Annealing 30BR brass

[TommyD11730]

Annealing 30BR brass

Perhaps a more correct thread topic should read; " 100 and 1 ways to ruin your brass".

So, last weekend I was loading some 30BR. I was using Peterson brass (6-10 firings) and Barts 112s to develop a new load.
When I seated my first projectile it felt "soft". My K & M force pack showed a little over 20lbs. Ok, that's lower than the 35lbs I'm used to seeing.
Set that one aside... fouler.
Next one... same.. ok, 2 foulers.
It repeated itself over and over for all 50 rounds. They didn't shoot particularly well. 5 round groups @ 100Y were .290s". My Berger groups (different brass) shot about .2 flat
Without going into details I'm beginning to think I could have over annealed the Peterson brass. I took a piece, resized it, ran a mandral through it and resized it again. (Trying to work harden it) Only ran a brush through it and seated a projectile.
25 lbs force.

So... is there a way to work harden the brass?

Thanks!

 

[20PPC]

I anneal my Lapua 30 BR brass on a Annie for 2.1 seconds, necks are turned to .011.
I seating pressure on my force pack is typically 16-18# and has no problem shooting really small groups.
I also have some Peterson brass that one of my grandsons shoots in his rifle, it is a much harder composition.
I anneal it for 2.2 seconds and the seating force is 30-35# and it shoots small groups as well.
I wouldn't think it is over annealed.

 

[AlNyhus]

So... is there a way to work harden the brass?

Thanks!

Yes. Size the whole neck, then expand it with a mandrel. Rinse and repeat until it's where you want it to be.

Good shootin' -Al

 

[TommyD11730]

Yes. Size the whole neck, then expand it with a mandrel. Rinse and repeat until it's where you want it to be.

Good shootin' -Al

Thanks Al. I used a Redding neck bushing die and mandrel 5x on a few cases.

I'll give a few a try tonight.

 

[Fire Dog]

Thanks Al. I used a Redding neck bushing die and mandrel 5x on a few cases.

I'll give a few a try tonight.

I have to say that my AMP has never over annealed any of my Peterson brass…
Some of my 6BR cases are going onto 18-24 reloads.
If budget allows, why would you want the guess work of flame annealing and the fire risk?

 

[Straightshooter1]

I have to say that my AMP has never over annealed any of my Peterson brass…
Some of my 6BR cases are going onto 18-24 reloads.
If budget allows, why would you want the guess work of flame annealing and the fire risk?

If he gets that Webster Hardness Tester from Amazon, he won't need to guess and that'll be a lot cheaper than an AMP.

 

[Kevin1990]

I anneal or ("draw-back" I believe its called) my brass every 5 or so firings. I'm no where near the temps of truly annealing. According to my super accurate way of applying tempilaq to the neck and shoulder and watching the flame hit it and awaiting for color change. I'll hit around 600 degrees for a few seconds and let it drop into some water immediately after. I've found no accuracy loss with the first firing, and I think it brings the brass back to life and helps bump shoulders more consistently and seating consistency, as far as neck tension is concerned. I have read and asked many a shooter on here and have read posts that stated after annealing, the brass wouldn't shoot competitively until after it was fired one time. Not answering your question, but figured id give my two cents.

 

[Ccrider]

There is a good bit of variation in Peterson 6br brass depending on the lot number.

 

[Webster]

Annealing 30BR brass

Perhaps a more correct thread topic should read; " 100 and 1 ways to ruin your brass".

So, last weekend I was loading some 30BR. I was using Peterson brass (6-10 firings) and Barts 112s to develop a new load.
When I seated my first projectile it felt "soft". My K & M force pack showed a little over 20lbs. Ok, that's lower than the 35lbs I'm used to seeing.
Set that one aside... fouler.
Next one... same.. ok, 2 foulers.
It repeated itself over and over for all 50 rounds. They didn't shoot particularly well. 5 round groups @ 100Y were .290s". My Berger groups (different brass) shot about .2 flat
Without going into details I'm beginning to think I could have over annealed the Peterson brass. I took a piece, resized it, ran a mandral through it and resized it again. (Trying to work harden it) Only ran a brush through it and seated a projectile.
25 lbs force.

So... is there a way to work harden the brass?

Thanks!

How do you anneal. If the neck just gets red for 1-2 seconds you are not dropping the hardness of the brass very much. You’re assuming it's soft without having any idea what the hardness is. A good test is to squeeze the neck gently with pliers on an unannealed case and one you annealed. I think you will find it takes the same amount of force to make the neck very slightly oval. Just squeeze it may Maybe 5 thou. You can toss the case or run a mandrel into it.

It's harder than most guys think it is to get a big drop in hardness. You would probably need red for 5 sec or more.

In Erik Cortina's video after annealing with a Bench Source annealer he shows bullet seating pressures all over. To me this means seating force variation is not simple. Maybe 2-3 things cause the variation.

My annealing study I did at work. Time is total time in a lab furnace. I didn't do shorter times because I didn't know how long it took to reach temp. 1100F for 15 seconds the hardness only dropped about 5 hardness units. Hardness starts to drop rapidly at 15 seconds at 1150F. 1-2 seconds, at 1050F should have practically no softening. The heating rates in a furnace at constant temp would be a lot slower than a torch on the neck at maybe 2800F.