25 cal varminter

[CanusLatransSnpr]

Hey all! It's been awhile since I've been on here and it's good to be back. I'm going to put together a fast 25 cal varminter but, I'm torn between two different cartridges. It's either going to be a 25-284 or a 25-06 ackley shooting the 75-100 gr. varmint fare bullets. I'm looking to see these critters explode instead of just die

I want to know if there is any appreciable difference in accuracy and speed between these two cartridges given the bullets I stated?

Thanks,
Mike

 

[JRS]

With 25-06 brass readily available, and simply having to fire form, IMO the 25-06 Ackley is a no brainer

 

[germanlongbow]

I've shot my 25-06 since 1998. A few years ago pulled barrel and set back to a 25-284 and put on a short action. The barrel has over 2500 rounds and still shoots 1/4 moa. Loves the 75 gr Hornady Vmax just as it did the 25-06. Either way you can't go wrong with either cartridge.

 

[Preacher]

Sure don't want to bump heads with anyone but to me the 25/284 is as good as it gets.
Basically the 25/06 in a nice compact package...
Tons of good eating has fallen after the impact of a 115 Berger VLD out of this axe job XP..
Almost forgot--- The 85 grain Nolser Ballistic tips will make any critter it touches vanish in a puff of blood and hide...

 

[Kurz]

I want to know if there is any appreciable difference in accuracy and speed between these two cartridges given the bullets I stated?

Mike,

The difference is in the case capacity and the powder selection. The velocity will be controlled by the barrel length given the amount of powder needed to fill either case. The .25-284 case usually has a capacity of 66 grains of water depending on the manufacturer while the .25-06 AI can go as high as 72-73 grains of water again depending on the manufacturer of the brass and the chamber.

By these criteria I would choose the .25-284 if given something in the neighborhood of a 26" barrel and combined with the lighter weight varmint-type bullets. But I have both and enjoy shooting both without discrimination. Either is suitable for the varmint fields as well as deer hunting if the twist rate is suitable for the heavier bullets. I have enjoyed 1:10" twist barrels for both ends of the spectrum with equal accuracy. But if you want to keep this as a dedicated varmint rifle I would run a 1:12" or even a 1:14" for just the very lightest (shortest) of the varmint bullets.

Regards.

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

Mike,

The difference is in the case capacity and the powder selection. The velocity will be controlled by the barrel length given the amount of powder needed to fill either case. The .25-284 case usually has a capacity of 66 grains of water depending on the manufacturer while the .25-06 AI can go as high as 72-73 grains of water again depending on the manufacturer of the brass and the chamber.

By these criteria I would choose the .25-284 if given something in the neighborhood of a 26" barrel and combined with the lighter weight varmint-type bullets. But I have both and enjoy shooting both without discrimination. Either is suitable for the varmint fields as well as deer hunting if the twist rate is suitable for the heavier bullets. I have enjoyed 1:10" twist barrels for both ends of the spectrum with equal accuracy. But if you want to keep this as a dedicated varmint rifle I would run a 1:12" or even a 1:14" for just the very lightest (shortest) of the varmint bullets.

Regards.

Appreciate you going into such detail Kurz! The barrel will be at least 28" and possibly longer? Probably braked as well! Chances are pretty good this will be solely a varmint rig so the heaviest I may go would be 100gr for bullets.

I've run some Bullets across Berger's stability calculator and the slowest twist was 10.8 but, that calculator also says it takes a 10 twist to stabilize a 6mm 87 vmax at 3250 and I'm doing it with a 12 twist so.....

 

[fredo]

I had a .25WSSM pushing 75Vmaxs in the mid 3500fps range, IIRC. That made for one nasty coyote schwacker...

Anything above & beyond that, which the .25-06(AI) or .25-284 will surely beat, will make you one very happy camper!!!
I bet 3750+wouldn't be too much to ask for & get !?!

Have fun & please report back!

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

I had a .25WSSM pushing 75Vmaxs in the mid 3500fps range, IIRC. That made for one nasty coyote schwacker...

Anything above & beyond that, which the .25-06(AI) or .25-284 will surely beat, will make you one very happy camper!!!
I bet 3750+wouldn't be too much to ask for & get !?!

Have fun & please report back!

Will do Fredo! Scope Eye fired my quarterbore obsession back up with the talk of his 25 WSM lol. I've wanted to try a 25 of sorts for a long time but, just haven't done it yet. That and I haven't really hunted woodchucks in a couple years so I feel it's time to get back at it and really make a show of things!

Mike

 

[JRS]

Will do Fredo! Scope Eye fired my quarterbore obsession back up with the talk of his 25 WSM lol. I've wanted to try a 25 of sorts for a long time but, just haven't done it yet. That and I haven't really hunted woodchucks in a couple years so I feel it's time to get back at it and really make a show of things!

Mike

Randy Robinett shoots a version he named the 25 Idiot Mag. I am having a 250 Ackley built right now.

 

[SheepDog]

I just started reloading some rounds for my 257 Roberts and was surprised at how the powder charge comes no where near the shoulder of the case. I'm using Winchester brass, CCI 400 primers and H414 powder. I have checked the data with my manuals and as always, checked the charge weight. I figured it would fill the case more.
I haven't fired any yet and am just loading for the OCW technique.

 

[Preacher]

I just started reloading some rounds for my 257 Roberts and was surprised at how the powder charge comes no where near the shoulder of the case. I'm using Winchester brass, CCI 400 primers and H414 powder. I have checked the data with my manuals and as always, checked the charge weight. I figured it would fill the case more.
I haven't fired any yet and am just loading for the OCW technique.

H-414 will never fill a 257 case as full as it should be for top performance, depending on the bullet weight, a slower powder will do you a better job...
Even H-4350 will work better, and it's about the same as H-414 but will take up a bit more room in the case...

 

[SheepDog]

H4350 uses the same maximum listed load at 45 grains with a 100 grain bullet but it is a bit faster burning powder producing higher pressures with less velocity in my manuals. Hybrid 100V is listed as a compressed load at 48 grains with slightly higher velocity and lower pressures so that might be one to try.

 

[Preacher]

H4350 uses the same maximum listed load at 45 grains with a 100 grain bullet but it is a bit faster burning powder producing higher pressures with less velocity in my manuals. Hybrid 100V is listed as a compressed load at 48 grains with slightly higher velocity and lower pressures so that might be one to try.

H100V is between H4350 and H4831 and will work very well..

 

[th82457]

Not the caliber you listed but a 250 AI is very efficient and a bunch easier on barrels.

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

H4350 uses the same maximum listed load at 45 grains with a 100 grain bullet but it is a bit faster burning powder producing higher pressures with less velocity in my manuals. Hybrid 100V is listed as a compressed load at 48 grains with slightly higher velocity and lower pressures so that might be one to try.

H4350 is slower than H414, hence better case fill! H4350 is my go to in 243 Win!

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

Not the caliber you listed but a 250 AI is very efficient and a bunch easier on barrels.

Not too concerned on barrel life, it's going to take years of shooting to shoot the barrel out on woodchucks!

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

Randy Robinett shoots a version he named the 25 Idiot Mag. I am having a 250 Ackley built right now.

I think that guy loves the quaterbore more than anyone!

 

[SheepDog]

According to the burn charts H4350 is slower than H414 BUT in the 257 Roberts the same amounts (by weight) shows higher pressures and lower velocities for H4350 than H414. That tells me that the H4350 is burning faster than the H414 in that case with that bullet. This is one of those examples that show you can't always depend on burn rates to select powders. The burn rates change depending on the application in which they are used.

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

According to the burn charts H4350 is slower than H414 BUT in the 257 Roberts the same amounts (by weight) shows higher pressures and lower velocities for H4350 than H414. That tells me that the H4350 is burning faster than the H414 in that case with that bullet. This is one of those examples that show you can't always depend on burn rates to select powders. The burn rates change depending on the application in which they are used.

That's odd??? Can't argue with published data though!

 

[SheepDog]

When you learn how those rates are measured it makes it easier to understand. The burn rates are measured in a closed bomb test. The powder is detonated in a chamber of a given size that contains all the gases and pressure. Our guns don't work that way. There are bound to be differences in the way we use them.