20 cal. 50-55gr.
- Thread starter jotrot
- Start date
It's up to you - but I had a 20BR improved (can't remember the PacNor barrel twist and don't feeling like looking it up) but the pet load was with 50gr Bergers, the barrel didn't last more then 700 rounds.
17VLD
Gold $$ Contributor
I have wished for a 48-50grn poly tipped bullet for a long time for my 20Dasher
After talking with various reps from the bullet companies I don't think we will see
anything like this until the gun companies offer a factory 20 caliber with a 9 twist.
Kind of disappointing considering all the 22 bullet weights out there.Time will tell.
Matt
After talking with various reps from the bullet companies I don't think we will see
anything like this until the gun companies offer a factory 20 caliber with a 9 twist.
Kind of disappointing considering all the 22 bullet weights out there.Time will tell.
Matt
I emailed Sierra bullets and hornady, but have only recieved a response from Sierra.
I asked if they have considered making a heavy 20 cal to compete with the 55 gr bergers and this is what he said:
"Yes, we have but it was a while back.
The weight range we considered was 45 – 55 grains but we didn’t find the interest then. Has something changed? With no factory guns twisted tight enough to handle this longer bullet we felt like there is a market but a very small one. Too small for us at that point at least but …. what are you big bullet 20 cal guys looking for in a bullet? And …. how many shooters are there just like you? Those are the questions I get asked when I bring up a new bullet. Sometimes those are difficult questions to answer truthfully and still be convincing. So that is where we are right now. We do appreciate your input and if you have any info that might help I’m all ears. Thanks for taking the time to let us know what you want in the way of a bullet. We do have a R&D meeting coming up soon and I’ll bring up the long heavy 20s again and we’ll see where they go. - Rich"
I asked if they have considered making a heavy 20 cal to compete with the 55 gr bergers and this is what he said:
"Yes, we have but it was a while back.
The weight range we considered was 45 – 55 grains but we didn’t find the interest then. Has something changed? With no factory guns twisted tight enough to handle this longer bullet we felt like there is a market but a very small one. Too small for us at that point at least but …. what are you big bullet 20 cal guys looking for in a bullet? And …. how many shooters are there just like you? Those are the questions I get asked when I bring up a new bullet. Sometimes those are difficult questions to answer truthfully and still be convincing. So that is where we are right now. We do appreciate your input and if you have any info that might help I’m all ears. Thanks for taking the time to let us know what you want in the way of a bullet. We do have a R&D meeting coming up soon and I’ll bring up the long heavy 20s again and we’ll see where they go. - Rich"
Looks like good pressure is being applied!
The stumbling block is the old 'chicken and egg' thing. In this case, we already have at least three bullet makers, one of which is very well known, producing these nice heavy 20 caliber bullets. We likey need to see at least one factory offering of an 8- or 9- twist 20 caliber barrel to begin to see more bullet manufacturers jump in.
Insight in this came when I was deciding which twist rate to use for the 20 Grendel (http://shootersnotes.com/articles/20-grendel/). I was, and still am, looking exclusively at bullets of 55 grains and heavier. This suggests the faster twist. A few knowledgeable folks pointed out that I might get lead puffballs when I shooter lighter bullets in the 8-twist and might have similar problems with even the 55 grain bullets.
I do not yet know how accurate their concerns were, but I went with the 9-twist, which puts a limit on the longest bullet I can use.
My take-away from that experience is that the rifle maker will likely hesitate offering a production 8- or 9- twist barrel if almost all factory ammunition will fare poorly in it.
Further, the only 20 caliber with a serious set of factory offerings is the .204 Ruger. This cartridge does not have enough space to accommodate long-nosed bullets and still work through the magazine. So, we are back to 'which comes first.'
The stumbling block is the old 'chicken and egg' thing. In this case, we already have at least three bullet makers, one of which is very well known, producing these nice heavy 20 caliber bullets. We likey need to see at least one factory offering of an 8- or 9- twist 20 caliber barrel to begin to see more bullet manufacturers jump in.
Insight in this came when I was deciding which twist rate to use for the 20 Grendel (http://shootersnotes.com/articles/20-grendel/). I was, and still am, looking exclusively at bullets of 55 grains and heavier. This suggests the faster twist. A few knowledgeable folks pointed out that I might get lead puffballs when I shooter lighter bullets in the 8-twist and might have similar problems with even the 55 grain bullets.
I do not yet know how accurate their concerns were, but I went with the 9-twist, which puts a limit on the longest bullet I can use.
My take-away from that experience is that the rifle maker will likely hesitate offering a production 8- or 9- twist barrel if almost all factory ammunition will fare poorly in it.
Further, the only 20 caliber with a serious set of factory offerings is the .204 Ruger. This cartridge does not have enough space to accommodate long-nosed bullets and still work through the magazine. So, we are back to 'which comes first.'
TAJ45
Silver $$ Contributor
I thought for sure, by now someone would have mentioned these which have been available @ Wideners for a month if not 2 months.
H22008 20 CAL 45GR SOFT POINT $19.80
This is for 100 iirc. Any reason they wouldn't fit the 44-50gr spot?
I am curious what the 44gr 19 cal dbl hp BC is, about, approx? I have the 19-223, 30°. I picked it up for the reason of bullet choice then got in on a group buy of 55 Bergers. I have a 9 tw that previous owner said stabilated well wi/ his .20 BR. Funny, some say 9 won't and others say "Noooo prob."
I wish Clint Starke never stopped making his........I have more than a few but not many 6mm. He urged me to get some light 308 but I didn't. Frown. Ah well, what did he know? (Hoo Boy) :-[
H22008 20 CAL 45GR SOFT POINT $19.80
This is for 100 iirc. Any reason they wouldn't fit the 44-50gr spot?
I am curious what the 44gr 19 cal dbl hp BC is, about, approx? I have the 19-223, 30°. I picked it up for the reason of bullet choice then got in on a group buy of 55 Bergers. I have a 9 tw that previous owner said stabilated well wi/ his .20 BR. Funny, some say 9 won't and others say "Noooo prob."
I wish Clint Starke never stopped making his........I have more than a few but not many 6mm. He urged me to get some light 308 but I didn't. Frown. Ah well, what did he know? (Hoo Boy) :-[
TAJ45
Silver $$ Contributor
GrocMax - I don't know but going back to my old HS Algebra days when we had to interpolate............my frame of reference/KY windage/SWAG = this:
James Leahy (Calhoun) who does the 19 Cal guns, would NOT until this year thanks to a Saubier regular, do anything but a 13 tw for his .19-223. I talked with him, chided him a bit etc etc but he was adamant.......really focused/stuck on velocities was my take and another gent who'd know him for years and had Jim build him a rifle or two. Would NOT twistem up any faster.
OK, time for the interpolating. IF, and he (Jim C.) swore by gosh and by golly that the 44 would group well in the 13 tw 19-223. So, if a 44 will stabilize in a 19, I'm thinking that the 11tw for a 20 should not be a problem with a 44 gr pill with SAME overall configuration which is the double hollow point. It is pretty large and would probably fly farther with a tighter meplat.
Just compare the % of increase of dia/cross section with the % of tw increase and I think the balance would well be tilted to YES.
Could any deep, deep math types shed any light on my opinion?
James Leahy (Calhoun) who does the 19 Cal guns, would NOT until this year thanks to a Saubier regular, do anything but a 13 tw for his .19-223. I talked with him, chided him a bit etc etc but he was adamant.......really focused/stuck on velocities was my take and another gent who'd know him for years and had Jim build him a rifle or two. Would NOT twistem up any faster.
OK, time for the interpolating. IF, and he (Jim C.) swore by gosh and by golly that the 44 would group well in the 13 tw 19-223. So, if a 44 will stabilize in a 19, I'm thinking that the 11tw for a 20 should not be a problem with a 44 gr pill with SAME overall configuration which is the double hollow point. It is pretty large and would probably fly farther with a tighter meplat.
Just compare the % of increase of dia/cross section with the % of tw increase and I think the balance would well be tilted to YES.
Could any deep, deep math types shed any light on my opinion?
Hornady has a 45 gr soft point that should work just fine.
I have a 1 in 9 twist but use 39gr SBKs mainly as their disruptive nature on crows is quite dramatic. The Berger 50 gr match do kill foxes fine, I find no wound difference between their vermin and match bullets, it just depends if the bullet hits a solid bone and breaks apart.
Without Todd Kindler beating the drum then I think the chances of Sierra or Hornady making something in teh 50-55 gr weight is nil especially as berger have dropped the 50gr themselves.
A
I have a 1 in 9 twist but use 39gr SBKs mainly as their disruptive nature on crows is quite dramatic. The Berger 50 gr match do kill foxes fine, I find no wound difference between their vermin and match bullets, it just depends if the bullet hits a solid bone and breaks apart.
Without Todd Kindler beating the drum then I think the chances of Sierra or Hornady making something in teh 50-55 gr weight is nil especially as berger have dropped the 50gr themselves.
A
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