6.5 cm load too hot. what now?

[Ol Thumper]

At those pressures I would most definitely have it checked a LOT closer than eye balling it,, that’s insane it didn’t blow up. If it were mine theirs no way I’d pull the trigger again without knowing for 100% certain it’s ok. Call me OCD but nobody's well being is worth risking it over a simple Replaceable Gun that may or may not be injured. Having it checked won’t cost much in comparison to a hospital visit.

 

[Hoot]

he had a brain fart that will never hopefully happen again bettin pressure was close to 90,000psi maybe some one could run quick load , fed case 40gr acc 5744, barnes 140gr barnes match burners col 2.800

Hoot

 

[Richard Coody]

Sure am glad Jake found a mentor. We all started somewhere. I was young and made my mistakes. Didn't have the internet back in those days.

 

[Mad_Charlie]

View attachment 1233198

Hoot

God have mercy! That right there is "proof" that he does.
Dusty is right, that rifle has been sorely stressed.

 

[Ol Thumper]

Am I reading that right, 146,000 psi? Holy Mother Of Pearl,

 

[CF2209]

OMG

 

[Hoot]

While QuickLoad is a useful tool and generally entertaining "What if" application, it usually errs on the side of caution, so take that 146k pressure with a little grain of salt. That having been said, even if you subtract 10% its still a stout load. Just sayin...

Hoot

 

[Kracken McGraw]

It's interesting how most everyone is telling this new guy about all the tools he needs (me included). But in thinking back, I shot NRA High-Power seriously for 10 years in the 80's & 90's, without most of the stuff that is now "required". I'm not sure a lot of it was even available back then. I loaded my 308 and 30-06 rounds with the "max" loads from the Sierra manual, at their prescribed OAL. I always used Fed 210M primers and for 308 used mostly H380 (I got a deal on a big bunch of surplus WC852) and 2520. For 30-06, which later I shot most long-range, was H4350, but early on across-the-course was 4895 and 4064.

I set my sizing dies up like RCBS told you to, used an RCBS beam scale (with no standard) and an RCBS Uni-flow powder measure and I threw every charge. I did buy a gauge from Sinclair to measure the max case length, a Wilson "case-length" gauge, both for my 308 and another Sinclair gauge to measure "to-the-lands" for long-range ammo. But really, other than that I just loaded, shot an ultimately earned and NRA Master classification, all with two M70 Winchester Match rifles.

Today I only shoot off a bench (our club has a G-class, same as F-class, but shot from a bench) and I have all of the tools discussed and more and I use them religiously. Do they make a difference - yes, I am sure they do. But at 67 it's becoming harder to tell the short comings of the rifle from those of the shooter.

My point is - I think on this forum we over complicate reloading, for beginners. Which is understandable because this is the premier source for accuracy/precision information on the web. So it's kind of like a college freshman being put in a class for doctoral candidates.

I can kind of make your point, that we sometimes overthink things. Last night I started on some Peterson brass for a seldom used Sako .243 L579. Stripped the bolt to find my touch point on some Sierra #1530 bullets, after finding that I decided to set them 15 thousandth off touch for simplicity. This number ironically came to a 2.650 COAL, the same number that the Sierra manual lists for that bullet. Go figure, Lol!

 

[milboltnut]

God have mercy! That right there is "proof" that he does.
Dusty is right, that rifle has been sorely stressed.

if that was the case, he would have had a ruptured case. You guys need to stop acting like you have all the answers. The only thing that's been stressed is the casing. IF and I say IF the QL chart WAS correct he would have had alot more then a deformed case ! I read an artical of PO Ackley barreling a 03, Lee enfeild #4, type 38 and a type 99... with magnum cartridges, GROSSLY overloaded charges. The 38 held up the best. Again teh case was the only thing that was damaged here, nothing else.

 

[Tokay444]

“BuT wOuLdN’t ThErE bE sWeLlInG?”

 

[rijndael]

I was hesitant to at first, but after seeing the QL numbers, I would like to echo the recommendation for getting it magnaflux'd.

 

[KMart]

thanks everyone. wagonman helped me figure out that.. everything with the load was correct, except that i used the wrong powder i put 5744 in

he took the time to show me everything, which gave me a good idea how much i have to learn. It might have taken a few years off his life tho, when he ran a bore scope thru my barrel and saw what a rifle thats never been cleaned looks like.

Now you are making progress. Just out of curiosity, how does your peg legged scale measure against Dons scale?

 

[chop house]

check and double check and have only the correct powder on the loading bench.

this is my rule number one...

well, i guess i have several rule number ones, come to think of it. but this is definitely in GROUP ONE.

 

[457ciSBC]

It's interesting how most everyone is telling this new guy about all the tools he needs (me included). But in thinking back, I shot NRA High-Power seriously for 10 years in the 80's & 90's, without most of the stuff that is now "required". I'm not sure a lot of it was even available back then. I loaded my 308 and 30-06 rounds with the "max" loads from the Sierra manual, at their prescribed OAL. I always used Fed 210M primers and for 308 used mostly H380 (I got a deal on a big bunch of surplus WC852) and 2520. For 30-06, which later I shot most long-range, was H4350, but early on across-the-course was 4895 and 4064.

I set my sizing dies up like RCBS told you to, used an RCBS beam scale (with no standard) and an RCBS Uni-flow powder measure and I threw every charge. I did buy a gauge from Sinclair to measure the max case length, a Wilson "case-length" gauge, both for my 308 and another Sinclair gauge to measure "to-the-lands" for long-range ammo. But really, other than that I just loaded, shot an ultimately earned and NRA Master classification, all with two M70 Winchester Match rifles.

Today I only shoot off a bench (our club has a G-class, same as F-class, but shot from a bench) and I have all of the tools discussed and more and I use them religiously. Do they make a difference - yes, I am sure they do. But at 67 it's becoming harder to tell the short comings of the rifle from those of the shooter.

My point is - I think on this forum we over complicate reloading, for beginners. Which is understandable because this is the premier source for accuracy/precision information on the web. So it's kind of like a college freshman being put in a class for doctoral candidates.

You are preaching to the choir Brotha! I was reading some of the responses thinking the exact same darn thing, because apparently the ability to safely reload rifle cartridges prior these tools coming about was impossible....LOL.
I too shot High Power using an NM M1A and never once used a Stoney Point gage and started out using a balance beam scale. Matter of fact; it was the first rifle and cartridge I reloaded for, but I understood the importance of how to setup the FL die.

PO Ackley, Fred Huntington and Frank Barnes would get roasted on internet forums these days.

 

[milboltnut]

thanks everyone. wagonman helped me figure out that.. everything with the load was correct, except that i used the wrong powder i put 5744 in

he took the time to show me everything, which gave me a good idea how much i have to learn. It might have taken a few years off his life tho, when he ran a bore scope thru my barrel and saw what a rifle thats never been cleaned looks like.

Hogdons site shows IMR 4451...ok, Never did that my self, but I guess it can happen. You put AA5744, that's very fast buring, I use this for cast loads. I bet you will NEVER let that happen again. Be glad a impression on the case head was the only thing you had. These rifles can take alot more than most think. If a M1917 can handle magnum cartridge pressures, that should tell you something. Lets see a picture of your reloading bench.

 

[Tokay444]

Even with a more appropriate powder, even though op was adamant what he told us he used was what he used, he’s gonna have problems compressing it so tightly that he has to tap the case for the kernels to budge.

 

[dgeesaman]

While QuickLoad is a useful tool and generally entertaining "What if" application, it usually errs on the side of caution, so take that 146k pressure with a little grain of salt. That having been said, even if you subtract 10% its still a stout load. Just sayin...

Hoot

Quick load isn’t accounting for the energy that went into bulging the barrel, smashing the brass, and elastic expansion of the chamber and action. Also the math in quick load is empirically based on normal firing conditions and this case is a big extrapolation away the base data. But it’s certainly awfully high over anything reasonable.

Somewhere I think Jake said a fresh bullet will drop a couple of inches into the barrel beyond the lands. I’d replace the barrel at a minimum.

For the cost of magnafluxing and gunsmith time to check out the action, I’d scrap it and replace. Maybe Howa would be willing to look at it, it should tickle their QC people to see the proof test that it survived twice.

 

[milboltnut]

Quick load isn’t accounting for the energy that went into bulging the barrel, smashing the brass, and elastic expansion of the chamber and action. Also the math in quick load is empirically based on normal firing conditions and this case is a big extrapolation away the base data. But it’s certainly awfully high over anything reasonable.

Somewhere I think Jake said a fresh bullet will drop a couple of inches into the barrel beyond the lands. I’d replace the barrel at a minimum.

For the cost of magnafluxing and gunsmith time to check out the action, I’d scrap it and replace. Maybe Howa would be willing to look at it, it should tickle their QC people to see the proof test that it survived twice.

you really think you need to go to the extreme just because of a deformed case? It took the pressure, not the rifle. I didn't even see the bolt lugs galled at all. IF the case ruptured then I would be a little more persuaded to check things out. Lighten up.

 

[dgeesaman]

you really think you need to go to the extreme just because of a deformed case? It took the pressure, not the rifle. I didn't even see the bolt lugs galled at all. IF the case ruptured then I would be a little more persuaded to check things out. Lighten up.

The brass case is effectively a sealing device and the chamber is the structural element taking the pressure. Much like a clad pressure vessel. So the chamber takes load every time.

In extreme cases like this the action also took significant load because it’s threaded around the barrel. So if the barrel bulges the threads and receiver

The bolt should not take any load in normal conditions, but in this case it certainly did. We know that because the bolt wouldn’t open and the brass and primer flowed around it, and probably other things.

I can’t say for sure what permanent damage occurred but it takes a lot of effort and some money to try to figure it out. That’s why replacing the barrelled action is what I would do.

 

[Ol Thumper]

It always easy to risk things when your not the one that’s going to pay the price for being wrong. The OP can do as he chooses but I hope he doesn’t pay the price for his actions. A gun or parts are cheap when compared to a hospital trip.