300 Norma mag. VS 300 PRC

[SKWERLZ]

7 SAUM?

Any of them but I do run 7 saum.

 

[Rick Richard]

7 SAUM

 

[ISS]

NMI; no cost for components...

 

[284winner]

All things being equal, the 300PRC sounds like it's a better option in many areas. Things aren't equal tho. At this point having brass and likely dies for the 300NM, I think sticking with it is the best option IF money is a factor.

 

[ShaunBrady]

but, poster already has a NMI. What's the logic behind changing cartridges...?

My take on it is a 300NMI for 600 to 1760 yards is over the top and completely unnecessary.

Reasons to stay with the same cartridge could include:
* Lower initial component cost
* Similar ballistics to shoot while first gun cools off
* Lessons on the impact of barrel round count on ELR performance.

Reasons to go with 300PRC
* Cheaper to run. Barrels and components
* Different set of components. This is a significant advantage during shortages.
* Different set of ballistics to make same course more interesting.
* Eventually you'll learn to cheat the different ballistics thing and learn to carry wind and elevation refinements from one gun to the other. Then it'll dawn on them that you can do the same thing with the same gun and multiple targets.
* It'll quickly be pretty obvious how little difference there is in the scoring between those 2 cartridges at those ranges. This will give lessons that can be applied to both cartridge selection and reloading practices.
* Eventually you'll figure out conditions dominate the scoring. In ELR, the idea isn't to clean the target. A better approach to train for is getting on target faster, at longer distances, and bleed hits to conditions slower. This doesn't have a lot to do with 100 yard group sizes or how the trigger is pressed. It's about not ever having all the information needed and making best use of what you do have. Chasing the last miss and starting fresh at each target flushes useful information.

I started ELR with a 300WM shooting 230 Hybrids over 10 years ago. My first dedicated ELR practice gun was a 7/270WSM shooting 180s. The practice range I use has targets from 1200 to 2300 yards. The NorCal URSA range is about 90 minutes away. I've shot from 2050 to 3300 yards there. Current pet guns are chambered in 33XC, 300 Lapua, and 300 PRC. The 300 PRC still has the factory Ruger barrel. I sourced the Hornady brass once fired when 'Rona was in town. I load it with Hornady dies to magazine length. Depending on my mood, it's either remarkable or really demoralizing how close it shoots to the 300 Lapua out to maybe 2100 yards.

 

[Evlshnngns]

My take on it is a 300NMI for 600 to 1760 yards is over the top and completely unnecessary.

Reasons to stay with the same cartridge could include:
* Lower initial component cost
* Similar ballistics to shoot while first gun cools off
* Lessons on the impact of barrel round count on ELR performance.

Reasons to go with 300PRC
* Cheaper to run. Barrels and components
* Different set of components. This is a significant advantage during shortages.
* Different set of ballistics to make same course more interesting.
* Eventually you'll learn to cheat the different ballistics thing and learn to carry wind and elevation refinements from one gun to the other. Then it'll dawn on them that you can do the same thing with the same gun and multiple targets.
* It'll quickly be pretty obvious how little difference there is in the scoring between those 2 cartridges at those ranges. This will give lessons that can be applied to both cartridge selection and reloading practices.
* Eventually you'll figure out conditions dominate the scoring. In ELR, the idea isn't to clean the target. A better approach to train for is getting on target faster, at longer distances, and bleed hits to conditions slower. This doesn't have a lot to do with 100 yard group sizes or how the trigger is pressed. It's about not ever having all the information needed and making best use of what you do have. Chasing the last miss and starting fresh at each target flushes useful information.

I started ELR with a 300WM shooting 230 Hybrids over 10 years ago. My first dedicated ELR practice gun was a 7/270WSM shooting 180s. The practice range I use has targets from 1200 to 2300 yards. The NorCal URSA range is about 90 minutes away. I've shot from 2050 to 3300 yards there. Current pet guns are chambered in 33XC, 300 Lapua, and 300 PRC. The 300 PRC still has the factory Ruger barrel. I sourced the Hornady brass once fired when 'Rona was in town. I load it with Hornady dies to magazine length. Depending on my mood, it's either remarkable or really demoralizing how close it shoots to the 300 Lapua out to maybe 2100 yards.

Thanks for the detailed response. When I see the velocity the prc can get per grain and in a standard mag action, pretty impressive.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Thanks for the detailed response. When I see the velocity the prc can get per grain and in a standard mag action, pretty impressive.

Yeah the PRC is no slouch

 

[SKWERLZ]

Thanks for the detailed response. When I see the velocity the prc can get per grain and in a standard mag action, pretty impressive.

Load up some N570 in a 300 rum with the proper freebore and see what velocities you get.

 

[Mike TackleBerry]

Load up some N570 in a 300 rum with the proper freebore and see what velocities you get.

Now were talking, I loaded up 84 grains of N570 this weekend and was averaging 2974 fps with Berger 245 LRHTs in a 300 prc, A 300 RUM would be a monster.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Now were talking, I loaded up 84 grains of N570 this weekend and was averaging 2974 fps with Berger 245 LRHTs in a 300 prc, A 300 RUM would be a monster.

Yeah but you aren’t gonna have adequate mag length with a 245gr in a 300 RUM to seat the bullet out where it should be

The beauty of the PRC and Norma mag cases is that you can seat heavy bullets long to maintain higher case capacity, and the rounds still fit in most magnum length magazines

 

[Mike TackleBerry]

Yeah but you aren’t gonna have adequate mag length with a 245gr in a 300 RUM to seat the bullet out where it should be

The beauty of the PRC and Norma mag cases is that you can seat heavy bullets long to maintain higher case capacity, and the rounds still fit in most magnum length magazines

For a factory built ultra mag sure, But a simple throat reamer will clear up any seating depth issues the ultra mag would encounter. I can't mag feed my 300 PRC right now either.

 

[johnmyers]

Yeah but you aren’t gonna have adequate mag length with a 245gr in a 300 RUM to seat the bullet out where it should be

The beauty of the PRC and Norma mag cases is that you can seat heavy bullets long to maintain higher case capacity, and the rounds still fit in most magnum length magazines

Have a RUM throated for 245s it’s not hard to have done

 

[Alex Wheeler]

I have always been a 230 guy. I like how they slow the bigger magnums down and always got them to shoot a little tighter in my rifles. So my data is with 230s. The last 300 NMI I had ran them 3100 fps in a 26" barrel. Load was 92 grains of N570. The last 300 PRC I had ran them 2990 in 28". Load was 82.
Personally if I had a NMI already I would be looking at a 338. They do everything better other than the recoil. But between the regular norma and prc. Id do a prc.

 

[ISS]

Alex knows whereof he speaks...
A 300 NMI will fit in a long action with a mag bolt and box.

 

[wi50]

I used up some used parts and built a 300 prc. Had a spare american rifle company mausingfield action, you can change the bolt head on them and I have all the sizes on hand. I had a good used barrel from my 300 norma improved that I figured id set back. So I cut enough off and stuck a 300 prc reamer in.

It was the easy button. Ive built a bunch of 300 norma improved, the 300 prc runs so consistent, great brass is economical and readily available. Dies, tske your pick...... the 300 norma improved is great, but the bullet central micron sizing die, one of 3 actually has the right dimensions. Not in stock, this and that....one die i have sizes correctly, a friendhas gottena couplemore, they're to small and shaving brass, hard sizing, measuring the die, the latest one was to small compared with my original one. I sure do like my 300 norma improved, but the 300 prc sure is easy. There's something to be said for running slow, snd the 300 prc has enough capacity to run the 230-250 gr heavies just fast enough

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Have a RUM throated for 245s it’s not hard to have done

Yeah you can run a throat as long as you want and seat the bullets out as far as you want, but im talking about having enough magazine length to do that. Nobody runs a single shot 300 RUM, so since that brings magazine length back into the equation, using a 245gr Berger seated out the proper distance in a RUM is not even worth considering in my opinion

 

[Alex Wheeler]

I used up some used parts and built a 300 prc. Had a spare american rifle company mausingfield action, you can change the bolt head on them and I have all the sizes on hand. I had a good used barrel from my 300 norma improved that I figured id set back. So I cut enough off and stuck a 300 prc reamer in.

It was the easy button. Ive built a bunch of 300 norma improved, the 300 prc runs so consistent, great brass is economical and readily available. Dies, tske your pick...... the 300 norma improved is great, but the bullet central micron sizing die, one of 3 actually has the right dimensions. Not in stock, this and that....one die i have sizes correctly, a friendhas gottena couplemore, they're to small and shaving brass, hard sizing, measuring the die, the latest one was to small compared with my original one. I sure do like my 300 norma improved, but the 300 prc sure is easy. There's something to be said for running slow, snd the 300 prc has enough capacity to run the 230-250 gr heavies just fast enough

Im not sure how the die can be too small. Its made with a carbide reamer. I still own the reamer they use since the 35AW is my design. If its shaving Id think more along the lines of a sharp edge or burr.

 

[moondog]

Curious on the 230s, I've not tried them yet. Do they seem to like to be jumped?

 

[wi50]

Im not sure how the die can be too small. Its made with a carbide reamer. I still own the reamer they use since the 35AW is my design. If its shaving Id think more along the lines of a sharp edge or burr.

The die i got sizes perfect. Friend got one and it's shaving brass, blamed the die edge. Sent another one, same thing happened. I took and measured my die vs his die, they measured different. Cases fired from both rifles measured the same at the .200 point. (As they should) We ran cases fired through both dies and measured again. The die (both dies they sent him) are to small, that's all there is to it. Fired cases sized in one measured different when sized in the "new die" also, same gun, same brass.....both guns brass. Its the die. I have 3 rifles in the .300 norma improved, all are cut with the same reamer here. I also cut his barrels with the same reamer, as well as several othes, those guys got dies earlier on and they all work. The only one that has problems is the latest dies bought. I don't know what to say, but I know the dies don't measure the same and only one works. Ain't my problem to figure out. I loaned him my die to use in the meantime.

 

[wi50]

Curious on the 230s, I've not tried them yet. Do they seem to like to be jumped?

Moondog as far as the 230 atip,.my .300 prc.likes .050. I just tried. 020, .050 and .100. The .050 would be hard to improve on, Adg brass, 79gr h1000, cci 200 primers.

I tried lr mag primers, fed 215 vs cci200 in the 300 norma improved and .300 prc. Retumbo , h1000, and n568. The h1000 and lr cci200 gave me best results on rhe 300prc

I shot some 245 Berger eoh And 250 atips too but the 230 shot well, and I had 900 of them in the cabinet yet and a few
jugs of h1000 , so the kids can shoot light gun class until the barrel is used up.