222 Remington, Short Range Benchrest Build,

[wildcatter]

The one in the picture, it is a lightly brushed aluminum finish, just enough to nock the shine off. I am tempted to polish everything, the stock, action, and trigger guard, I cant find Kelbly 1" rings in the tall or medium height, but if I do and they are in the white, we will powder coat them in gloss black.

Right now the brass looks like my big holdup! But I talked to Lapua a couple days ago, and they said it is still on the manufacturing list, but no idea when it will run again.

I bought 100 rounds of the Nosler 17 fireball brass to get it, it was all I can find and all it needs is run through the Mach IV sizing die and .010" trimmed off the neck and good to go. I will be watching for the next run of 221 Fireball as well for it, Unless I get lucky and the Nosler brass turns out to be as good as Lapua, I will be standing on the throttle on that rifle,, not holding my breath on that one!

 

[BoydAllen]

Wildcatter -

Howdy !

FWIW:
The " Shilen Team's " repsonse to my question of when they started to offer " ratchet rifling " for benchrest barrels was:

" Since the 90's, possibly the 80's. "



With regards,
357Mag

It was the late 90s. At the time I was doing product writing for Shooters News Magazine, and Doug Shilen was running Shilen barrels. The ratchet had just been announced and he gave me one to try. At that time I did not have a 6PPC, but I wanted to build one so I asked for a LV contour, 14" twist 6mm. It ended up being the first barrel on a rifle that Jerry Stiller built for me on one of his then new Viper actions.

 

[357Mag]

The one in the picture, it is a lightly brushed aluminum finish, just enough to nock the shine off. I am tempted to polish everything, the stock, action, and trigger guard, I cant find Kelbly 1" rings in the tall or medium height, but if I do and they are in the white, we will powder coat them in gloss black.

Right now the brass looks like my big holdup! But I talked to Lapua a couple days ago, and they said it is still on the manufacturing list, but no idea when it will run again.

I bought 100 rounds of the Nosler 17 fireball brass to get it, it was all I can find and all it needs is run through the Mach IV sizing die and .010" trimmed off the neck and good to go. I will be watching for the next run of 221 Fireball as well for it, Unless I get lucky and the Nosler brass turns out to be as good as Lapua, I will be standing on the throttle on that rifle,, not holding my breath on that one!my wild

Wildcatter -

Howdy, again !

Another question, if I might ?

What method will use be using to make your barre " markings " ?

FWIW:
When Fred did the metal work on my first custom varmint rifle, he marked the chambering ( my " .22-35 Remington " wildcat ) on the barrel; using letter & number punches. Impact marking.
That was early in 1977. The barrel was a 24" SS .224" cal Hart 5-groove 1.375" straight bull.

When Fred re-contoured the barrel a few years later, he both reduced the OD; and ran the taper pretty much all the way back to the shoulder on the barrel. To re-mark the rifle's chambering on the barrel, he went the punch route; again. There appears on the re-contoured barrel..... visible ghost marks of two of the original marking characters; which have been over-layed by the newer imact markings made after the re-contour.
I DK whether use of punches was Fred's prefered marking method for " varmint rifles ", or whether he also applied this marking method to barrels for the benchrest gun he built ?


With regards,
357Mag

 

[357Mag]

Right now my search is the rings, and BRASS, I mean good Brass to give it it's best opportunity to compete favorably against the 6mm and namely the PPC! I just need 50 or so Lapua cases, and might just have a budy that has them, but he's out of town working till???????

I got till spring to really get it up and running. But make no mistake, there is no turning back now. The best thing about this new BR build, is it's been decades since I spexxnt so little to build a competitive rifle and have results this good at this point in the build. The main thing now is not to make the mistake of settling for less than what is necessary to get the results needed to compete with this caliber today.

Wildcatter -

Howdy !

FWIW:
IF you wanted to start, by disassembling factory- loaded Lapua .222 Remington ammo to obtain cases.....

There is 1 20rnd box in stock @ Graf's
and
5 20 rnd boxes in stock @ Guns.com .
Math price works out to around $1.85 ea cartridge, prior to addition of shipping fees.

20 cases obtained via this method, would give at least a rudimentary load work-up capability



With regards,
357Mag

 

[wildcatter]

Wildcatter -

Howdy !

FWIW:
IF you wanted to start, by disassembling factory- loaded Lapua .222 Remington ammo to obtain cases.....

There is 1 20rnd box in stock @ Graf's
and
5 20 rnd boxes in stock @ Guns.com .
Math price works out to around $1.85 ea cartridge, prior to addition of shipping fees.

20 cases obtained via this method, would give at least a rudimentary load work-up capability



With regards,
357Mag

That won't be an option, it has been over 40 years since I have bought any centerfire ammo, other than a case of Winchester Law Enforcement ammo, and that was only to get self defense ammo loaded with the unobtainable improved Black Talon HP. Since it was not offered as a component because of federal government azz kissing, I had no choice.

I will just have to wait till the next production run, or get lucky and find a box somewhere in a isolated low traffic spot. I even go thru running purchased RF ammo thru my loading press before I shoot it, it has to be uniformed by the Neil Waltz dye before it is worthy of me dropping a firing pin on it. But I just can't talk myself into purchasing factory loaded centerfire ammo for any reason, it just won't happen.

 

[wildcatter]

Wildcatter -

Howdy, again !

Another question, if I might ?

What method will use be using to make your barre " markings " ?

FWIW:
When Fred did the metal work on my first custom varmint rifle, he marked the chambering ( my " .22-35 Remington " wildcat ) on the barrel; using letter & number punches. Impact marking.
That was early in 1977. The barrel was a 24" SS .224" cal Hart 5-groove 1.375" straight bull.

When Fred re-contoured the barrel a few years later, he both reduced the OD; and ran the taper pretty much all the way back to the shoulder on the barrel. To re-mark the rifle's chambering on the barrel, he went the punch route; again. There appears on the re-contoured barrel..... visible ghost marks of two of the original marking characters; which have been over-layed by the newer imact markings made after the re-contour.
I DK whether use of punches was Fred's prefered marking method for " varmint rifles ", or whether he also applied this marking method to barrels for the benchrest gun he built ?


With regards,
357Mag

Both the hunting rifles I owned from Fred not only had the chamber designation stamped on it, but on the opposite side had "Sinclair" hand stamped in the barrel. But Fred Changed his thoughts on personal verification after his lawsuit! A lawsuit Fred won but cost him highly in legal fees because some clown was looking to blame someone else for his irresponsible actions, and ceased his building fine rifles for anyone!

When Ron Pence started making his fine hand rifled and deep hole drilled barrels, Fred warned and suggested he never put his name on anything. Fred told him it was just opening a door for a lawsuit when some "Eddie" creates a blunder, whether it was anyone else's fault or not. Pence dye marked his caliber designations chemically in the barrel but never put his name on one.

But Fred @ Sharp Shooter Supply is the Smith on this gun and Fred does stamp same as Sinclair, his name on one side, and the caliber with any tight neck designation as well as barrel twist, this barrel will bear that information.

Even the 17 barrel that came on this rifle, and the whole reason this all came about, will have the old Javelina dye markings polished from its bead blasted finish, with Freds name on it and the new 17 Mach IV 1-11 twist and .196" NK stamped on it. Which by the way I am picking up finished Friday, to become the second barrel, along with the 6BR Norma barrel already chambered by SSS, I will use on the Savage Axis Varmint rifle that we built from my old Pence 27.5" 6mm AI barrel Pence made.

The throat was shot out and set my safe for over 20 years, and brought back to life as a 22.5" 6BR Norma. This 17 MK IV will be for early summer thru early spring for crows and small vermin, and the 6BR for early Spring till early summer when the beans are small enough for ground hogs or other vermin that time of year. But this rifle has been dedicated to Pence barrels and my dedicated varmint rifle. The stock is a custom stock Fred makes at Sharp Shooter Supply, with my finish, stained using fall Black Walnut hulls from my backyard, and sealed with Satin Defthane Spray exterior urethane.

 

[357Mag]

That won't be an option, it has been over 40 years since I have bought any centerfire ammo, other than a case of Winchester Law Enforcement ammo, and that was only to get self defense ammo loaded with the unobtainable improved Black Talon HP. Since it was not offered as a component because of federal government azz kissing, I had no choice.

I will just have to wait till the next production run, or get lucky and find a box somewhere in a isolated low traffic spot. I even go thru running purchased RF ammo thru my loading press before I shoot it, it has to be uniformed by the Neil Waltz dye before it is worthy of me dropping a firing pin on it. But I just can't talk myself into purchasing factory loaded centerfire ammo for any reason, it just won't happen.

Wildcatter -

Understood !


With regards,
357Mag

 

[357Mag]

The one in the picture, it is a lightly brushed aluminum finish, just enough to nock the shine off. I am tempted to polish everything, the stock, action, and trigger guard, I cant find Kelbly 1" rings in the tall or medium height, but if I do and they are in the white, we will powder coat them in gloss black.

Right now the brass looks like my big holdup! But I talked to Lapua a couple days ago, and they said it is still on the manufacturing list, but no idea when it will run again.

I bought 100 rounds of the Nosler 17 fireball brass to get it, it was all I can find and all it needs is run through the Mach IV sizing die and .010" trimmed off the neck and good to go. I will be watching for the next run of 221 Fireball as well for it, Unless I get lucky and the Nosler brass turns out to be as good as Lapua, I will be standing on the throttle on that rifle,, not holding my breath on that one!

Wildcatter -

Howdy once more !

It just occured to me......

I think I have a pair of medium Kelbly 1" rings ( polished aluminum ) that have been sitting idle for a few years now ( I'm using Ken Farrell rings / 20moa base ).

Lemme' see if I can locate those rings, tommorrow.

They are the 2- screw, and were ever so genlty " lapped in ".

Film @ 11:00......


With regards,
357Mag

 

[wildcatter]

Wildcatter -

Howdy once more !

It just occured to me......

I think I have a pair of medium Kelbly 1" rings ( polished aluminum ) that have been sitting idle for a few years now ( I'm using Ken Farrell rings / 20moa base ).

Lemme' see if I can locate those rings, tommorrow.

They are the 2- screw, and were ever so genlty " lapped in ".

Film @ 11:00......


With regards,
357Mag

Please, Let me know the height from bottom of ring to top of dovetail distance, and if your willing to part with them, I'm interested. I will just have Fred powder coat them gloss black. I can by Harrell's, but they don't have the multi flat look the Kelbly's do on the top strap, I much prefer. Thanks for checking!

 

[357Mag]

Please, Let me know the height from bottom of ring to top of dovetail distance, and if your willing to part with them, I'm interested. I will just have Fred powder coat them gloss black. I can by Harrell's, but they don't have the multi flat look the Kelbly's do on the top strap, I much prefer. Thanks for checking!

Wildcatter -

OK..... will do tommorrow, before noon local.


With regards,
357Mag

 

[AlNyhus]

Wildcatter, check your PM's. -Al

 

[10XSHOOTER]

Try 4D reamer rentals. for $50.00 you can get a reamer for 10 days. Another 15.00 will get you a pair of guages

 

[357Mag]

Please, Let me know the height from bottom of ring to top of dovetail distance, and if your willing to part with them, I'm interested. I will just have Fred powder coat them gloss black. I can by Harrell's, but they don't have the multi flat look the Kelbly's do on the top strap, I much prefer. Thanks for checking!

Wildcatter -

OK.... here go'es....

I did take a look for the rings; but did not find them. However......

I often take excess shootig-related items to my best friend & shooting buddy back in NE Indiana.

I have called him, to see if he could check for the rings @ his place.
IF he can find them, you would be welcome to have them.

Perhaps even better......

*** He says he has a set of 2 screw tall Kelbly 1" rings ,that are " semi-polished ". ***
My friend is an active NBRSA Easter Region shooter, in fact... I believe he is now the president for the Eastern Region; or whatever you call that position.

He says he thinks they are notionally called " 1" tall rings. My friend has suggested that if he can't find my 2 screw ( medium ht ) set, that you could E-mail him directly; to discuss his set of Kelbly 1" rings.

I told him that you would want a height measurement taken on the rings.

My friend knew Fred for as long as I did, and dealt with him much more frequently.
I told him about your " tribute " gun


Let's do talk, again !


With regards,
Kevin 357Mag

 

[wildcatter]

Well rings brass and scope now in hand. I have access to the 52 grain bullets I want to try first from a friend of mine before I buy any, if they work to suite me I can get more. Have help from a few guy's here on the forum rounding up a few of the things I was looking for, and shout out a big THANK YOU!

I think I'm going to have to pop for a reamer though, my brass is .2474" with a bullet, and I want to take a couple Thousandth off the neck to assure my best chance at perfect brass, and the closest I've seen on a rental reamer was .450", but Fred is still searching his contacts, and with winter coming on I've got time. It's refreshing though to have all the components rounded up and ready to go.

 

[357Mag]

Wildcatter -

All of the progress you report sounds great !

If memory serves..... when we were runnin' a .222 Savage 112V for shoots over @ the Bluecreek OH range, we were using a .244" neck w/ bullet seated. And like you said, a little bit of neck turning on the cases to ensure uniformity.


With regards,
357Mag

 

[Mike Montgomery]

Wildwater,
Any updates on this post? I have been following this with great interest.
Thanks,
Mike

 

[Knorthcutt222]

Right now my search is the rings, and BRASS, I mean good Brass to give it it's best opportunity to compete favorably against the 6mm and namely the PPC! I just need 50 or so Lapua cases, and might just have a budy that has them, but he's out of town working till???????

I got till spring to really get it up and running. But make no mistake, there is no turning back now. The best thing about this new BR build, is it's been decades since I spent so little to build a competitive rifle and have results this good at this point in the build. The main thing now is not to make the mistake of settling for less than what is necessary to get the results needed to compete with this caliber today.

Wildcatter I blame you on my purchasing decision on this 40xbr 222. I hope to bring it new life. The stock is super lightweight. I don't have a clue who the maker is. I also am not sure on why there are 3 holes on the right side. My guess is shell holder.
I have plans to shoot it as is and see what the rifle can do. But a new barrel is not out of the question. I also want to get the stock painted.

 

[Brayhaven]

Well as it says, I know how great the 6PPC is, I know how other actions are preferred, I know how the stock is outdated, 'BUT' this is not about building the most capable rifle for competition, as I have a Scott Built, Bat "D" with Bix and Andy trigger and an assortment of Krieger Barrels. But I know how capable this caliber, action, stock, and trigger were in it's day, as well as the barrels and triggers of that era, and most of all the gentleman that started me out in this mad world of nothing ever being good enough!

So since I stumbled on this rifle by accident, and seeing it was in less than desirable condition, and in no way in a competition chambering, the price was so low, I said what the heck,,, resurrect it! Fred Sinclair guided my thru my first benchrest rifle and since he had quit building rifles at that point, guided me to a man just starting out building hand cut stainless steel benchrest grade barrels nearby. A man I also became good friends with,,, Ron Pence.

So for starters, here is what we are starting with, pretty rough, but I assure you I will get it cleaned up to Eye Candy Standards! This was last week when I drug it home to show it some love!
View attachment 1374534View attachment 1374535View attachment 1374536View attachment 1374537View attachment 1374538

222 is my all time favorite 22 center fire. Have several and hung hogs and have shot some deer with them. Inherently balanced and accurate caliber. A lot of records set & broken with the triple deuce.

 

[wildcatter]

Wildwater,
Any updates on this post? I have been following this with great interest.
Thanks,
Mike

Been dealing with a knee replacement so ain't been doing much. But I have everything at the gunsmith right now and am just waiting on him.

The knee is getting good enough that with some more moderate weather coming I am ready to slowly start working with it when it is finished.

I did this knee this time of year because it is normal down time for most activities for me right now. But as spring springs, I will too!

 

[357Mag]

Been dealing with a knee replacement so ain't been doing much. But I have everything at the gunsmith right now and am just waiting on him.

The knee is getting good enough that with some more moderate weather coming I am ready to slowly start working with it when it is finished.

I did this knee this time of year because it is normal down time for most activities for me right now. But as spring springs, I will too!

Wildcatter -

Howdy !

Glad to hear that your recovery is progressing !

Maybe get that gun done in time to dispatch some groundhogs ?!

Please do keep us posted !


With regards,
357Mag