22BR -Would some kind soul...

[steve123]

please help design the perfect reamer for a repeater using Hornady 88's and up to the 95SMK.

I want to use Lapua brass, thus the reamer designed around it.

Also want the bottom of the bullets approx one third up the neck, doesn't have to be exact.

.004" neck expansion???, I'm thinking a bullet should drop into a fired case with this much expansion??? Would that be around a .254 neck ?? I have one dummy 22BR case but it was neck turned many years ago and I don't remember what it was originally.

Body dimensions are the biggy. I don't want any bolt clicking going on but don't want any more than needs be so cases will last a long time.

Or please point me in the right direction for a 22BR print or reamer that already is about perfect for my needs.

Other advice about dies, etc, as a resource, or possible trouble shooting you didn't see until you did a 22BR is welcomed. I have a Redding type S FL 6mmBR die already and I know it won't size all the way down the neck. I was thinking that I'll buy a inbetween neck bushing for first size down???


Thanks in advance

 

[17VLD]

I would be thinking about a 22BRA or a 22 Dasher to push those heavy for caliber bullets using that same case.I bet Alex Wheeler could fix you up with the right dies and specs and perhaps build the gun too.
Matt

 

[hogpatrol]

^^^^This^^^^ I believe the 22BR is better suited to 60 gr and under bullets. I have a 1-12 and the 55BKs are a perfect match. I'm turning necks with .002 clearance.

 

[linebaugh]

Steve123,

How soon do you need your information? I am basically working through this right now and the reamer should be in by mid month and the bbl is in Saturday. I have a print and can give you the idea behind my methidology but I am not running the bullet 2/3 in the neck and I am running a .250 neck and blowing the shoulder forward .050. My reamer should set the 95 dead even with the neck juncture. That said if you were sold on the 2/3 idea my freebore would suit your needs I presume.

I would rather wait and take the plunge before I give you any concrete advise. Yes .254 neck is fine for no turn. Bullets do not "fall" into the case after firing on my present chamber but I rented the reamer as a trial to be sure the concept was correct. They do push in with virtually no resistance.

I would send you my print and concept but I would prefer you waited until I have better data to go forward.

 

[NorCalMikie]

I believe the 22BR is better suited to 60 gr and under bullets.

If you start off shooting "88s", it won't be too long before you can't get close to the lands.
What I do is go with ZERO freebore and load the lightest bullets you can get your hands on. From there, as the throat wears, (and it will, sooner than you expect ) you can go to heavier bullets and still reach the lands.
I've said it before but, nothing worse that loading up your favorite bullets and you can't get anywhere close to the lands because of the throat wear.
Go zero to short freebore from the start and lite bullets. If you go longer (freebore) from the start, you barrel is half gone already. Been there, done that and already sent one barrel down the road because of the longer throat.

 

[steve123]

I would be thinking about a 22BRA or a 22 Dasher to push those heavy for caliber bullets using that same case.I bet Alex Wheeler could fix you up with the right dies and specs and perhaps build the gun too.
Matt

Thanks Matt, not a bad idea.There's a lot to be said about experience and putting out quality, which Alex has/does.

 

[steve123]

^^^^This^^^^ I believe the 22BR is better suited to 60 gr and under bullets. I have a 1-12 and the 55BKs are a perfect match. I'm turning necks with .002 clearance.

For perspectives sake as far as what I'm looking for...

Currently running the low node in 223AI with a 28" 7 twist, using 24.8 grs of powder, behind 88's, at 2813 fps. This load is only .1 mil more wind at 600Y and .2 mil more at "1000Y/5mph from 3 oclock" than my 6x47L using 105 hybrids at 3172 fps!

22BR - Anywhere around 3000 fps with 88's or 100 fps slower with 95's in a 25" is fine with me and that gets me almost equal in wind to my 6x47l.

I want to run the low node in the 22BR for practice most of the time to save some barrel wear. High node for matches.

For varmints I have a couple other rifles.

 

[steve123]

Steve123,

How soon do you need your information? I am basically working through this right now and the reamer should be in by mid month and the bbl is in Saturday. I have a print and can give you the idea behind my methidology but I am not running the bullet 2/3 in the neck and I am running a .250 neck and blowing the shoulder forward .050. My reamer should set the 95 dead even with the neck juncture. That said if you were sold on the 2/3 idea my freebore would suit your needs I presume.

I would rather wait and take the plunge before I give you any concrete advise. Yes .254 neck is fine for no turn. Bullets do not "fall" into the case after firing on my present chamber but I rented the reamer as a trial to be sure the concept was correct. They do push in with virtually no resistance.

I would send you my print and concept but I would prefer you waited until I have better data to go forward.

I'm not in a huge hurry, although my 6x47 barrel has 1400 rounds on it. Depending how much I use it I could make to spring maybe. I'm quite sure if it does go it'll go out during a match, lol.

Might even buy a cheap 6mmBR prefit to mess with this winter.

Yes, I'm definitely interested in your ideas and about the neck expansion!

Thanks!

 

[steve123]

If you start off shooting "88s", it won't be too long before you can't get close to the lands.
What I do is go with ZERO freebore and load the lightest bullets you can get your hands on. From there, as the throat wears, (and it will, sooner than you expect ) you can go to heavier bullets and still reach the lands.
I've said it before but, nothing worse that loading up your favorite bullets and you can't get anywhere close to the lands because of the throat wear.
Go zero to short freebore from the start and lite bullets. If you go longer (freebore) from the start, you barrel is half gone already. Been there, done that and already sent one barrel down the road because of the longer throat.

Hey there Mike!

The 5mmFBI is working great BTW.

I look at that 20-22TCM case almost every time I go into the shop, How'd yours turn out?

Good point you made. It's a catch22, bullet seated way out provides the opportunity to stuff more powder in vs bullet way in. I guess that's where the 95's come in. I could start with the 88's and end with the 95's as far as chasing the throat. In fact I might go to the 115DTACS in my 6x47L soon because it's a longer bullet/bearing surface.
Sometimes if I run out of throat, especially if the rifle isn't shooting good anymore, I do a seating test seating the bullet deeper til I find a good depth. At that point the barrel is about done though.
Truth be told I'm not a benchrest shooter so 1/2 moa works fine for me, it's the wind that gets me. Low recoil/rifle upset is what I'm wanting for this rifle and why I am considering 22 cal instead of 6 or 6.5. Well and 30 grains of powder and a 18 cent bullet is cool too.

 

[linebaugh]

For perspectives sake as far as what I'm looking for...

Currently running the low node in 223AI with a 28" 7 twist, using 24.8 grs of powder, behind 88's, at 2813 fps. This load is only .1 mil more wind at 600Y and .2 mil more at "1000Y/5mph from 3 oclock" than my 6x47L using 105 hybrids at 3172 fps!

22BR - Anywhere around 3000 fps with 88's or 100 fps slower with 95's in a 25" is fine with me and that gets me almost equal in wind to my 6x47l.

I want to run the low node in the 22BR for practice most of the time to save some barrel wear. High node for matches.

For varmints I have a couple other rifles.

2900 with 95s and 3000 with 88s is about where I got with the slightly improved version of this caliber. That was with one powder trial for each and these were max area not nodes. The chamber is not set up as I wished it would be and the bbl has about 1400 rounds on it with 1300 or so as a 22250 ackley prior to rechamber. I suspect with the new reamer to gain some on this and this barrel has been slow anyway. You are probably about spot on with your wants and actual outcomes. I went improved to add a little capacity to either catch a better node or cut pressure slightly for better bbl life.
Even cutting the chamber kinda wonky, a short throat and with the higher round count the gun still shoots half moa with nearly no load development.

Everything you are looking at and wanting is spot on with my limited research thus far. I or my friend will be shooting a match with the 88s in this configuration next weekend so I will have some more feedback then.

As stateed earlier above you may want to consider running the bullets at the neck shoulder juncture do to errosion. Starting with 88s and going to the 95s is also an option I ended up doing earlier when this bbl was a 22250ai. Its sound advice I believe.

 

[NorCalMikie]

One thing I've not bothered with is checking the FPS. They're all going in the same hole so why bother? I always load to the lower node. No pressure to deal with and my brass lasts a loooong time. You load at the higher node, it's 75* when you load, you head out to go shooting, it's 100*+ and you have to beat the bolt open and the primers are falling out of your brass? Time to leave yourself a little wiggle room with your loads.Bullets stuffed .010 into the lands with the base at the shoulder neck junction and YES I've dumped powder into the action when pulling a loaded round. I was expecting it so it wasn't a big deal.
A 5 shot group that can be covered with a dime is the norm. Some days even better.

 

[Cuando]

Ok, ok, ok.... (Joe Pesci voice.)


Just finished a .22br as mentioned here and elsewhere.

Kissing lands with an 88 @ 1.778" bto puts the base just north of the neck/shoulder junction but not 1/3 up the neck, and with the loooong neck, would not be a concern.

If you're worried about the click, why not order a reamer for Lapua brass from JGS and have him send the reamer print to Whidden?

Seems like it would put you in tall cotton.

 

[steve123]

Looks good!

Thanks for the info you gave me as we texted back and forth.

I'll get on the phone with JGS and others next week.

 

[steve123]

I would be thinking about a 22BRA or a 22 Dasher to push those heavy for caliber bullets using that same case.I bet Alex Wheeler could fix you up with the right dies and specs and perhaps build the gun too.
Matt

Yes, I haven't made my mind up yet and am open to any 22BR or wildcats right at this point.

It's amazing that many of the available reamers I looked into are for 22BR Remington instead of for Lapua or Norma.

Also most businesses that I made inquiries to in the industry don't return emails or phone calls.

Thanks to those who have tried to help in both this thread and in PM.

Still looking around but haven't had much luck.

 

[Cuando]

Some guys are just beyond help.

 

[steve123]

Some guys are just beyond help.

It's like this Jeff.

Getting my own reamer is one option, not the only option, I've been exploring all options. If I get my own reamer it better be damn well exactly what I want, right??!!

I don't want a cheap prefit made for 6 BR Rem specs. Nor do I like taking the chance on a lesser barrel but I'm glad for you that yours shoots decent. I've been down the cheap barrel way before and I don't buy from that Co anymore. I shot that POS for a year unfortunately, a .7" groups was all it'd do on a good day. BTW it's not the brand you bought.

I do want a premium prefit barrel because I don't want to send my rifle off, because there's the shipping, the insurance, both ways, and I really get pissed off when 6 weeks turns into 9 months, like had happened with my first build.

I do have several options semi locally but they want to do a shouldered barrel which is almost $800 by the time I buy the barrel and get the work done.

I bought the action I have because I want to use prefits, that's not hard to understand is it.

One GS I know of, that does premium prefits, is so backed up that people are starting to complain publicly.

One GS will do me a prefit for much less on a premium barrel. But he doesn't have a reamer and the reamers that can be rented are for Rem brass specs. He offered to design a reamer and buy one but that's extra time on top of his current back log. So far this option has the most appeal.

Again, a decent percentage of the GS's or shops that I called don't even bother to call back, now if they won't call me I'm certainly not doing business with them. I don't care how good or popular they are.

I've got other rifles to play with even though my go-to's nearing it's end so I'm not in a huge hurry.

The topic, helping design a reamer. I know a lot of things, just not about reamer prints or what exactly I need for this reamer, but I have learned some things lately.

Don't worry, I will get it all worked out eventually. Even though I'm apparently a "lost cause". There's people that could get me a reamer designed in minutes but where are they???

One guy here on this forum is figuring out the freebore for a 22 Dasher using 88's above the NSJ and using Lapua brass specs, so I might use his design.

 

[Ned Ludd]

Some guys are just beyond help.

I think you're being a little hard on the guy, especially since you could have easily provided the information he is actually looking for and chose not to for some reason. So I'll ask you directly, exactly what is the freebore on the chamber you used to load the 88s to "touching" in your picture above? Without that information, the other measurements aren't all that useful. Better yet, do you have the actual reamer print? All that was really needed here was for someone to post a reamer print.

 

[Cuando]

Who gives a crap about freebore numbers when you could send JGS a few dummies and get exactly what you want?

The idea that you'd get anything but 100% satisfaction from JGS is asinine.

 

[Cuando]

A Savage prefit in 22br is a tall order....

 

[NorCalMikie]

If it was me, I'd be looking at lighter bullets seated with the base at the shoulder neck junction (not into the powder charge) and full or almost full neck contact. No worries about the seated bullets falling out of the neck when trying to reach the worn lands with the long freebore.

And as for ordering a barrel, get it the way YOU want.
(A Savage prefit in 22br is a tall order....)???
Just about any barrel maker will chamber and build you a barrel with the specs YOU WANT. Most have more than one reamer with different specs to choose from.