absolute must for accurate cast rifle loading:

.312 x .308 Exp. Plug | NOE Bullet Moulds

noebulletmolds.com

I've seen though though never really under stood them. Care to explain?

 

[C_Ackley]

I've seen though though never really under stood them. Care to explain?

Appear to be the plugs put in an expander die that come into contact with the case mouth. I just use the Lee universal expander die and the plugs it came with.

 

[451whitworth]

I've seen though though never really under stood them. Care to explain?

They expand the neck of the cartridge case to accept the increased diameter of cast bullets. Standard FL dies are set up for jacketed bullets, they usually expand the neck to around .002" smaller than actual bullet diameter. Example: 30-06 case after resizing has ID of neck approx .306" to accept .308" jacketed bullet so case neck tension is snug to hold bullet. When shooting an oversize cast bullet of .311" diameter in the same cartridge it can cause problems. Trying to seat a .311" projectile in a .306" neck can cause the cast bullet to be damaged when seated. Obviously a cast bullet is not as hard as a jacketed bullet. A cast bullet can have it's diameter squeezed down or even shave lead off the side of the bullet if the neck isn't expanded larger. In bottle neck cartridges i like to expand necks .001" under cast bullet diameter with annealed brass so they seat without damage. Then close the neck flare with a Lee Factory Crimp Die.

 

[C_Ackley]

May be a question for Cast Boolits, but does anyone have any experience about the difference between HiTek coated bullets vs Non-Coated bullets in the same load. POI changes or any notable differences?
Currently only have coated bullets, but will be required to use uncoated later, can I develop a load using them and expect similar results from the uncoated ones?

 

[BJung]

The OP stated that the performance of his .35cal cast bullets are not performing well. From what I know, the first question I'd asked is if you slugged your barrel? It's said that a high bhn bullet can still lead your barrel and not shoot well if your bullet diameter is too small to the bore. And so, find some pure lead, lube it with something like Imperial Wax, and shove it through your barrel with a wood dowel. You can find pure lead from a BP shooter or a fisherman (split shots). Then, find a drill bit that's just larger than your bore and drill a shallow hole in a 2x4. Take your ladle and melt the lead and fill that hole. Then, dig it out, clean it up, use it as your slug. The second thing you need to know is the bhn of your lead. For rifle, you need a higher bhn than pistol pressure loads. I'll assume you're using scrap lead. Cast your cleaned lead into ingots and let it sit for a over a month. I waited up to six months. Why? because the lead molecules are rearranging themselves still. I've experienced measuring the bhn of an ingot hours after I cast the ingot and then months later and the bhn changed. Keep that in mind if you're going to cast hundreds of bullets. With your bhn known, you should shoot for Lyman #2 bhn. Your alloy might not be the same but Lyman #2 is a proven allloy for hunting bullets. I measure my bhn with lead art pencils. The various lead hardness will scratch lead with different bhn. You can use a lower bhn lead, why? The third thing you need to ask is how fresh are my cast bullets? As I stated earlier, the bhn will change over time. You can temper a softer bhn alloy by dropping your PC'd bullet that's 400 degrees out of the oven and drop it in cold water. With a bhn close to Lyman #2 and a meplate, you're good. Why? because a sharp tip will pencil through your game. If you don't have a meplate, file some of the tip flat. Two other ways to get a softer tip is first to submerge the shank of your bullet in that cold water and leaving the front portion that doesn't come into contact with the rifling out. Then take a propane torch to heat it to remove the tempering. I've only read about this. The best test It can think of is take a bullet and squeeze flat in a vice. Then, test the bhn on the tip and shank using the lead pencils. Third, how hot is your molten lead? If you pour your alloy at different temperatures, your bullet weight will vary. Pouring frosty bullets look good but the molecules won't cast the bullets the best. I think I cast my bullets at around 720 degrees according to my lead thermometer. Some online casters recommend turning your pot down until your lead starts to solidify, then add 100 degrees to that. Make sure your pot doesn't run low because that could effect bullet weight consistency. Fourth, how are you pouring your lead into your mold. I've personally noticed that when I poured my lead into the sprue plate hole or wherever so the lead would run it, bullet weights varied. My bullet weights were more consistent if I swirled the lead into the mold by holding the mold at an angle and pouring the lead at a corner of the sprue plate hole. That way, the liquid lead is pouring into the mold like and ice cream cone smoothy than poured into a cup making bubbles. I drop my bullets on a towel or on the ground because the lead bullet will be heated again and tempered after I PC the bullets. I add a gas check to my bullets. I believe that a gas check prevents a bullets base from obturating under pressure. Think of it this way. If you were a human cannon ball, would you prefer to stand on a thick piece of wood plate with maybe even sheet metal added or a cardboard box? Fifth, group your bullets by weight. Sixth, I like to lube my PC bullets using my RCBS case lube and pad that never gets used anymore because of I now use Hornady One Shot. Lubing the PC bullet makes sizing easier. And last, about seating your bullets. I use an RCBS plug. Some prefer the Lyman M die. I chose the RCBS plus because the plug expands the inside case neck diameter .001" under the bullet diameter. If not, I bought a large plug and plan to use a lathe to turn it down. The RCBS plug also flares the case mouth like the Lee die. This is just what I know and do. Some of you already know this. Others may not so that's why I listed it. Good luck and have fun. That's why we are all here.

 

[mikeinct]

BJung Wrote " The OP stated that the performance of his .35cal cast bullets are not performing well" OP here, Eh NO, not correct. problem is the 4 30 caliber cast bullet shooters are not performing as well as my .375 & .357 caliber cast bullets. I'm going out testing today [5 rifles in 30 cal.] Wish Me Luck. mikeinct

 

[BJung]

BJung Wrote " The OP stated that the performance of his .35cal cast bullets are not performing well" OP here, Eh NO, not correct. problem is the 4 30 caliber cast bullet shooters are not performing as well as my .375 & .357 caliber cast bullets. I'm going out testing today [5 rifles in 30 cal.] Wish Me Luck. mikeinct

Sorry I'm off MikeinCT. Please send a photo of your target.

 

[fatelvis]

BJung Wrote " The OP stated that the performance of his .35cal cast bullets are not performing well" OP here, Eh NO, not correct. problem is the 4 30 caliber cast bullet shooters are not performing as well as my .375 & .357 caliber cast bullets. I'm going out testing today [5 rifles in 30 cal.] Wish Me Luck. mikeinct

Make sure all the boolits are gas checked, sized to .310” or .311”, lubed well with a good RIFLE suitable lube, and don’t push them too fast. Keep them under 1700fps, and you should do well.

 

[JSH]

The term you have to walk before you can run comes to mind. I will say I have chased my tail a lot playing with CB’s.

Rough bores won’t shoot cast, why would the shoot anything?
A C-L-E-A-N, clean rough bore will shoot cast. No maybe not up to match standards, it won’t lead either.
There is enough info on this forum to read over on how to really clean a bore.
Carbon is a big subject here. Milsurps may and can have layers and layers of carbon and gilding metal, I have cleaned 03 and 03A3 barrels that I was told were worn out, nope packed full of crap and gunk.

If you think a gascheck is a cure all, it could very well be covering up an underlying issue, wether it is the gun,alloy,size, lube,loading habits or a few other things. I use gaschecks only because the mold is a GC design. I have seen and heard still, guys using GC type molds with no check and say they have great luck with it, wonderful glad for you. I see it as not putting tires on your rims.

Sorting, I sort by eye on small stuff, 35 caliber and under. If it doesn’t look exactly like the inside of the mold, it’s a cull. I will weigh some if I am gosh awful serious about groups, but the majority of the time I see and measure little difference, usually if it is imperfect to the eye it was to cold or too hot or you were out of rhythm casting.

That is something I didn’t see touched on, rhythm. Get a good rhythm and molds will fill out with nice bullets. FYI I have found molds to be like a car load of women, they all have their likes and dislikes, no two the same.

 

[mikeinct]

It Was Coming together today, Gents. The Vintage Winchester About an inch at fifty yards. The 308 w a Savage sporter Barrel liked both bullets 113gr Lee & the 163 gr RCBS. The old '06 was behaving nicely. Used both old Unique & new Red Dot Charges. The 7.62 x 39mm CZ 527 is not as happy just yet. Learned a few things today. Hopefully next outing I'll have some show off groups. Shot them all hard n fast & dirty.

 

[Cbashooter]

It Was Coming together today, Gents. The Vintage Winchester About an inch at fifty yards. The 308 w a Savage sporter Barrel liked both bullets 113gr Lee & the 163 gr RCBS. The old '06 was behaving nicely. Used both old Unique & new Red Dot Charges. The 7.62 x 39mm CZ 527 is not as happy just yet. Learned a few things today. Hopefully next outing I'll have some show off groups. Shot them all hard n fast & dirty.

The CZ has one anwser....Lee Ed Harris 7.62x39 design and drive it about 1600 fps.
I use 2400 or H4227 to achieve this.

 

[CharlieNC]

At our range in Charlotte there are about fifteen old codgers who are cast bullet specialists who shoot together every Wednesday, and more individually doing ongoing testing. BR pistols and rifles. They have a couple of matches monthly, and have won a number of national competitions and records, but ageing out of that now due to health issues. A number have been fighting cancer, and I wonder if lead fumes could be a contributor?