600+ lb gun safe on 2nd story house or on crawl space main floor?

[K9TXS]

In the very near future, I think I'll be moving from the Houston Texas area to Clarksville Tenn. There are a few house there that have slabs instead of a crawl space so the safe wouldn't be an issue.

If I build, it will be on a slab or walk out basement so that wouldn't be an issue. I have seen some houses that have a large room above the garage and this would be perfect for my use, but how much reinforcement would be needed?

Anyone have their safe on the main floor with a crawl space? Any issues?

Anyone have their safe on the second floor? Any issues?

 

[Doug Beach]

I’m not a structural engineer, by any stretch, but a 600 lb safe with say another 150lbs of stuff in it, spread over 6 square feet of floor, should not be a problem, assuming the structure is in good shape. Look at your floor joist size, span, and spacing, then look at sagulator.com.
I’ve had a similar safe over a crawl space for 25 years, in one location on 2x4 joists on 16” centers, and now on 2x6 on 16”. Zero issues.

 

[JFrank]

https://www.huduser.gov/Publications/pdf/res2000_2.pdf

Mines on the main floor over a structural beam supporting the floor joist

 

[spclark]

I’ve had a similar safe over a crawl space for 25 years, in one location on 2x4 joists on 16” centers...

Whoo... what kinda span for those 2x4’s?

40#/sq.ft. is pretty common in newer frame residential construction the last 30 years.

My safe’s footprint is 27”x40” = 7-1/2 sq.ft. so even with 50#/sq.ft. floor its 600# empty would be twice what the floor could take.

Being that load specs are calculated not for total weight-bearing but for deflection (how much a given span will move at the middle when a uniform load is applied) I’d hesitate to assume anything until I could be sure the structure was properly engineered for my needs.

750# on 6 sq.ft. = 125#/sq.ft. so maybe 2x4’s 16” o/c would be fine... as long as that safe’s against a properly supported load-bearing wall. You try moving it across a 12’ room however you might find yourself - and it - suddenly a floor lower down.

And my safe’s on a slab....

 

[TAJ45]

Sky Hooks? At least two imo. Sry, couldn't resist.

The load brg specs given were interesting. I didnt have a clue. Hmmmm
Waterbeds? At 8.6 lbs. per gal, curious how that would work out as a comparison.

 

[Doug Beach]

A 200 lb man standing, or sitting on a barstool applies as much weight per sq foot of floor as my example above, as would a bathtub full of water and human.
Again, I’m not an engineer, and I’m only relating my own experiences.
For accuracy’s sake, in my case, the joists have 3/4” board run on the diagonal over them, with 1/2” oak on top of that, running crosswise to the joists.

 

[TAJ45]

Doug, you have in place what had crossed my mind - a 3/4" slab of osb, plywood or ? ...... as a base. Your diagonal triangulates the system and none of that is going anywhere barring a catastrophic occurrence.

 

[John Beauchamp]

Would you worry about three 200 lb people standing and talking in the middle of your living room?
Put it against an outside wall it should be fine. I would question the stair construction though. That's 600 lbs for the safe plus at least 2 guys at 200 plus each.

 

[Pres100]

I have my safe on a floor over a crawl space and no issues. When I moved, however my plan was to put my safe in the “bonus room” over our Garage. The moving company wouldn’t move it up the stairs no matter how hard I tried to persuade. It’s still downstairs but I still want to relocate it upstairs - I think it will make it!

 

[6MMsteve]

Doug, you have in place what had crossed my mind - a 3/4" slab of osb, plywood or ? ...... as a base. Your diagonal triangulates the system and none of that is going anywhere barring a catastrophic occurrence.

Like T said plywood will disperse the wt easily,, good houses have 2x8 or 2x10 ceiling joist..

 

[ebb]

Only problem with this is, on my safe and every one I've seen there is as much weight in the safe as it weighs or more. My 14 gun Browning has 19 long guns and at least 10 hand guns and lots of ammo

 

[dc.fireman]

My personal opinion: I shudder at the thought of a heavy safe on an upper floor, from a firefighting aspect.

But - My old crawl space wasn't the best climate controlled space in or under my house, and I would always be concerned about the humidity. Everyone's individual needs are different, and I understand the need to put it where it fits best.

 

[MClark]

I had a safe over the basement, when walking near it the floor creaked. I had it moved onto the slab. I originally wanted it in the finished basement but mover refused due to worries about strength of stairs.
If you are having the house built tell the architect what you want, he can design to suit. If on second floor have a plan to get it there.
In Houston make sure safe is in air conditioning to prevent rust.

M

 

[Doug Beach]

Various machinist forums have a lot of information and experiences with moving heavy equipment up and down stairs. The machinery is usually headed into, or out of, the basement, but the stair journey is the same. Nobody seems to build their machine shop on their second floor....

 

[joshb]

They don’t build them like they used to. If you’re having a home built, have them beef up the floor joists to 2x10 or 12 to 12” centers. Maybe doubles under the safe location. Live loads are different than dead loads.
Most prebuilt stair units are made with two 5/4 stringers that are routed for the risers and treads, leaving 1/2” of wood for support. They’re “supposed” to be nailed to the side walls to get the support needed.
Recently, I was looking to buy a house. During a tour of a million dollar new home, I noticed some bounce in the stairs. I took a close look and saw that the stairs only had six finish nails holding them in place!
They’re a LOT of builders banging up houses, these days, that use the cheapest labor they can find.
Watch out!

 

[Twicepop]

In the very near future, I think I'll be moving from the Houston Texas area to Clarksville Tenn. There are a few house there that have slabs instead of a crawl space so the safe wouldn't be an issue.

If I build, it will be on a slab or walk out basement so that wouldn't be an issue. I have seen some houses that have a large room above the garage and this would be perfect for my use, but how much reinforcement would be needed?

Anyone have their safe on the main floor with a crawl space? Any issues?

Anyone have their safe on the second floor? Any issues?

Mine sits over the basement, it sits in a corner against the outside wall (foundation) and the supported from the basement center wall. We've got 2X12 ground floor joists and steel main center beam supports. Absolutely no issues.

 

[Papa Charlie]

I wouldn't worry too much about the floor. If you find the house you like. It can be pretty simple to have the floor enforced by sistering joists to the exiting ones in a small area that you plan to place the safe if it needed.

 

[Dead Eye]

One other concern to think about. We buy safes to protect the contents from both unauthorized access and fire. You can put your safe upstairs but if there is a fire it will end up in the basement or lowest level. Probably not gracefully.

 

[jds holler]

In this pic, I have just set a unit of studs on the floor deck of a new home. That unit weighs about 3000 lbs., and I've set heavier ones similarly. Floor systems on modern residential are pretty sound these days. Floor joists are generally 9 1/2" or 11 7/8" engineered I-joists, set on 16" centers. There are generally cross girders or pony walls under them at twelve foot spans. Decked with minimum 3/4" subfloor material, you won't have an issue with most any safe that you could get through a door.

You could say that they don't build them like they used to, but if you are talking about a forty year old home your chances of non-compliant construction, or cheesy modifications are much greater than modern "built to code" construction. jd

 

[brcman]

Not in the crawl space- everyone I've been in has very high humidity which will result in rust!