Alec Baldwin shot and killed someone on set

[Bill Norris]

It ALL goes back to responsibility of the gun being loaded. Baldwin is the trigger puller and shares that responsibility.

 

[troupe]

They will be just as responsible in the negligence and could also be charged, but Baldwin pulled the trigger. Involuntary Manslaughter per NM law. There may be some defense arguments on the others involved, but it is cut and dried on Baldwin's action, although Baldwin's attorneys will do what they will get paid for. The reason Baldwin is in New England away from the media as much as possible.

 

[CarlGeorge]

That's not totally true. Baldwin was not just an actor he is one of the producers. It has been reported ( if one can believe what is reported) that just days before this happened his stunt double had an incident where he thought a gun he was handling on the set was safe and it discharged two live rounds, fortunately no one was harmed. If you were in charge of the production (the producer) wouldn't you have halted production until this incident was investigated and corrective measures were taken so that it wouldn't happen again? If the person in charge doesn't see that corrective action is taken when something like this happens then they are just as responsible as the gun expert.

Beyond it being tragic he was both the actor in the incident as well as the producer (part of management), it is also interesting this is the situation.

If you or I (or anyone familiar with firearms) saw a negligent discharge it would, of course, raise all sorts of red flags for us and....assuming we were in charge in some way......we'd call a "cease production" and assess and modify processes so as to not have it happen again.

But presuming AB isn't familiar with the ins and outs of firearm safety, he might chalk up a negligent discharge to being one of those things that happens when handling guns..... i.e. "normal". He may not (probably not?) have understood the seriousness of a negligent discharge.

I'm not defending him in any way. If you're the boss you gotta know this stuff. It's yet another example where if they're gonna play with guns.....they gotta have gun knowledgeable people around.

 

[rr2030]

Is that number FIREARM related or does include stunt man crashing, burning, trying to fly?

Did you glance at the article ? I inserted a link for doing so.

 

[rr2030]

Baldwin will be held harmless. They are frantically looking for the evidence to place the blame on someone other than Baldwin. In the end, Hollywood and the medial will point out that no matter how careful you are, how experienced you are, even the masters of firearms have "accidents" and thats why firearms are SO dangerous. Not even safe in the hands of experts let alone the general public. This tragity will be used as ammunition against firearm ownership.

 

[jghoghunter]

I quit reading this thread a couple of days ago. I cannot believe this is not been closed for no further replies! We all know she's dead her family is going to get a big pile of money and he's going to walk away with basically nothing what more is there to know!

 

[Kracken McGraw]

Maybe, but in what way?

Is he more concerned with how this affects himself or the victims?
Will he continue to have dealings in profiting from and supporting entertainment which promotes the use of firearms and violence?
Will he educate himself and promote that education to others in the use of firearms?
Or will he take on a greater activist role against firearms and try and appease his conscience that way when it wasn't the firearm or firearm manufacturer's fault - trying to shift blame?

If he took on a role promoting safe gun handling education and an activist role against Hollywood using weapons to profit from then I would give him credit. I don't see it happening though.

I would never assume someone with his well publicized background and activities to have a conscience based on what your average person considers normal. He may, but crediting him with it would not be automatic. His actions will show that.

However he processes the event in his own mind, he will never escape the fact that he has taken a life with a firearm. What that would mean to you or I may be a completely different thing with him.

My money’s on ?#4.

 

[INTJ]

I’m not pulling a trigger on a person assuming a “cold gun.” These are all unique incidents that must be fully investigated. I can remember clearly in 2006 Cheney intending to shoot his shotgun, hitting and causing a heart attack and lodging pellets in the neck and chest of his friend. Everyone agreed it was an accident and if Cheney were to have been jailed for that, it would be unjust. The Cheney example is clearest of when charges are not appropriate, except alcohol was consumed, but still.

They will get to the bottom of this.

I remember the Cheney incident as well. IIRC, Cheney's partner had moved forward of the place he was supposed to be. Then again, that happens in bird hunting. Still, Cheney was the one who didn't clear his line of fire and shot his friend. Cheney took full responsibility, saying something like whether or not his partner wasn't where he was supposed to be, Cheney said he himself was responsible because he didn't clear his line of fire.

No charges were filed against Cheney. If the person pulling the trigger is always the most responsible, Cheney should have been charged, as would virtually every other person who has accidentally shot someone.

Based on receiving many USAF accident briefings, I see this in terms of contributing factors and causal factors.

Contributing factors:

1. Leadership: Negligent attitude toward safety on the set

2. Training: Questionable training of Armorer and Actors in firearms use

3. Safety: Failure to keep all loaded ammo off the set, allowing a loaded gun to be on the set, failure of the Armorer to check gun, failure to check gun by the guy who said it was cold, failure of Baldwin to check weapon himself

Causal factors:

1. Baldwin pointing the gun at a person and pulling the trigger

 

[Idaho-Lefty]

Just learned THIS, this AM,..
Baldwins Father, TAUGHT,.. Gun Safety and Rifle shooting to, High school Kids !
AB, should HAVE,. KNOWN, better about,.. Guns !
An "entitled" and stupid guy, = NEGLIGENT, Homicide ???

 

[Mark W]

It ALL goes back to responsibility of the gun being loaded. Baldwin is the trigger puller and shares that responsibility.

That is a fact to “most” gun owners.

Unfortunately, those people who have not been trained in safe gun handling procedures simply do not understand the gravity of pointing a gun at someone.

There is not a human on the planet that could hand me a gun that I would point at another human without checking it first. In fact, I couldn’t intentionally point a gun unloaded or not at someone that I didn’t intend to kill.

 

[Bill Norris]

That is a fact to “most” gun owners.

Unfortunately, those people who have not been trained in safe gun handling procedures simply do not understand the gravity of pointing a gun at someone.

There is not a human on the planet that could hand me a gun that I would point at another human without checking it first. In fact, I couldn’t intentionally point a gun unloaded or not at someone that I didn’t intend to kill.

+ 1 Absolutely.

 

[Macropod]

The plot thickens. The victim's husband may have been investigating something to do with the Klyntens.

 

[Ccrider]

That is a fact to “most” gun owners.

Unfortunately, those people who have not been trained in safe gun handling procedures simply do not understand the gravity of pointing a gun at someone.

There is not a human on the planet that could hand me a gun that I would point at another human without checking it first. In fact, I couldn’t intentionally point a gun unloaded or not at someone that I didn’t intend to kill.

Problem is that many raise their kids playing cops and robbers or cowboys and Indians, freely pointing play guns/cap guns at each other and pulling the trigger. Oh yea, don’t forget the video games that kids play. My thought has always been that these things desensitize gun safety.

I will say that this event is truly tragic and I have true sympathy for those involved. Although I do not agree with his politics, Baldwin is not a murderer. He made a tragic mistake. I have made a few screw ups myself, and am glad that I have been shown grace to live through them without major harm being caused.

Some of the remarks above are due reflection and reconsideration. I believe we are all accountable for the humanity we show each other, regardless of our differences.

 

[jelenko]

As much as I like to villify Baldwin, I think deep down inside he will regret not having inspected the fireatm prior to pulling the trigger. He will regret not obtaining the knowledge, interest , or habbit of properly clearing a firearm. He depended on others and they, along with him failed and a young lady is gone forever. He will forever want what everyone in his situation wants, that momnet before it went bang back.

No winners here

So, means no consequences because he feels bad?

 

[Ccrider]

So, means no consequences because he feels bad?

Are you serious? No consequences? If ever there are consequences for doing something wrong, there has to be if one takes a human life.
Perhaps you are confusing the term consequences with punishment. If so, our form of government leaves that issue to be resolved by our judicial system, and ultimately a jury of one’s peers.

 

[jelenko]

Are you serious? No consequences? If ever there are consequences for doing something wrong, there has to be if one takes a human life.
Perhaps you are confusing the term consequences with punishment. If so, our form of government leaves that issue to be resolved by our judicial system, and ultimately a jury of one’s peers.

You're missing the statement that I quoted and was responding to. Try reading it again

 

[JEFFPPC]

Problem is that many raise their kids playing cops and robbers or cowboys and Indians, freely pointing play guns/cap guns at each other and pulling the trigger. Oh yea, don’t forget the video games that kids play. My thought has always been that these things desensitize gun safety.

I will say that this event is truly tragic and I have true sympathy for those involved. Although I do not agree with his politics, Baldwin is not a murderer. He made a tragic mistake. I have made a few screw ups myself, and am glad that I have been shown grace to live through them without major harm being caused.

Some of the remarks above are due reflection and reconsideration. I believe we are all accountable for the humanity we show each other, regardless of our differences.

Where I grew up Crider we played cops and robbers, cowboys and indians, along with army. Army in the woods with Red Ryders, had to shot below the belt, was no game for sissys. None of us from a lower economic section of town ever killed anyone, robbed anyone or went to jail. Many of us served in the military. Let me tell you, playing army with bb guns did not desensitized us. So don't make excuses for AB. Just another low life Hollywood liberal who feels the rules don't apply to him. Seems like another accident when someone is getting ready to blow the whistle on the Clintons. He deserves to serve a manslaughter sentence . AB was totally irresponsible at best. Given the facts about problems with saftey on the set he shoud have been overly careful. I wonder if he was immeadiatly tested for dugs and alcohol, or did he skate on that. I doubt we will ever know the complete truth.

 

[rr2030]

So, means no consequences because he feels bad?

So, means no consequences because he feels bad?

That's what you got from my post, really ? Wow.

 

[Ccrider]

Where I grew up Crider we played cops and robbers, cowboys and indians, along with army. Army in the woods with Red Ryders, had to shot below the belt, was no game for sissys. None of us from a lower economic section of town ever killed anyone, robbed anyone or went to jail. Many of us served in the military. Let me tell you, playing army with bb guns did not desensitized us. So don't make excuses for AB. Just another low life Hollywood liberal who feels the rules don't apply to him. Seems like another accident when someone is getting ready to blow the whistle on the Clintons. He deserves to serve a manslaughter sentence . AB was totally irresponsible at best. Given the facts about problems with saftey on the set he shoud have been overly careful. I wonder if he was immeadiatly tested for dugs and alcohol, or did he skate on that. I doubt we will ever know the complete truth.

No doubt. Problem is, things have changed a hell of a lots from when we grew up. These kids and young adults ain’t the same.
I was taught to handle my Red Ryder just like you handle a firearm. And, I had my share of cap guns.

Don’t matter what AB’s politics are. Has zero bearing on the mistake he made. Safe gun handling is the same for republicans, democrats or independents. Just punishment should be the same too.

 

[Richard308]

Wonder if alcohol was in play?

or coke.