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6 br accuracy

Still being a fairly new 6br shooter,I am wondering
if you guys are finding better accuracy by neck
sizing verus full length..Brass is Lapua..if that
matters..Just trying to get some more infor-
mation on this cartridge..thanks
 
you can do both with one die..

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/730949/redding-type-s-bushing-full-length-sizer-die-6mm-br-bench-rest
 
i too am new to this cartridge. i shoot two 6 BRs, one with a trued rem 700 and the other with a stiller predator action, both kreiger 14 twist but different reamers. the stiller is with a new pt&g reamer with the .2704 neck. trying bergers new br bullets: 60 target, 62 euwing,64 column and 65 WEB. i'v been checking headspace on the fired cases and push them back only if tight at chambering(without firing pin/spring). necking down to .267 and with LT 32 powder i am having the blast of my life! LT 32 is suposedly for the 6 PPC crowd but these 6 BRs love the stuff! i'v got some 3 shot groups in the zeros!! the reddicg 6 BR body die barely touches these cases when pushing the shoulder. wish i'd tried this cartridge earlier as i'v had some losers and spent a lot of $ and time trying for one hole groups, but now it is becoming routine and i love it!!!!
 
cocopuff said:
Still being a fairly new 6br shooter,I am wondering if you guys are finding better accuracy by neck sizing verus full length..Brass is Lapua... if that matters... Just trying to get some more information on this cartridge.

Thanks

I have been shooting this cartridge for ~10 years, and I neck size the cases with a Redding "S" neck sizing die.

In some 50 years of loading, I have never found full sizing to be more accurate than neck sizing.
 
CatShooter said:
cocopuff said:
Still being a fairly new 6br shooter,I am wondering if you guys are finding better accuracy by neck sizing verus full length..Brass is Lapua... if that matters... Just trying to get some more information on this cartridge.

Thanks

I have been shooting this cartridge for ~10 years, and I neck size the cases with a Redding "S" neck sizing die.

+1 been shooting it only 8 years but neck size with Redding "S" neck die. WD
 
I anneal, and FL size each time. I was helped by Mike Davis on my loading. No one I ever taked with could offer so much advise. I wished many times I could record the conversations. I am still impressed with his achievements in IBS 600 yd events. He answered the tough questions when I had no where else to turn. I shot at Piedmont 10 1/2 hr drive from Memphis back in 2010, hoping the whole drive I could thank him in person. He did not attend that match. Maybe 1 day!
 
You can also buy a Redding S-Type FL die and buy Wilsons in line seater for the best of both worlds.....
 
I don't ever FL size. Just bump with body die and partial NS with Wilsons.
I risk offending, but I know of no actual basis for the notions of FL sizing as better.
The only sense I can make of it, is that FL sizing is better for those that can't do otherwise as well.
Afterall, it takes a plan to work around FL sizing. Less work,, but a plan.
 
Fellows, the vast majority of short range benchrest competitors FL size. It is not because they are inept or unintelligent. Also, body dies are like FL dies with the neck cut off in terms of how they are dimensioned internally. As far an not needing to FL size goes, I think that is perfectly fine, if i gets you where you want to go, but trust me, if you shoot warm loads, and only neck size, you will soon run into tight bolt issues. This should not be construed as a criticism of any type of sizing. If it works for you, that is all that is required. The other issue is that very few shooters have had any experience with dies that are custom fit to a chamber, and as a result, the experience that they have had with off the shelf dies prejudices them against FL sizing. For the dies that they have used, their conclusions are valid, but those experiences should not be taken for universal truths....better dies...different truth.
 
BoydAllen said:
Fellows, the vast majority of short range benchrest competitors FL size. It is not because they are inept or unintelligent. Also, body dies are like FL dies with the neck cut off in terms of how they are dimensioned internally. As far an not needing to FL size goes, I think that is perfectly fine, if i gets you where you want to go, but trust me, if you shoot warm loads, and only neck size, you will soon run into tight bolt issues. This should not be construed as a criticism of any type of sizing. If it works for you, that is all that is required. The other issue is that very few shooters have had any experience with dies that are custom fit to a chamber, and as a result, the experience that they have had with off the shelf dies prejudices them against FL sizing. For the dies that they have used, their conclusions are valid, but those experiences should not be taken for universal truths....better dies...different truth.

had tight bolt issues today after neck sizing only for the life of the brass. fortunately I anticipated correctly and my Redding body die arrived yesterday. I had to pull some bullets from cartridges that would not chamber at all, checked just the case in the rifles and it still would not until I used the body die.
 
One other little tip...It has been my experience that all cases do not get tight on the same number of firings, and if you mix rounds with tight bolt closing with those that do not in the same group, it will be enlarged.
 
BoydAllen said:
One other little tip...It has been my experience that all cases do not get tight on the same number of firings, and if you mix rounds with tight bolt closing with those that do not in the same group, it will be enlarged.

And this is a proven fact!! This is why i personally full length every time just bumping the shoulder very minimal. One must learn to use the same amount of force at the end of the sizing stroke or the bump will be different
 
lpreddick said:
i too am new to this cartridge. i shoot two 6 BRs, one with a trued rem 700 and the other with a stiller predator action, both kreiger 14 twist but different reamers. the stiller is with a new pt&g reamer with the .2704 neck. trying bergers new br bullets: 60 target, 62 euwing,64 column and 65 WEB. i'v been checking headspace on the fired cases and push them back only if tight at chambering(without firing pin/spring). necking down to .267 and with LT 32 powder i am having the blast of my life! LT 32 is suposedly for the 6 PPC crowd but these 6 BRs love the stuff! i'v got some 3 shot groups in the zeros!! the reddicg 6 BR body die barely touches these cases when pushing the shoulder. wish i'd tried this cartridge earlier as i'v had some losers and spent a lot of $ and time trying for one hole groups, but now it is becoming routine and i love it!!!!

Give us a few details if you will? On the LT 32 what bullet weight powder weight and velocity you are seeing. I've got quite a bit of LT32 I was thinking of trying in my 12 twist 6br Savage
 
BoydAllen said:
Fellows, the vast majority of short range benchrest competitors FL size. It is not because they are inept or unintelligent.

Boyd... they certainly are not.

But the reasons people do things are not always what they first appear.

When I first started shooting bench, no one used internally adjusted scopes - the "Scope de jour" was the Unertl and Lyman Targetspot. The internal adjusted scope did NOT come on the scene because it was a better, more dependable scope - is came on the scene because it was lighter in weight.

In terms of optics, mechanics, and adjustment reliability, it was a big step backwards.

Had the benchrest associations decided that weight limits would be without scope (scope weight would not count against the weight of the rifle) we would now have a very different world of optics for shooting, better mounts, better lens systems, better everything... but we didn't go that way. Everything is sacrificed for the God of weight.

But, to look at the current BR scopes and say that must be the best way to go because "benchrest shooters use them", would be fallacious. They are poor compromises, optically and mechanically.

Same with FL sizing. The way current short range bench is shot, trying to get the whole string shot inside of a lull in the wind, means that any resistance in closing the bolt will break your pacing and shift the rifle in the bags, and you are lost.

The result in this shooting style is that cases are FL sized, NOT because it is more accurate, but because it results in easier feeding (well, Duh)...

... but if easy feeding were not a consideration, and raw accuracy is the only consideration, then neck sizing is the hands down the winner - not to mention very long case life.

"Crush is your friend" ;)
 
CatShooter said:
BoydAllen said:
Fellows, the vast majority of short range benchrest competitors FL size. It is not because they are inept or unintelligent.

Boyd... they certainly are not.

But the reasons people do things are not always what they first appear.

When I first started shooting bench, no one used internally adjusted scopes - the "Scope de jour" was the Unertl and Lyman Targetspot. The internal adjusted scope did NOT come on the scene because it was a better, more dependable scope - is came on the scene because it was lighter in weight.

In terms of optics, mechanics, and adjustment reliability, it was a big step backwards.

Had the benchrest associations decided that weight limits would be without scope (scope weight would not count against the weight of the rifle) we would now have a very different world of optics for shooting, better mounts, better lens systems, better everything... but we didn't go that way. Everything is sacrificed for the God of weight.

But, to look at the current BR scopes and say that must be the best way to go because "benchrest shooters use them", would be fallacious. They are poor compromises, optically and mechanically.

Same with FL sizing. The way current short range bench is shot, trying to get the whole string shot inside of a lull in the wind, means that any resistance in closing the bolt will break your pacing and shift the rifle in the bags, and you are lost.

The result in this shooting style is that cases are FL sized, NOT because it is more accurate, but because it results in easier feeding (well, Duh)...

... but if easy feeding were not a consideration, and raw accuracy is the only consideration, then neck sizing is the hands down the winner - not to mention very long case life.

"Crush is your friend" ;)
Gosh Cat...I don't at all doubt that you do very well with neck sizing only. I shot and reloaded many years for 22 250 for varmint hunting and occasionally went to the range to try to improve the accuracy of my loads. For the most part, I always just neck sized and was satisfied with the results for the most part for varmint hunting. At one point however, I remember that the bolt was getting fairly hard to close and I decided to just bump the shoulders back, at that time thinking just full length resize enough to make the bolt close easier simply to make chambering a little easier. This was on an older late '70s vintage Savage model 110V. When I shot targets out in my front yard at 200 yards,I was amazed that the groups got much tighter than before. Now maybe there are other factors involved that I'm missing and maybe I should retry neck sizing only but all I know is it has worked to bump shoulders for me a couple thou up till now. I always want to stay open to learn though and appreciate your post and info.
 
22BRGUY said:
Gosh Cat...I don't at all doubt that you do very well with neck sizing only. I shot and reloaded many years for 22 250 for varmint hunting and occasionally went to the range to try to improve the accuracy of my loads. For the most part, I always just neck sized and was satisfied with the results for the most part for varmint hunting. At one point however, I remember that the bolt was getting fairly hard to close and I decided to just bump the shoulders back, at that time thinking just full length resize enough to make the bolt close easier simply to make chambering a little easier. This was on an older late '70s vintage Savage model 110V. When I shot targets out in my front yard at 200 yards,I was amazed that the groups got much tighter than before. Now maybe there are other factors involved that I'm missing and maybe I should retry neck sizing only but all I know is it has worked to bump shoulders for me a couple thou up till now. I always want to stay open to learn though and appreciate your post and info.

Gosh, BRguy.

A 70's vintage Savage 110. Golly, You can learn a lot from one of those.

But I was talking of rifles that are a little further up the food chain, than a 70's Savage 110.
 
catshooter,

You Said: "... but if easy feeding were not a consideration, and raw accuracy is the only consideration, then neck sizing is the hands down the winner - not to mention very long case life."

If You limit that statement to only include store bought Redding and RCBS Dies then I agree!

But I need to inform you that the best benchrest shooters for the most part buy a resize reamer that is a perfect setup for there chamber reamer (doesn't re size brass anymore than necessary to allow smooth bolt closure)
They then make there own FL resizing die from a newlon blank, get it heat treated-hardened, and then polish out the .0003" to .0005" it shrinks in heat treatment.
This results in a die/chamber setup that will maintain .0002" neck concentricity which is not possible in any of the following:
1) Any Die that uses a floating Bushing for Necksize
2) Any die that pulls a sizing button thru the neck I.D.

I need to clarify my statement; When I speak of benchrest shooters I was talking about 100 & 200yd. NBRSA or IBS Competition. Shooting 6PPC, 30PPC, & 30BR!
 
dmoran said:
CatShooter said:
... but if easy feeding were not a consideration, and raw accuracy is the only consideration, then neck sizing is the hands down the winner - not to mention very long case life.

"Crush is your friend" ;)


That is a totally biased statement and in no way the truth....

As to "Crush is your friend".... it is risky and can be very dangerous, that has extreme limitations for success.
Inconsistent pressure and spiked pressure is the inherited risk of crush fits.
And is some of the worse advise I've yet to see.....


To those of you who wonder why I don't post here no more... it is statements like this, by indicative keyboarders, that reply's with a corruption of truth, for some self serving motivation only.

Donovan

Dogma reigns - yup it is really self serving - I sell crush by the create full.

... and just what is the danger of tight fitting cases?
 

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