Hornady varmint bullet comparison

[Mike402]

Greetings,

So I'm a prairie dog shooting junkie, look forward to my Wyoming trips every year. Like probably most of you, I enjoy the carnage and watching the gymnastics when they are hit. I tend to stick to 6mms over the scorching fast 22s, solely based on barrel life. I also enjoy strapping two rifles to a cart and walk to fields that are unreachable by car, which I find gives me many more targets than if I were to just set up a bench in the usual spots. I shoot off of a RRS tripod when doing that.
My current favorite combo is the 6 Creedmoor w/ the 58 VMAX. Here are couple 'doubles' using that load:

6 Creed 58 Double 1

6 Creed 58 Double 2

I decided to do a quick video comparing all the rifles in my inventory to test for terminal effects, using the same exact target and distance (50 yards) to see the difference. I used grape juice bottles that are the same approximate size as the average PD. I use all Hornady varmint bullets, so unfortunately no comparison against different makes. I recently added the 80gr ELD VT out of a 6 Creedmoor 8 Twist to my line up for longer distance shots & wind bucking (300-500). I normally won't go much past 500. I really wanted to see how effective they were compared to the lighter traditional bullets. Thought you guys might be interested to see a visual comparison.

Here's the video: (sorry about the funky audio - it was super windy and I slowed the frame rate down to better see the effects). Also I won't subject you to any commentary, I can't stand that about most videos hearing someone blabber on forever.

Hornady Varmint Bullet Shootout

Just some observations: I was shocked by the results of the 80 ELD VT. As you can see, it was the only bullet that lifted the bottles and kicked them back towards me about 15 feet each time. Very Very impressive! I haven't yet shot a dog with this load, but looking forward to it. I was also impressed with the 110gr SP out of my 30/06. It literally vaporized the bottles unlike the other loads. I use this a walkaround hunting round for jackrabbits.

Love to hear any thoughts or feedback...

 

[urbanrifleman]

Greetings,

So I'm a prairie dog shooting junkie, look forward to my Wyoming trips every year. Like probably most of you, I enjoy the carnage and watching the gymnastics when they are hit. I tend to stick to 6mms over the scorching fast 22s, solely based on barrel life. I also enjoy strapping two rifles to a cart and walk to fields that are unreachable by car, which I find gives me many more targets than if I were to just set up a bench in the usual spots. I shoot off of a RRS tripod when doing that.
My current favorite combo is the 6 Creedmoor w/ the 58 VMAX. Here are couple 'doubles' using that load:

6 Creed 58 Double 1

6 Creed 58 Double 2

I decided to do a quick video comparing all the rifles in my inventory to test for terminal effects, using the same exact target and distance (50 yards) to see the difference. I used grape juice bottles that are the same approximate size as the average PD. I use all Hornady varmint bullets, so unfortunately no comparison against different makes. I recently added the 80gr ELD VT out of a 6 Creedmoor 8 Twist to my line up for longer distance shots & wind bucking (300-500). I normally won't go much past 500. I really wanted to see how effective they were compared to the lighter traditional bullets. Thought you guys might be interested to see a visual comparison.

Here's the video: (sorry about the funky audio - it was super windy and I slowed the frame rate down to better see the effects). Also I won't subject you to any commentary, I can't stand that about most videos hearing someone blabber on forever.

Hornady Varmint Bullet Shootout

Just some observations: I was shocked by the results of the 80 ELD VT. As you can see, it was the only bullet that lifted the bottles and kicked them back towards me about 15 feet each time. Very Very impressive! I haven't yet shot a dog with this load, but looking forward to it. I was also impressed with the 110gr SP out of my 30/06. It literally vaporized the bottles unlike the other loads. I use this a walkaround hunting round for jackrabbits.

Love to hear any thoughts or feedback...

Oh snap.

That made my day. I need some of those 80 eldvt. Dang it.

 

[urbanrifleman]

Ohnoooo they is stupid expensive.

Well dang it.

 

[357Mag]

Greetings,

So I'm a prairie dog shooting junkie, look forward to my Wyoming trips every year. Like probably most of you, I enjoy the carnage and watching the gymnastics when they are hit. I tend to stick to 6mms over the scorching fast 22s, solely based on barrel life. I also enjoy strapping two rifles to a cart and walk to fields that are unreachable by car, which I find gives me many more targets than if I were to just set up a bench in the usual spots. I shoot off of a RRS tripod when doing that.
My current favorite combo is the 6 Creedmoor w/ the 58 VMAX. Here are couple 'doubles' using that load:

6 Creed 58 Double 1

6 Creed 58 Double 2

I decided to do a quick video comparing all the rifles in my inventory to test for terminal effects, using the same exact target and distance (50 yards) to see the difference. I used grape juice bottles that are the same approximate size as the average PD. I use all Hornady varmint bullets, so unfortunately no comparison against different makes. I recently added the 80gr ELD VT out of a 6 Creedmoor 8 Twist to my line up for longer distance shots & wind bucking (300-500). I normally won't go much past 500. I really wanted to see how effective they were compared to the lighter traditional bullets. Thought you guys might be interested to see a visual comparison.

Here's the video: (sorry about the funky audio - it was super windy and I slowed the frame rate down to better see the effects). Also I won't subject you to any commentary, I can't stand that about most videos hearing someone blabber on forever.

Hornady Varmint Bullet Shootout

Just some observations: I was shocked by the results of the 80 ELD VT. As you can see, it was the only bullet that lifted the bottles and kicked them back towards me about 15 feet each time. Very Very impressive! I haven't yet shot a dog with this load, but looking forward to it. I was also impressed with the 110gr SP out of my 30/06. It literally vaporized the bottles unlike the other loads. I use this a walkaround hunting round for jackrabbits.

Love to hear any thoughts or feedback...

Mike -

Howdy !

Thanx for sharing video of those “ doubles “. I hadn’t previously thought about PD doubles being made by any other method than having both animals lined-up… and then terminated by the same bullet passing through both. Video 1 shows “co-lateral“ damage

When I first started out shooting groundhog w/ .22-250s, it didn’t take long before I found myself wanting to put a bit more deliverable KE on those varmints. This was back in 1975. I had only been reloading for a couple of years, and for a while thought about campaigning a 7mm Remington Magnum. But, about the lightest 7mm bullet back then was a 115HP.

I next considered shooting a “ wildcat “…. “ .30-378 Weatherby “. The lightest bullet that wasn’t the Horandy .30 cal plinker, was their 110HP. But….even back then, I knew the muzzle blast and even recoil would be factors in such a rifle’s shoot-ability.
*
After all these decades, it was interesting to read your comment on the 110gr .30 cal bullets you tried.

My varmint cartridge decision, was for me to go with a wildcat of my own design.
I necked-down .35Remington brass to .224” calibre.

* I also have seen my ( groundhog ) engagement distances to be preponderantly under 500yd. I have a large capacity 6mm wildcat ( my own design ) also available, should I need to press a shot out to 1,000+ . My 6mm bullet of choice would be Sierra’s
95 T-MK, but my supply is running low. I only got to try Hornady’s 6mm 87 “V”- Max on a couple of groundhogs, thus far. Those shots taken @ 100 and 200yd showed major damage having been done to the carcasses. The 100yd kill shot went completely through the animal, entering through a rear lower groin area…and then exiting out the front shoulder. On the 200yd shot, the resulting damage was not enough to immediately anchor the varmint;8 and required a follow-up shot.

On groundhogs, I at all times expect & look for a 1-shot clean kill; with no drama. This also means no crawlers. I am returning to use of the .22-35, for my 600yd and under anti-groundhog work. Hornady’s exemplary .224” cal 55SX is my bullet of choice.

Please keep us posted on your ongoing results!


With regards,
357Mag

 

[Mike402]

Ohnoooo they is stupid expensive.

Well dang it.

Yea they are roughly .38 a piece vs like .30 for the 87gr VMAX. They are a more technologically advanced and higher performing bullet though, so I don't think they are too far out of line. Besides when I take into account the gas, hotels, meals, and hunting/lodge fees for my pd trips, cost of bullets is way at the bottom of the list

 

[urbanrifleman]

Yea they are roughly .38 a piece vs like .30 for the 87gr VMAX. They are a more technologically advanced and higher performing bullet though, so I don't think they are too far out of line. Besides when I take into account the gas, hotels, meals, and hunting/lodge fees for my pd trips, cost of bullets is way at the bottom of the list

I popped on Midway USA and they were about the same price as Berger 80s. That seems pretty ambitious... I mean I might buy some just for grins, but I don't think my customers are going to buy that bullet to go shoot prairie dogs. Not for high volume shooting. It wasn't that long ago that a good varmint bullet could be had on Midway for $11 a hundred. Spending the 20 dollars for the 62 ELDVT was a stretch for a lot of my customers.

 

[Mike402]

Mike -

Howdy !

Thanx for sharing video of those “ doubles “. I hadn’t previously thought about PD doubles being made by any other method than having both animals lined-up… and then terminated by the same bullet passing through both. Video 1 shows “co-lateral“ damage

When I first started out shooting groundhog w/ .22-250s, it didn’t take long before I found myself wanting to put a bit more deliverable KE on those varmints. This was back in 1975. I had only been reloading for a couple of years, and for a while thought about campaigning a 7mm Remington Magnum. But, about the lightest 7mm bullet back then was a 115HP.

I next considered shooting a “ wildcat “…. “ .30-378 Weatherby “. The lightest bullet that wasn’t the Horandy .30 cal plinker, was their 110HP. But….even back then, I knew the muzzle blast and even recoil would be factors in such a rifle’s shoot-ability.
*
After all these decades, it was interesting to read your comment on the 110gr .30 cal bullets you tried.

My varmint cartridge decision, was for me to go with a wildcat of my own design.
I necked-down .35Remington brass to .224” calibre.

* I also have seen my ( groundhog ) engagement distances to be preponderantly under 500yd. I have a large capacity 6mm wildcat ( my own design ) also available, should I need to press a shot out to 1,000+ . My 6mm bullet of choice would be Sierra’s
95 T-MK, but my supply is running low. I only got to try Hornady’s 6mm 87 “V”- Max on a couple of groundhogs, thus far. Those shots taken @ 100 and 200yd showed major damage having been done to the carcasses. The 100yd kill shot went completely through the animal, entering through a rear lower groin area…and then exiting out the front shoulder. On the 200yd shot, the resulting damage was not enough to immediately anchor the varmint;8 and required a follow-up shot.

On groundhogs, I at all times expect & look for a 1-shot clean kill; with no drama. This also means no crawlers. I am returning to use of the .22-35, for my 600yd and under anti-groundhog work. Hornady’s exemplary .224” cal 55SX is my bullet of choice.

Please keep us posted on your ongoing results!


With regards,
357Mag

Thank you for the detailed feedback, I appreciate it! Some comments:

Yes I have at times seen terminal effects on dogs located next to the intended target. I sometimes wonder if the bullets are coming apart and there is a shrapnel effect going on. I've never used them on pd's, but the 'varmint grenade' bullets come to mind. I tested them, I just couldn't get any better than 1.25-1.5 moa out of them, and that's not good enough for me.

My buddy uses a 22-250, and between that and the Swift, all the kinetic energy and terminal ballistics you could want. Turns them inside out. My rationale for not going with the 22s was that given the high round count and hot shooting conditions of pd shooting, figured the bigger bore 6's would last longer. That being said, I do have a huge desire to do a 22 creed slow twist barrel and shoot the 40gr vmax's at 4k. I think that would be pretty epic.

I worked up a 110gr Soft Point load for my 30/06 as I wanted a lightweight walk around rifle for jackrabbits. All of my pd rifles are heavy bench-type guns. I actually just recently came up with the load, and aside from load workup, this is the first time I've fired it at a target. I imagine it won't be pretty for the first jack that crosses my path. I am getting 3,300 fps out of them with my 06, would be cool to see what a .30-378 Weatherby could do. Insanity - and I love it lol

I think the 87gr vmax are perfect for groundhogs and up. I do feel they are a tad too heavy for prairie dogs though. I've got an 8 twist 6 creed, and the 87 was the only vmax bullet that would survive at high velocities and that fast twist. It blew up 58s, 65s, and even the 75s at times. The 87s were underwhelming on prairie dogs though. They surely killed them, just not with all the fanfare & gymnastics of the lighter bullets. I jumped on the 80 ELD VTs when they came out, as they were supposed to offer the best of both worlds - extreme terminal AND ballistic performance. Based on this test, I can't wait to try them out on the dogs. Looks like they are going to work great. I just wish I had some left over 87s so I could have compared those as well in this test.

Would have been cool to shoot some of the 55sx bullets in this test as well to see how they perform.

 

[Mike402]

I popped on Midway USA and they were about the same price as Berger 80s. That seems pretty ambitious... I mean I might buy some just for grins, but I don't think my customers are going to buy that bullet to go shoot prairie dogs. Not for high volume shooting. It wasn't that long ago that a good varmint bullet could be had on Midway for $11 a hundred. Spending the 20 dollars for the 62 ELDVT was a stretch for a lot of my customers.

I totally get that. I'm in the same camp. I am only using them for longer range shots or very windy conditions where their performance over vmax's comes into play. I would never use them for high volume shooting, you're right, too pricey for that.

 

[bobinpa]

I just got back from shooting prairie dogs for 3 days in S. Dakota. What I can say with utmost certainty is that there is no rhyme or reason in the way bullets perform or the way dogs react to being hit.
I'll explain;
I took 4 guns in 4 different cartridges.
6 Creedmoor shooting 108 Gr ELD M at ~3060 fps
6 BR shooting 85 Gr Sierra #1530 at ~ 3050 fps
22 Creedmoor shooting 80 Gr ELD M at ~ 3435 fps
22-47 Lapua shooting 62 Gr ELD VT at ~ 3640 fps

The majority of the shooting was 350 yards or less with some occasionally further.
With any of these loads I would shoot a PD standing at any distance and send him 15 ft in the air into little pieces and just seconds later shoot another PD standing right next to the last one and it would just flip over.

Similar happened with all guns/loads. It didn't matter if it was 100 yards or 350 yards. PDs could be in the same position - standing, sitting... it didn't matter. One would literally explode and the next one just fall over. At 100 yards I could pretty much place my shots in the same area - head or chest etc. I actually tried to duplicate results but it wasn't happening.

I don't understand the results and I can't explain the results but that was my experience.

Regardless of the results, it was an absolute blast!!

 

[357Mag]

Thank you for the detailed feedback, I appreciate it! Some comments:

Yes I have at times seen terminal effects on dogs located next to the intended target. I sometimes wonder if the bullets are coming apart and there is a shrapnel effect going on. I've never used them on pd's, but the 'varmint grenade' bullets come to mind. I tested them, I just couldn't get any better than 1.25-1.5 moa out of them, and that's not good enough for me.

My buddy uses a 22-250, and between that and the Swift, all the kinetic energy and terminal ballistics you could want. Turns them inside out. My rationale for not going with the 22s was that given the high round count and hot shooting conditions of pd shooting, figured the bigger bore 6's would last longer. That being said, I do have a huge desire to do a 22 creed slow twist barrel and shoot the 40gr vmax's at 4k. I think that would be pretty epic.

I worked up a 110gr Soft Point load for my 30/06 as I wanted a lightweight walk around rifle for jackrabbits. All of my pd rifles are heavy bench-type guns. I actually just recently came up with the load, and aside from load workup, this is the first time I've fired it at a target. I imagine it won't be pretty for the first jack that crosses my path. I am getting 3,300 fps out of them with my 06, would be cool to see what a .30-378 Weatherby could do. Insanity - and I love it lol

I think the 87gr vmax are perfect for groundhogs and up. I do feel they are a tad too heavy for prairie dogs though. I've got an 8 twist 6 creed, and the 87 was the only vmax bullet that would survive at high velocities and that fast twist. It blew up 58s, 65s, and even the 75s at times. The 87s were underwhelming on prairie dogs though. They surely killed them, just not with all the fanfare & gymnastics of the lighter bullets. I jumped on the 80 ELD VTs when they came out, as they were supposed to offer the best of both worlds - extreme terminal AND ballistic performance. Based on this test, I can't wait to try them out on the dogs. Looks like they are going to work great. I just wish I had some left over 87s so I could have compared those as well in this test.

Would have been cool to shoot some of the 55sx bullets in this test as well to see how they perform.

Mike -

Howdy, again ! Nice to hear from you !

I want to talk about putting 4,000fps on a .224” calibre 55gr bullet, but first want to offer some background….

I had my first wildcat .22-35 chambered in a 24” SS Hart 5-groove 1-14.
At the time, I knew I would not be able to get 4,000fps, but really wasn’t wanting to
( at that time ). I biased obtainable accuracy ahead of useful accuracy; but had to have enough of BOTH ! Fred Sinclair set up the rifle w/ the 24” bbl specifically for my use of the 55SX. The FB bullet’s body filled 1/2 of the .22-35’s .250” lg neck, and it shot best w/ the secant ogive .002” off the lands. As it turned out, despite my testing w/ custom 52gr benchrest bullets and factory 52-52gr HPs…. the 55SX beat them all on accuracy !

As an aside: to get into the “ 500yd “ club on a groundhog kill, I wanted to maximize retained energy while still shooting a 55gr .224” cal varmint bullet. I called and talked to Steve Hornady, who told me they were just getting ready to bring out a new 55gr varmint bullet offering…the 55 “ V”-Max. Steve said testing and other factors had them ultimately settle on a shorter ogive than they had on the early 55 “V-Max prototypes…
and graciously sent me a ltd clutch of the longer ( V ) LDs. I subbed one for the 55SX
I normally shot, making no other load changes… not even distance off the lands.
I got @ 510 yd groundhog kill on my first attempt.

When the time came to re-barrel due to the original barrel starting to “ keyhole “ some shots, I again had a . 22-35 chamber cut; going w/ a 28” SS K&P 5-groove 1-8. I shot the 75 “ A”-Max in it exclusively, figuring I might get to try for a 1,000yd “ Soybeanus Digestus “ kill. A 13yr period of living / working in oOK put the1,000yd kill goal on the back burner.

When I started having troubles making out .224” cal holes on paper @ 300yd… when using a 2X-boosted T-36, I decided to change barrels ( again )… and progressed in calibre up to 6mm. I designed my own “ DEEP 6 “ wildcat, and had the chamber cut
in a 29” S S Broughton 1-8 5-groove. I wanted to set up DEEP 6 as bona fide 1,000yd capable dual role’ varmint/target rifle. It was to be my first foray into 6mm calibre, and
( I figured ) I’d use heavi-er VLDs… IF they would prove to work ok on groundhog.

Sinclair International was located 6mi from my house…. at the time I needed bullets for assembling the dummy rounds James Peightal would use when cutting the chamber.
The Broughton barrel arrived too late for use on 2002 groundhogs, and I found myself up @ Sinclair‘s 1 wk before Camp Perry looking for bullets. Without having realized it…
I went 6mm heavy VLD bullet shopping too late… Camp Perry competitors had cleaned them out ! *** Sinclair’s DID have some Sierra 95MK’s, and they got the nod. ***

Fast fwd 13yr, + a move back to NE Indiana… and I was able to get back to groundhog shooting. The 95MKs worked well, but I was even happier w/ the results I got ( accuracy & lethality-wise ) when I shifted to use of 95 T-MKs. But… my supply of them ran out last year, and I had to switch bullet choice again… which got me to try the 87”A”- Max for 2025 ( mentioned previously ).

Having said all that:
My groundhog shooting is predominantly under 500yd. I have decided in recognition of that fact, and having the DEEP 6 barrel readily at-hand for any 1,000yd work…I am going back to shooting the .22-35 again. THIS time, I am going to experiment w/ putting 4,000fps on the 55SX. They work just fine @ 3,700 fps, and I have a bullet rpm figure computed for the 55SX when shot from the ( 24” ) 1-14 @ that Mv.

4,000fps would be 600fps faster than Hornady’s recommended vel limit for the 55SX.
I have decided to go with a gain twist for this effort, and Bartlein should be cutting my
1.375” lg bull barrel, with the gain twist I want to use… very soon ! I am also going with a. l-o-n-g finished length, and that is part of my barrel’s order spec’s.

God willing…. the barrel will be cut, chambered, and integrated on my rifle; while still having enough time for load refinement… before it becomes time to shoot the 2026 groundhogs ! I have already established max charge of 6.5 StaBal that I can safely shoot in the .22-25, when using FED Large Magnum Rifle Match; under the 55SX.
I use Remington .35Remington brass. 6.5StaBal gives me a temp-stable ball powder replacement for the WW760 that I used to use in the .22-35….and it is just 2 powders slower in “ burn rate “ than WW760, which seems to have gone away.

I sent along a pic of the .22-35 w/ 55SX seated, shown along w/ a line up of a similarly proportioned and ogive-bulleted small calibre canon round.

Please look for a PM from me.


With regards,
357Mag

 

[sw282]

Thanks Mike for your bullet comparisons. Hornady makes great prairie dog bullets for us high volume pds shooters with their VMAX red tipped killers. My preference is the 40gr VMAX in my 222 and 223.
For ME, the most destructive bullet is Winchester's 45gr jhp. Sadly, it can only be had in Winchester White Box Ammo in 223@3600fps and 22-250@4000fps. These bullets will explode a prairie dog with almost any solid body hit. lf any of his buddies are close by the HIT will take them too. l don't shoot these 45jhp Winchester past 300yds. l need to see those dogs blow up!

 

[boltfluter]

Greetings,

So I'm a prairie dog shooting junkie, look forward to my Wyoming trips every year. Like probably most of you, I enjoy the carnage and watching the gymnastics when they are hit. I tend to stick to 6mms over the scorching fast 22s, solely based on barrel life. I also enjoy strapping two rifles to a cart and walk to fields that are unreachable by car, which I find gives me many more targets than if I were to just set up a bench in the usual spots. I shoot off of a RRS tripod when doing that.
My current favorite combo is the 6 Creedmoor w/ the 58 VMAX. Here are couple 'doubles' using that load:

6 Creed 58 Double 1

6 Creed 58 Double 2

I decided to do a quick video comparing all the rifles in my inventory to test for terminal effects, using the same exact target and distance (50 yards) to see the difference. I used grape juice bottles that are the same approximate size as the average PD. I use all Hornady varmint bullets, so unfortunately no comparison against different makes. I recently added the 80gr ELD VT out of a 6 Creedmoor 8 Twist to my line up for longer distance shots & wind bucking (300-500). I normally won't go much past 500. I really wanted to see how effective they were compared to the lighter traditional bullets. Thought you guys might be interested to see a visual comparison.

Here's the video: (sorry about the funky audio - it was super windy and I slowed the frame rate down to better see the effects). Also I won't subject you to any commentary, I can't stand that about most videos hearing someone blabber on forever.

Hornady Varmint Bullet Shootout

Just some observations: I was shocked by the results of the 80 ELD VT. As you can see, it was the only bullet that lifted the bottles and kicked them back towards me about 15 feet each time. Very Very impressive! I haven't yet shot a dog with this load, but looking forward to it. I was also impressed with the 110gr SP out of my 30/06. It literally vaporized the bottles unlike the other loads. I use this a walkaround hunting round for jackrabbits.

Love to hear any thoughts or feedback...

Those are some really great videos of flying dogs! Well done.
Paul

 

[Tommie]

I’ve found the 87 Vmax to be a great longer range bullet but it’s a bit “much” for prairie dogs. By that I mean a small target doesn’t seem to have enough mass for bullet fragmentation. Most of the 87 grains dump into the hillside behind the PD. The 58’s don’t carry as far but the impacts are spectacular.

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

Or run the 70gr TNT, decent BC, explosive terminal damage, long range accuracy. Speer has free shipping and a hat thru Labor Day on 99$ and over. 167$ for 750 tnt's.

 

[Mike402]

I just got back from shooting prairie dogs for 3 days in S. Dakota. What I can say with utmost certainty is that there is no rhyme or reason in the way bullets perform or the way dogs react to being hit.
I'll explain;
I took 4 guns in 4 different cartridges.
6 Creedmoor shooting 108 Gr ELD M at ~3060 fps
6 BR shooting 85 Gr Sierra #1530 at ~ 3050 fps
22 Creedmoor shooting 80 Gr ELD M at ~ 3435 fps
22-47 Lapua shooting 62 Gr ELD VT at ~ 3640 fps

The majority of the shooting was 350 yards or less with some occasionally further.
With any of these loads I would shoot a PD standing at any distance and send him 15 ft in the air into little pieces and just seconds later shoot another PD standing right next to the last one and it would just flip over.

Similar happened with all guns/loads. It didn't matter if it was 100 yards or 350 yards. PDs could be in the same position - standing, sitting... it didn't matter. One would literally explode and the next one just fall over. At 100 yards I could pretty much place my shots in the same area - head or chest etc. I actually tried to duplicate results but it wasn't happening.

I don't understand the results and I can't explain the results but that was my experience.

Regardless of the results, it was an absolute blast!!

I concur, it does seem random at times. However you definitely can spot trends with different cartridges. Case in point, my two walking guns are a 204 ruger & an AR shooting 40gr vmax's. This last trip in June, I shot roughly 200 204 rounds, and 150 223 rounds, all off of a tripod at less than 200 yards. I can definitively say that the 204 rounds overall caused more carnage and helicopters.

All of the cartridges you listed above are high octane rounds and I would expect about the same performance roughly.

And I definitely agree with you about being a blast! People just don't get it. Most people I try to tell what I'm doing think I'm an utter psycho for enjoying this type of thing lol

 

[Mike402]

Mike -

Howdy, again ! Nice to hear from you !

I want to talk about putting 4,000fps on a .224” calibre 55gr bullet, but first want to offer some background….

I had my first wildcat .22-35 chambered in a 24” SS Hart 5-groove 1-14.
At the time, I knew I would not be able to get 4,000fps, but really wasn’t wanting to
( at that time ). I biased obtainable accuracy ahead of useful accuracy; but had to have enough of BOTH ! Fred Sinclair set up the rifle w/ the 24” bbl specifically for my use of the 55SX. The FB bullet’s body filled 1/2 of the .22-35’s .250” lg neck, and it shot best w/ the secant ogive .002” off the lands. As it turned out, despite my testing w/ custom 52gr benchrest bullets and factory 52-52gr HPs…. the 55SX beat them all on accuracy !

As an aside: to get into the “ 500yd “ club on a groundhog kill, I wanted to maximize retained energy while still shooting a 55gr .224” cal varmint bullet. I called and talked to Steve Hornady, who told me they were just getting ready to bring out a new 55gr varmint bullet offering…the 55 “ V”-Max. Steve said testing and other factors had them ultimately settle on a shorter ogive than they had on the early 55 “V-Max prototypes…
and graciously sent me a ltd clutch of the longer ( V ) LDs. I subbed one for the 55SX
I normally shot, making no other load changes… not even distance off the lands.
I got @ 510 yd groundhog kill on my first attempt.

When the time came to re-barrel due to the original barrel starting to “ keyhole “ some shots, I again had a . 22-35 chamber cut; going w/ a 28” SS K&P 5-groove 1-8. I shot the 75 “ A”-Max in it exclusively, figuring I might get to try for a 1,000yd “ Soybeanus Digestus “ kill. A 13yr period of living / working in oOK put the1,000yd kill goal on the back burner.

When I started having troubles making out .224” cal holes on paper @ 300yd… when using a 2X-boosted T-36, I decided to change barrels ( again )… and progressed in calibre up to 6mm. I designed my own “ DEEP 6 “ wildcat, and had the chamber cut
in a 29” S S Broughton 1-8 5-groove. I wanted to set up DEEP 6 as bona fide 1,000yd capable dual role’ varmint/target rifle. It was to be my first foray into 6mm calibre, and
( I figured ) I’d use heavi-er VLDs… IF they would prove to work ok on groundhog.

Sinclair International was located 6mi from my house…. at the time I needed bullets for assembling the dummy rounds James Peightal would use when cutting the chamber.
The Broughton barrel arrived too late for use on 2002 groundhogs, and I found myself up @ Sinclair‘s 1 wk before Camp Perry looking for bullets. Without having realized it…
I went 6mm heavy VLD bullet shopping too late… Camp Perry competitors had cleaned them out ! *** Sinclair’s DID have some Sierra 95MK’s, and they got the nod. ***

Fast fwd 13yr, + a move back to NE Indiana… and I was able to get back to groundhog shooting. The 95MKs worked well, but I was even happier w/ the results I got ( accuracy & lethality-wise ) when I shifted to use of 95 T-MKs. But… my supply of them ran out last year, and I had to switch bullet choice again… which got me to try the 87”A”- Max for 2025 ( mentioned previously ).

Having said all that:
My groundhog shooting is predominantly under 500yd. I have decided in recognition of that fact, and having the DEEP 6 barrel readily at-hand for any 1,000yd work…I am going back to shooting the .22-35 again. THIS time, I am going to experiment w/ putting 4,000fps on the 55SX. They work just fine @ 3,700 fps, and I have a bullet rpm figure computed for the 55SX when shot from the ( 24” ) 1-14 @ that Mv.

4,000fps would be 600fps faster than Hornady’s recommended vel limit for the 55SX.
I have decided to go with a gain twist for this effort, and Bartlein should be cutting my
1.375” lg bull barrel, with the gain twist I want to use… very soon ! I am also going with a. l-o-n-g finished length, and that is part of my barrel’s order spec’s.

God willing…. the barrel will be cut, chambered, and integrated on my rifle; while still having enough time for load refinement… before it becomes time to shoot the 2026 groundhogs ! I have already established max charge of 6.5 StaBal that I can safely shoot in the .22-25, when using FED Large Magnum Rifle Match; under the 55SX.
I use Remington .35Remington brass. 6.5StaBal gives me a temp-stable ball powder replacement for the WW760 that I used to use in the .22-35….and it is just 2 powders slower in “ burn rate “ than WW760, which seems to have gone away.

I sent along a pic of the .22-35 w/ 55SX seated, shown along w/ a line up of a similarly proportioned and ogive-bulleted small calibre canon round.

Please look for a PM from me.


With regards,
357Mag

You sir are on a whole other level. Impressive & Interesting read about your experiences and findings. Did you happen to ever capture any footage of your escapades? Would love to see what those 55sx bullets actually do in the real world!

 

[Mike402]

Thanks Mike for your bullet comparisons. Hornady makes great prairie dog bullets for us high volume pds shooters with their VMAX red tipped killers. My preference is the 40gr VMAX in my 222 and 223.
For ME, the most destructive bullet is Winchester's 45gr jhp. Sadly, it can only be had in Winchester White Box Ammo in 223@3600fps and 22-250@4000fps. These bullets will explode a prairie dog with almost any solid body hit. lf any of his buddies are close by the HIT will take them too. l don't shoot these 45jhp Winchester past 300yds. l need to see those dogs blow up!

interesting...first I've head about Win 45jhp. Probably because I reload everything and haven't bought factory ammo in forever. Wish they were available to us reloaders to try out...

 

[Mike402]

I’ve found the 87 Vmax to be a great longer range bullet but it’s a bit “much” for prairie dogs. By that I mean a small target doesn’t seem to have enough mass for bullet fragmentation. Most of the 87 grains dump into the hillside behind the PD. The 58’s don’t carry as far but the impacts are spectacular.

EXACTLY my experience as well! They work great on coyotes though...

 

[kyotekiller25]

My favorite was always the 110g vmax at 4100fps from a 300 RUM. Talk about vaporize things, nothing but a pink mist haha!!

 

[Mike402]

My favorite was always the 110g vmax at 4100fps from a 300 RUM. Talk about vaporize things, nothing but a pink mist haha!!

Utter insanity lmao