22BR - Is this normal, or do I have a problem here?

[Thunder]

Howdy Guys -
I'm having some difficulty with my 22BR, and I can't figure out why. And I sure could use some advice.

A little background before I get into the problem.

The gun is a Savage Model 12 single shot with a Wenig LH Thumbhole stock and a Lothar Walther SS barrel.
The barrel was originally chambered in .223, and had only 304 rounds through it. I decided this Summer to have it rechambered to the 22BR. So I shipped it off to the gunsmith with instructions, in which I mentioned that I would be handloading with Lapua brass only.

While the barrel was being done I posted on this forum that I needed a couple of 22BR cases to load up and fireform so I could send to Harrell's to get one of their FL resizing dies.
One of the forum members, Preacher,nice guy, BTW), offered to send me three, which he did. I also bought from him a Wilson 22BR seater die.

When the barrel arrived I had to have the threads 'extended' about 3/8" so that I could screw it into the receiver far enough to set the headspace. I then set the headspace with the resized cases from Preacher, and proceeded to fireform each of them three times, then sent to Harrell's. About two weeks later the FL die arrived,very nice die!).

Now, for the problem.
I resized and loaded several new Lapua 6MM BR cases. I shot one a week ago at a nearby PH Area, came home & put the gun in a gun vise and discovered that the fired case chambers very hard. The bolt requires too much force to close. So I then used the Harrels 'tool' to measure the head to shoulder distance.
It measured 1.077".
COAL is 1.558"

New resized case measures -
Head to shoulder 1.060"
COAL is 1.558"

I 'snugged up' the barrel a little on the receiver to see if that would make a difference. Fired one round yesterday, Sat. the 22nd, but got the same result and same measurements.

I've used the Sinclair 'Chamber Length Gage' to measure the chamber length at 1.574". So I've got .016" clearance there.

So, I'm wondering, should the 'Head to Shoulder' length grow .017" with just one fireing?

If so, then I'm going to have to FL size or 'bump' the shoulder for each reload.

Or, does it sound like I have a chamber problem?

Thanks for any help that you can offer.
Ron

 

[BoydAllen]

Get a GO gage, and learn how to set up your FL die. In your post you stated that your sized case was .017 shorter from shoulder to head than a fired case. With properly set up barrel headspace, and and any reloading die that I own this much shoulder setback is imposable. Also make sure that the case neck does not extend beyond the end of Harrell's brass gauge. If you have truly bumped your brass back .017 from chamber headspace and then fired it, you should probably toss the brass. Cut one in half lengthwise and you will see why.

 

[Thunder]

BoydAllen -
I'll order a GO gage from Brownells and start this over.
And I'll try to get the Harrells FL die adjusted properly.,It didn't come with instructions)

Actually I am not resizeing or 'bumping' the two once-fired cases. I just ran two new Lapua 6MM BR brass through the Harrells die to neck down to 22BR, then load and shoot.

I'm just trying to figure out why the two new necked down & loaded cases that measures 1.060" head to shoulder would measure 1.077" head to shoulder after one fireing.

Seems like my chamber dimension is longer than an unfired case.

I'll keep working at it.
Thanks much.
Ron

 

[WayneShaw]

Boyd is right, get a GO gauge and use it to set your headspace. Be sure to tkae the ejector out to set the barrel properly. Fire a new case, measure it, then set your die to bump the shouder no more than .002". You should be good to go.

 

[AlNyhus]

You've just discovered what can happen when you headspace with a case instead of the proper Go guage. Having the ejector in the bolt can further complicate this as it puts a foward 'load' on the case and can gve you a false 'feel'.

What you've got now is effectively a 22BR +.017. That's really not a big deal as long as you adjust the dies properly to bump the shoulder back from the fireformed length,.017 long) and don't set up the die based on the original length....which would result in you setting the shoulder back too far every time you size. It's no big thing to blow the shoulder foward on these BR cases, but setting the shoulders back that much will kill the cases in short order.

All in all, I would agree with Boyd and Wayne that it's probably best to adjust the headspace on a correct Go guage. -Al

P.S. When you check the base-shoulder dimension on a fired case...make sure and remove the primer. Fired primers can add a few thou. to the measurement, especially in factory-ish guns and'or guns that have a lot of clearance between the firing pin/hole.

 

[Klong]

I must be missing something here. Typically if you take a fired case and just neck size it only it should fit back in the chamber it was fire in for severtal times before being a problem to fit back in that chamber right? My 22br will need to be full length resized about every 3rd or 4th firing. Am I misunderstanding the problem?

 

[Thunder]

Hey Guys -
Just got home from work and read your posts.
Wayne & Al, I appreciate your additional input. I'll take your advice, and should know something by this weekend.

Klong, the fired case does chamber, but the bolt is 'very' hard to close.
Hopefully I'll have this cleared up soon. If I'm still having problems after trying what Boyd, Wayne & Al suggested, I'll be back with the details.

BTW, I adjusted my Harrells FL die with the following method.

- Removed the bushing from the die.
- Set the die 'high'.
- Put one of the fired cases in the shell holder.
- Screwed the die down incrementally while running the case into the die after each adjustment.
- Measured the head to shoulder length after each adjustment.
- Once I achieved a .002" shorter measurement, head to shoulder, tightened the lock ring, carefully.
- Reinstalled the Wilson bushing in the die and run the case into the die to neck down the case.

If this is not the correct method, please let me know, and I'll try it again.

Thanks 'so much' for your time and help with this.
Ron