Generators & Battery back up

[DirtySteve]

Ok. It was cold and I was wearing my crocs but it took couple pictures. Notice the broom conveniently stuck in the end of the pipe for cleaning them off. oh one more thing I have my panels tilted a little steeper to make better juice in the wintertime. In the summer it is daylight till 10PM. And the sun is up at 5AM.

 

[JFrank]

Sweet !!!

 

[FNSafari]

Ok. It was cold and I was wearing my crocs but it took couple pictures. Notice the broom conveniently stuck in the end of the pipe for cleaning them off. oh one more thing I have my panels tilted a little steeper to make better juice in the wintertime. In the summer it is daylight till 10PM. And the sun is up at 5AM.

I'm confused. If you are in Montana the sun is low in the winter so why do you have them tilted up? By up do you mean the bottom of the panels tilted toward the ground or the other way around?

 

[DirtySteve]

Yes the sun travels low on the southern horizon so I chose to put my panels at a steeper angle than what was suggested by the company I got them from. For instance a 45 degree angle compared to a 35... To catch the sun better in winter. I mean only about 7 hour of dark in the summer.. We make electricity all day. Should be the same in Maine..

 

[sacre]

Look into a used motor home unit. I have a 10k onan, 1800 rpm set. It is thirsty at full load. It can be set for propane but I haven't.

I've been considering getting a 3pt set up for my John Deere. It is very fuel efficient, diesel.

 

[ELR LVR]

Was thinking...
And were off!...
Last year i took my generator apart for maintenance. The float bowl froze and developed a drip and would not run correctly
I dont mess with carburetors any more.
If i have any questions about a carb i order a new one off Amazon for 20$ and toss the one in question.
Thats simple
Typical for me
New carb, spark plug, filters, oil, clean gas tank out scrub down with kerosene and blow gun, new high test fuel fill up
Now my Jenny is running sweet
I thought of building a little rustic shed next to my power pole so when the power goes out i can go outside the switch it over to generator power.
My wife came outside and said to me your using your generator the wrong way ..i said Woman! what do you know...its a scientific fact men have larger brains.
(My wife is a scientist) hahaha..
But she said stop letting the generator run all day
You need a battery bank feed off the battery bank and the generator kicks on to recharge your batteries..
I give up..where does she get off
What an absolutely brilliant idea.
And that is why i love her.
Needless to say i was standing there like an idiot with no snappy come back.

Does any one have a set up like this.
Can you post some photos of your masterpiece.
So if i have a typical mid size generac generator
Can this be done..how long does it take to charge a batter bank for a cabin, small house.
Hell how large of a battery bank do you need if i can charge it up and not listen to that rattle trap clank-n away all day durring summer winter storms power outages that can last up to 2-6 days maybe more..but ive never needed more then my generator it has plenty of power to run my little place in the forest.
This is a very very broad subject so i kind of sketch out where im at
Would love to hear some thoughts.
Im kind of a hermit now so you guys are my go to for goofy questions, and how
So ttis may be another project added to the summer list of things to do.
Im not into the solar thing yet..im not ready to go there so this is my pit stop solution
And i believe my dear wife may be correct.
Stop running that generator so hard and buy some batteries .
My wifle is brilliant, she has idea after idea on what to do..but never tells me how to do it..i guess that my part.

As far as battery banks, get LIFEPO, or at least Lithium Ion
with a flooded lead acid battery, FLA it is not a Linear equation as to how discharged your battery is such as
Such as --- 6 volts is not 50% dischrged
It is more like, 11.7 to 12.0 Volts, is actually 50% discharged
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With a LIFEPO 12.6 is 50% charged and 13.6 is 100%
So at 50% discharge the LIFEPO voltage stays higher.
So whats nice about that is the 12 plus Voltage you want, holds for a longer time period
Also you can discharge LIFEPO much deeper such as 12.2 V or 10% charge without hurting them
So in short
A Lead Acid will ACT as if it is dead in half the time of a LIFEPO, where you can still be running an inverter or whatever with a LIFEPO way down in the 10% charge rate, The FLA Marine battery gave up long ago
LIFEPO also charges much quicker
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As far as battery bank size,
I recommend using a Watt Hours Chart and then get 10X the amoung recommended
I know my 150AH battery bank goes down much quicker than what is theortical time wise
I can run my TV for about 5 hours on 150 AH watching DVD's or whatever before the low voltage alarm sounds
That is ionly roughly a 4 amp total draw
Theoretically I should be able to go 37 hours
150 AH / 4 Amps = 37
So there are many factors that contribute to time loss in battery banks,
I use 6 feet of 2/0 copper welding cable going from battery to the inverter as well to minimize voltage loss
So I dont know what is going on there with my real world available usage time compared to theoretical
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Ebay has good deals on these types of batteries
150 AH for $200 or less
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Use a LIFEPO specific charger controller since each cell is 3.7 v and works differenty than multiple 1.2 volt cell banks as far as charging (Victron, nuff said)
But since LIFEPO can handle a decent amount of charge rate -
---Such as 100 AMPS you may get a charger to suit however fast you wish to charge them
Although charging them slower in the 50 Amp range will likely allow you to get more charging cycles
I think its around 3000 cycles but cant remember for certain off the top of nmy head so just look it up
All the info is easy to find

 

[Tangent]

I'm seeing everyone referring to gasoline generators. Do you have diesel generators in the US? Any reason you don't use them? I'm not a generator expert hence the question!

 

[bobcat93]

Is any one running a big old generator like the one i post pic up above?
Are those worth restoring just to do what im talking about.
If i restored one of those old power plants, and built a nice shed for it to live life in ..i bet it would outlast my grand children.
Hell any generator built today will give ya about 5yrs of service and die..just like the new 2025 automobile..engineered to last 5-7yrs and completely fall apart

---

 

[JTEX]

I'm seeing everyone referring to gasoline generators. Do you have diesel generators in the US? Any reason you don't use them? I'm not a generator expert hence the question!

I have a 16kw Kubota diesel on my house. Its a manual setup, but I have run for several days at a time during hurricanes. It uses about a half a gallon per hour....

 

[D Coots]

I'm seeing everyone referring to gasoline generators. Do you have diesel generators in the US? Any reason you don't use them? I'm not a generator expert hence the question!

Diesel fuel has a problem sometimes growing algae in the tank possibly is a reason. Flat tanks with large surface areas seemed to be the worst.

Gas long term is a PIA

Mine is hooked to my 1,000 gallon lp tank. No issues. If I couldn't have lp, my next choice would be diesel.

 

[Tangent]

Diesel fuel has a problem sometimes growing algae in the tank possibly is a reason.

Gas long term is a PIA

Mine is hooked to my 1,000 gallon lp tank. No issues. If I couldn't have lp, my next choice would be diesel.

Yes I did read that you get about 6 months life. I think it's hygroscopic too? I'd never thought of LP, seems like a good option. I like the idea of renewables, from the perspective of self sufficiency, but we need a big leap in battery technology.

 

[D Coots]

Iowa sucks, don't come here. Lp...$1.71 State flat tax 3.8% and going down.....

Can't talk politics here...so I forget which party is responsible....

Later
Dave

 

[Tangent]

@SmittyJon Interesting information on the economics of it, we pay about £1.45 per litre diesel (x3.79 to a US gallon) petrol is a few pence per litre cheaper. LP is a no brainer at those prices.

I forget the extremes of temperatures you can get. 23°F (-5°C) would be a very cold day here and not that common. Thankfully we have the Gulf Stream or we'd have Canadian winters!

 

[jackieschmidt]

I looked recently and I may be wrong but a 28kw may have a 4cyl powering it and they love gasoline. A little better output running on propane but they like that too! When I built my house 20yrs ago, natural gas wasn't available and still isn't. Some reason I didn't want propane either, now I'd take whichever. I say that cause with all electric in the house, if we really had to power heat pumps, water heater and everything else. To meet those needs we're at a 30kw I think. Now, we can go much smaller with a pick and choose panel and lesson the cost by half at least. Now with winter, since 2009 I've heated with a outdoor boiler. A little work but takes alot less electricity to operate if needed. If we had long summer outage, we're currently screwed!

Our big Liquid cold Generac (natural gas), has a little in line 4 cylinder that I think is manufactured by one of the Japanese car companies, maybe Isuzu.
So far, we have had two long blackouts, that big freeze 2 1/2 years ago, and that most recent hurricane. It came on as it should and did it’s job.

One thing about the liquid cooled Generac units. They are really quiet. You can barley here it in the house, outside it’s just a big hum.

 

[bluealtered]

In some of the mountains in the west here in the U.S.A. , you are off the grid no matter what you do. When I was younger I took care of a small ranch that was five miles from the nearest power. Everything was either firewood,(heat) or propane for everything else, we had a 250 gal. propane tank that worked well for lights, water heater, and refrigerator.
The only problem that would pop up was a loose propane fitting, which was checked every month, or needing to change a wick in the lamps now and then.

 

[M-61]

I'm seeing everyone referring to gasoline generators. Do you have diesel generators in the US? Any reason you don't use them? I'm not a generator expert hence the question!

Sure there are diesel generators.
However diesel grows algae and it gels at 15°F (-9°C). Therefore you need anti gel and anti algae. As long as you keep up with it you’re fine. If not the gel factor well the viscosity is about like vasoline which the injection pump won’t pump. The algae speaks for itself.
Propane or natural gas are the sensible fuels.

 

[rockhound78]

NG around here is right at the $40 level per MMCF. Propane around $1.80 during the Summer and twice that in the Winter. I put anti-gel/anti algae in each barrel of diesel I get for my tractor. Fine, even 3 years later.
Propane--91K btu per gallon, gasoline---122K btu per gallon, diesel---137K btu per gallon. Question is, is the diesel engine more efficient due to better fuel burn?

 

[sacre]

I have a 375 gallon diesel tank for tractor and excavator. I treat the tank at each fill and have never had a problem. Sometimes that is yearly or longer. Sometimes 6 months if I'm using the excavator a lot clearing brush.

 

[muddy72]

Our big Liquid cold Generac (natural gas), has a little in line 4 cylinder that I think is manufactured by one of the Japanese car companies, maybe Isuzu.
So far, we have had two long blackouts, that big freeze 2 1/2 years ago, and that most recent hurricane. It came on as it should and did it’s job.

One thing about the liquid cooled Generac units. They are really quiet. You can barley here it in the house, outside it’s just a big hum.

Yup! I'll opt for liquid cooled power for anything when it's available.

 

[jdh47]

East Texas storms can bring tree related power outages occasionally. We put in a Briggs 26KW LPG generator last year and it works well. It is monitored and remotely started and tested for function weekly. It's price was competitive with other units and cheaper than some. We got bids from Generac, Kohler, Cummins (I think) and some others.