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7mm Federal Backcountry

RegionRat said:
But not always, so that can be a very dangerous assumption in a short bbl context.
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And that’s the reason for the question. Specifically concerning suppressors.

Thunderbeast is a good example by listing minimum barrel lengths for certain cartridges. You have to reverse engineer loads to try and get some sort of an idea of pressure thresholds.

Using their 30 caliber Suppressors as an example, minimum barrel lengths for a 28 Nosler or 7mm RUM, vary quite a bit

28 Nosler
Ultra- 18”
Dominus- 22”
Magnus- 16”

7 RUM
Ultra- 22”
Dominus- 26”
Magnus- 14.5”

Seems like jumping into a 20” barreled 7mm Backcountry and just screwing on your existing suppressor might be a pretty bad idea.
 
Personally, I don't see this cartridge getting very far down the Military Highway, even a lot less on the Civilian Turnpike. When you compare the ballistics to the .277 Fury, Sig has theirs headed in the right direction. It appears you can reload just standard brass as well as their brass/steel hybrid using powders that are available. Loaded ammo can be purchased with, as I recall, the 113 grain bullet at 80,000 psi. So far it doesn't look like anyone is wildcatting this cartridge as since it's case size is comparable to the .308 I would have thought someone would be necking it down to a 6mm or .25 for sure. 115 DTACs sent out a 24-26 inch barrel with 80K PSI would be F-A-S-T, I would think.
 
Riesel said:
Personally, I don't see this cartridge getting very far down the Military Highway, even a lot less on the Civilian Turnpike. When you compare the ballistics to the .277 Fury, Sig has theirs headed in the right direction. It appears you can reload just standard brass as well as their brass/steel hybrid using powders that are available. Loaded ammo can be purchased with, as I recall, the 113 grain bullet at 80,000 psi. So far it doesn't look like anyone is wildcatting this cartridge as since it's case size is comparable to the .308 I would have thought someone would be necking it down to a 6mm or .25 for sure. 115 DTACs sent out a 24-26 inch barrel with 80K PSI would be F-A-S-T, I would think.
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The hybrid case will also ring the chambers.... extraction will get worse and worse over x amount of rounds fired.

Sig is doing coatings and metal treatments etc... for the mil guns that I do know. Civilian guns I haven't heard of anything.

They tested our 400modBB material also. It helped with the ringing of the chamber but didn't eliminate it.
 
Like some others already have said, Federal has create a problem that didn’t exist. Just like their 224 Valkyrie, I predict this caliber to quickly become a thing of the past, hence the nickname 7mm Bankruptcy one of you already mentioned.

Hornady’s new creation of 7mm PRC was totally justified as it supersedes the belted 7mm Rem Mag with some solid improvements. Federal is just being a sore thumb that they didn’t come up with this sooner and wanted to quickly make the PRC obsolete before it really take off.
 
shamrock12 said:
Like some others already have said, Federal has create a problem that didn’t exist. Just like their 224 Valkyrie, I predict this caliber to quickly become a thing of the past, hence the nickname 7mm Bankruptcy one of you already mentioned.

Hornady’s new creation of 7mm PRC was totally justified as it supersedes the belted 7mm Rem Mag with some solid improvements. Federal is just being a sore thumb that they didn’t come up with this sooner and wanted to quickly make the PRC obsolete before it really take off.
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Federal is just monetizing technology they already paid to develop for a D.O.D. proposal. They aren't going bankrupt by selling ammo. Would you have them put their R&D costs on the shelf? That's the road to bankruptcy.

There is a market for shorter barreled rifles with suppressors, that have the same performance as cartridges in a long barrel. The 7BC IS the 7PRC in a shorter barrel.

Also this new Peak alloy will be made in other cartridges. In the video posted below, Geissele Automatics is shooting 5.56mm in Peak Alloy cases. It has an average velocity of 3168 fps vs. the same 64gr. bullet in a brass case of 2846 fps out of a 14.5" barrel. That's an increase of 322 fps. Bill Geissele says Federal will be announcing the 5.56mm availability at SHOT next week. They will sell train car loads of that ammo alone.


 
3Ackleys said:
Federal is just monetizing technology they already paid to develop for a D.O.D. proposal. They aren't going bankrupt by selling ammo. Would you have them put their R&D costs on the shelf? That's the road to bankruptcy.

There is a market for shorter barreled rifles with suppressors, that have the same performance as cartridges in a long barrel. The 7BC IS the 7PRC in a shorter barrel.

Also this new Peak alloy will be made in other cartridges. In the video posted below, Geissele Automatics is shooting 5.56mm in Peak Alloy cases. It has an average velocity of 3168 fps vs. the same 64gr. bullet in a brass case of 2846 fps out of a 14.5" barrel. That's an increase of 322 fps. Bill Geissele says Federal will be announcing the 5.56mm availability at SHOT next week. They will sell train car loads of that ammo alone.


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Interesting, I'm just guessing here, but I'm leaning towards some new kind of development in powder
 
3Ackleys said:
Federal is just monetizing technology they already paid to develop for a D.O.D. proposal. They aren't going bankrupt by selling ammo. Would you have them put their R&D costs on the shelf? That's the road to bankruptcy.

There is a market for shorter barreled rifles with suppressors, that have the same performance as cartridges in a long barrel. The 7BC IS the 7PRC in a shorter barrel.

Also this new Peak alloy will be made in other cartridges. In the video posted below, Geissele Automatics is shooting 5.56mm in Peak Alloy cases. It has an average velocity of 3168 fps vs. the same 64gr. bullet in a brass case of 2846 fps out of a 14.5" barrel. That's an increase of 322 fps. Bill Geissele says Federal will be announcing the 5.56mm availability at SHOT next week. They will sell train car loads of that ammo alone.


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First of all, the nickname was a joke. But it could very well become realistic like their 224 Valkyrie which was pretty much a bust a couple years later.

Secondly, I see no reason for a shorter version of 7mm PRC. A standard 20” rifle has an overall length of approximately 40-42”. Then add about 7-8” for a suppressor for a total overall length of approximately 47-50”. Comparing to 24” rifle with suppressor (approximately 51-54” overall), that is only ~7.5% reduction in length.

Thirdly, I highly doubt they will sell “train car loads” of steel cased 5.56 as they still would likely be non-loadable not only because of steel case but also the powder they’re using is not available to the civilian market. Beside the prices likely will be prohibitive as compared to factory brass for volume shooters. Not to mention there is increased chance of chambering issues as steel is not as forgiving as brass in a dirty gun.

Beside the DoD are switching over to 6.8 SPC anyway.
 
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shamrock12 said:
First of all, the nickname was a joke. But it could very well become realistic like their 224 Valkyrie which was pretty much a bust a couple years later.

Secondly, I see no reason for a shorter version of 7mm PRC. A standard 20” rifle has an overall length of approximately 40-42”. Then add about 7-8” for a suppressor for a total overall length of approximately 47-50”. Comparing to 24” rifle with suppressor (approximately 51-54” overall), that is only ~7.5% reduction in length.

Thirdly, I highly doubt they will sell “train car loads” of steel cased 5.56 as they still would likely be non-loadable not only because of steel case but also the powder they’re using is not available to the civilian market. Beside the prices likely will be prohibitive as compared to factory brass for volume shooters. Not to mention there is increased chance of chambering issues as steel is not as forgiving as brass in a dirty gun.

Beside the DoD are switching over to 6.8 SPC anyway.
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6.8 SPC died a long time ago. You’re confusing it with the 6.8x51 or .277 Fury. This is a steel headed brass case that operates at similar pressures of the 7BC.
 
Up next will be steel case .223 ammo from Hornady that is "off the charts";). Those Hornady people are already pulling the bullets to do the research on the powder. Probably find it's a pistol powder.
 
shamrock12 said:
First of all, the nickname was a joke. But it could very well become realistic like their 224 Valkyrie which was pretty much a bust a couple years later.

Secondly, I see no reason for a shorter version of 7mm PRC. A standard 20” rifle has an overall length of approximately 40-42”. Then add about 7-8” for a suppressor for a total overall length of approximately 47-50”. Comparing to 24” rifle with suppressor (approximately 51-54” overall), that is only ~7.5% reduction in length.

Thirdly, I highly doubt they will sell “train car loads” of steel cased 5.56 as they still would likely be non-loadable not only because of steel case but also the powder they’re using is not available to the civilian market. Beside the prices likely will be prohibitive as compared to factory brass for volume shooters. Not to mention there is increased chance of chambering issues as steel is not as forgiving as brass in a dirty gun.

Beside the DoD are switching over to 6.8 SPC anyway.
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So once a company has a new product that doesn't sell, they should never come out with anything new?

YOU see no reason for it, so NO one will? There IS a market for shorter barrels (16"-18") w/suppressors, in the hunting community. In the last year, suppressors went from 12 months wait time to 12 days wait time.

Federal states that the case is reloadable. Nobody knows if it is or not. But Federal has never been a company that caters to reloaders much.
The market for high performance factory ammo, without regard to reloading is there. Especially in the 5.56mm arena.
The prices for the Peak Alloy 7BC start at $49/box, so right in line with other cartridges of that size.

The D.O.D is switching to the 277 Fury from Sig, that is the contract proposal Federal developed the Peak Alloy case for.
 
3Ackleys said:
So once a company has a new product that doesn't sell, they should never come out with anything new?

YOU see no reason for it, so NO one will? There IS a market for shorter barrels (16"-18") w/suppressors, in the hunting community. In the last year, suppressors went from 12 months wait time to 12 days wait time.
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Your words, not mine. I’m fine with new cartridges as long as there is merit. As already mentioned before, 7 PRC is justified as it replaces the belted 7mm Rem Mag with some improvements.

This thread is regarding 7BC so why are you talking about 16-18” rifles? 7BC would need a minimum of 20” to reach its potential. Otherwise it would be pointless to run this caliber on barrels shorter than 20”.

As already explained earlier, there hardly is much difference in lengths between suppressed 20” and 24” rifles.

FYI long range shooting is not hunting, it is sniping. Hunting is about stalking your game, typically within a few hundred yards or so.

Again, Federal has created a problem that did not exist.
 
shamrock12 said:
Your words, not mine. I’m fine with new cartridges as long as there is merit. As already mentioned before, 7 PRC is justified as it replaces the belted 7mm Rem Mag with some improvements.

This thread is regarding 7BC so why are you talking about 16-18” rifles? 7BC would need a minimum of 20” to reach its potential. Otherwise it would be pointless to run this caliber on barrels shorter than 20”.

As already explained earlier, there hardly is much difference in lengths between suppressed 20” and 24” rifles.

FYI long range shooting is not hunting, it is sniping. Hunting is about stalking your game, typically within a few hundred yards or so.

Again, Federal has created a problem that did not exist.
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I have no problem watching who follows these new products and wasting their money, but it won’t be me.
 
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