22arc

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Can anyone tell me specs or post a print for their 22 ARC/Grendel set up for light bullets, meaning 52-55is grain bullets and Lapua brass?

I have what I think drawn up but just looking to see if anyone would change some little something about theirs if they had it to do over. It's nice to get it right the first time. Lol!

I'll post the preliminary print in a minute here.
Of note, I can work with your numbers but check out the end of the case mouth area. That reduces my freebore number by approximately. 045 vs a standard 45 degree angle at the chamber end.

 

[223762]

Hey, can someone let me know what the case neck measures on a loaded round. Thanks.

 

[B23]

Hey, can someone let me know what the case neck measures on a loaded round. Thanks.

Hornady factory loaded ammo 22 ARC neck dia. .2485 - .249 I measured all 20 in the box.

 

[223762]

Hornady factory loaded ammo 22 ARC neck dia. .2485 - .249 I measured all 20 in the box.

Awesome. Now I know what bushings I need. Thanks

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Awesome. Now I know what bushings I need. Thanks

Yes, it just depends on the brass. The Lapua is a little thicker and the new stuff is slightly thicker than the old. That's why I went with a .253 neck on mine. .250 was enough on the old Lapua Grendel brass but with the slightly thicker necks of the newer stuff, I went a thou bigger to be on the safe side but not enough to matter, if they go back to the same as before whenever they start making it again.

 

[bobcat93]

I've been shooting one for over 10 years as a 22 LBC. The are quite useful on prarrie dogs. I shoot the varmint weight, up to 70 grains, and am happy with it. It runs the velocities up about 150-200 FPS over the 223 and about 100 over the Valkyrie fir me.

I form it out of Grendel brass and Redding bushing dies. Case life is good and it doesn't use enough powder to be a real barrel burner.

In a bolt gun it does step up nicely by a decent margin over it being used in an AR. I use 7.62X39 bolts over the deeper Grendel and have experienced no breakage.

Hello GL Shooter, ..i still cant get a good picture of a comparison in my head. Between cartridges because i have yet to see a side by side photo.

Do you, or any one else have the ability to take a photo of the 22arc, 223rem, 221 fireball in a line up for comparison.

From my understanding the modern case of the 22arc isnt offering up much more then the 223rem, or perhaps a 223 rem AI.

Are we gaining better case life for reloaders, and gaining the accuracy advantages of the modern case capable of higher pressure
I would also love to see a side by side comparison video accuracy test Between the arc & the PPC family..
The purest in me wants to say with confidence and conviction..No way the Arc beats out the PPC in accuracy.. is there?
Thanks for any information.

 

[GLShooter]

I'll try and get a Pic later today. It maybe Friday AM.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Hello GL Shooter, ..i still cant get a good picture of a comparison in my head. Between cartridges because i have yet to see a side by side photo.

Do you, or any one else have the ability to take a photo of the 22arc, 223rem, 221 fireball in a line up for comparison.

From my understanding the modern case of the 22arc isnt offering up much more then the 223rem, or perhaps a 223 rem AI.

Are we gaining better case life for reloaders, and gaining the accuracy advantages of the modern case capable of higher pressure
I would also love to see a side by side comparison video accuracy test Between the arc & the PPC family..
The purest in me wants to say with confidence and conviction..No way the Arc beats out the PPC in accuracy.. is there?
Thanks for any information.

It's no slouch. I'm shooting a 22 arc with 55s in a borden actioned bench gun, bolt action rifle.
It's shooting small and fast. The Pic below measured about .167 and there's 11 shots through that hole. That load chronod at 3730. I've stepped it up just a bit and should be right at 3800fps now. That's smoking and you won't get there in a gas gun. I consider this load to be very top end in my rifle. The two that opened it low and left, I feel like we're on me but still! Not bad. Had to fireform them to fit the newer load in the case. And it's n133, too. I could get a bit more in there with a really long drop tube or vibrating the case but it's pretty much pressured out right where it is.

 

[GLShooter]

Hello GL Shooter, ..i still cant get a good picture of a comparison in my head. Between cartridges because i have yet to see a side by side photo.

Do you, or any one else have the ability to take a photo of the 22arc, 223rem, 221 fireball in a line up for comparison.

From my understanding the modern case of the 22arc isnt offering up much more then the 223rem, or perhaps a 223 rem AI.

Are we gaining better case life for reloaders, and gaining the accuracy advantages of the modern case capable of higher pressure
I would also love to see a side by side comparison video accuracy test Between the arc & the PPC family..
The purest in me wants to say with confidence and conviction..No way the Arc beats out the PPC in accuracy.. is there?
Thanks for any information.

I'll see what I can do here to answer you. Attached , I hope, are a set of cartridges side by side. L to R is Fireball, 223, 22X6.8, 22 Nosler and the 243 LBC/ARC The capacity chart is what I have measured in my chambers post firing. As noted above you're picking up between 150 and 250 FPS over the 223 depending on the bullet. Lapua cases last a long time and give you great case life I would form my cases out of the in the 6.,5 Grendel vs factory ammo for that reason alone. Just run 'em up in the ARC die and you are GTG.

My 22 LBC was done on an AR and shoots down in the 3's with various bullets. I do have a RUGAGE barrel ready to spin up but it is currently wearing a 243 LBC tube. Hopefully I can shoot it this winter. Based on guns andgunsmitgings work I would say that but has a god protentional for accuracy. It won't replace the PPC IMHO but you don't see any factory guns being chambered up in the 22 PPC case.

Notes on others in my capacity chart. The 22X6.8 is another great little wildcat and it is a simple neckdown on the 6.8 SPC case. It is hell on wheels in the prairie dog fields. It and the LBC/ARC are about the same in speed as you can pump the pressures up a tad over the Grendel sized case. BTW the NXS in the chart is a full sized HAGAR case necked to 22 using OTC dies. It is truly side by side with a 22-250. Unfortunately Hornady quit making the brass and nothing is available that is easily convertible.

Greg

221 FIREBALL 223 22X6.8 22 NOSLER 22 LBC/ARC

 

[SurgeonCO]

Im shooting a 24” proof on a ARC action. 88’s and 90’s in the 2960 range and the 95’s go 2870. Did well in a match with factory 88’s going 2850, out to 1200 yds. Beats the pants off a BR

 

[No manches"]

Im shooting a 24” proof on a ARC action. 88’s and 90’s in the 2960 range and the 95’s go 2870. Did well in a match with factory 88’s going 2850, out to 1200 yds. Beats the pants off a BR

If you don't mind sharing,..
What twist rate are you using?.

Am looking into getting one put together.
Bolt action out of a Howa mini grendel.

 

[SurgeonCO]

If you don't mind sharing,..
What twist rate are you using?.

Am looking into getting one put together.
Bolt action out of a Howa mini grendel.

7 twist

 

[No manches"]

Thanks @SurgeonCO

 

[searcher]

Seems every week we have a "new" .22 to outdo the other. Each has some unique aspects - but there is a clear divide as to what they can be used for (especially economically, in terms of barrel heat and wear), such as wanting to shoot high-volume varmints or, conversely making the fewer, longer shots where barrel heat is not encountered. Then there is true flexibility as to which calibers shoot lighter bullets better or heavier ones better due to the throating and obtaining good bullet position relative to the lands. It makes it easier as to which caliber to hone-in on when one can first identify which bullet they want to shoot. Kind of like the .22 Nosler and the Valkyrie. Light bullets, I want the Nosler. The heavy bullets, the Valkyrie, etc. Given it shoots 10% more powder than a .223, it won't keep a barrel cool, but for longer range, lower-volume shooting, it would be good, in my mind. I kind of view it as a slot for which there was no need, given all the great calibers higher and lower than it. Runs too hot to keep a barrel cool - so may as well go a bit bigger if long range is what one really wants...... That Hornady spec'd the throating for their new ELD VT bullet, it does make sense that it should deliver the goods with a good tube, though.

 

[William Vogel]

I don’t think Hornady speced the throat for their ELD bullets because to load them up close to the lands they are too long to load in the AR magazine which is where I think they intended them to shoot. I’m single feeding them in mine and I can get sub 1/2 MOA groups with them at 2.315 length but at mag length they produce 1 MOA groups. Using tangent ogive bullets like Sierra Matchking keeps me at or below mag length and they also shoot good. I have to try the 73 ELD. They aren’t secant ogive and they should fit the magazine with the bullet seated close to the lands.

 

[dirtclod]

Some barrel manufactures are using a .060 Freebore instead of the .135 freebore as stated on the SAAMI Reamer Print. The .060 Freebore is the same as 223 Wylde and after Extensive testing they found it to be way more accurate with all types of ammo. Where the reasoning for the .135 freebore came from they have no idea. Makes very little sense as the ammo COL would have to be longer than can be fitting in magazines designed for AR's to make use of that long of freebore. IF you want the .135 freebore, they will do it with the understanding they cannot guarantee any type of accuracy.

 

[Benchrest Braxton]

It's no slouch. I'm shooting a 22 arc with 55s in a borden actioned bench gun, bolt action rifle.
It's shooting small and fast. The Pic below measured about .167 and there's 11 shots through that hole. That load chronod at 3730. I've stepped it up just a bit and should be right at 3800fps now. That's smoking and you won't get there in a gas gun. I consider this load to be very top end in my rifle. The two that opened it low and left, I feel like we're on me but still! Not bad. Had to fireform them to fit the newer load in the case. And it's n133, too. I could get a bit more in there with a really long drop tube or vibrating the case but it's pretty much pressured out right where it is.

how many grains of n133? barrel length?

i am getting 3,575 fps with 53 vmax in my 26" 223 with 26.0 grains. wondering if i should try an arc next

 

[Lefty2506]

how many grains of n133? barrel length?

i am getting 3,575 fps with 53 vmax in my 26" 223 with 26.0 grains. wondering if i should try an arc next

I'm in a similar boat. I'm getting 3500 fps from my 26" barrel with 24.7gr of N133. Hornady's data for bolt guns has a max charge of N133 at 27.6 gr with a velocity of only 3450, and the fastest powers are only producing 3650 (both based on a 24" barrel). Either way, 3650 isn't enough of an increase in performance to justify (IMHO) buying a new barrel, or another upper and paying $0.70 ea for new Starline brass. From a bolt gun, I'd really expect the 22 ARC to be somewhere between a 22 BR and a 22 Dasher, accept that factory brass would be readily available. So far, neither of those things are true.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

I'm in a similar boat. I'm getting 3500 fps from my 26" barrel with 24.7gr of N133. Hornady's data for bolt guns has a max charge of N133 at 27.6 gr with a velocity of only 3450, and the fastest powers are only producing 3650 (both based on a 24" barrel). Either way, 3650 isn't enough of an increase in performance to justify (IMHO) buying a new barrel, or another upper and paying $0.70 ea for new Starline brass. From a bolt gun, I'd really expect the 22 ARC to be somewhere between a 22 BR and a 22 Dasher, accept that factory brass would be readily available. So far, neither of those things are true.

Both a 22 BR and Dasher are bigger than a 22 ARC(Grendel). I'm curious why you believe a 22 ARC should be as fast as either of them.

I've just started shooting a 22 ARC in a full blown BR rifle...Borden BR action, Borden stock and it currently has a 23 inch14 twist Bartlien IIRC, on it. It shoots great and max speeds with n133 at what appears to be absolute very top end load is right at 3800fps or just below that. Again, that's a smoking hot load and you may never get to that before having problems in a different rifle. I think there might be a touch more speed there with the right powder but it's still very early. Benchrest accuracy is there with n133 and 55's though. More testing to come over the winter with it.

 

[J Fess]

I am a bit late to the party, but has anyone sectioned a 22 ARC and compared case wall thinkness to a Grendel case? When Lapua designed the 6.5 Grendel case, the emphasis was on max case volume for the 52,000 psi max needed for good AR15 bolt life. This led to relatively thin case walls near the base. When combined with the deeper Grendel AR15 bolt and generous entrance chamfer on the base of the chamber for reliable feeding, overpressure rounds are prone to expansion near the case head (the "Dreaded Grendel Magnum Effect- bottom photo). With overgassed semi-auto guns that start extraction too soon, it is a bigger issue.
I do not have a good idea of how much of the problem is early extraction vs reduced case support and wonder if the same thing might be seen on the "AR-like" bolt of the Uintah Precision rifle mentioned earlier in this thread.

Although most bolt action rifles provide better case head support than an AR15, I wondered if Hornady hedged their bets a little and thickened up the case wall near the web. Thanks