PAC NOR featherweight model 70 fliers

[Markg308]

You clearly made some headway by tweaking the bedding as the big fliers are gone. If your not shooting over some type of wind flag, it's pretty tough to know whether the horizontal is real or not.

The horizontal with the Berger stuff is actually good to see....shows that the barrel will tune. The Berger stuff just needs more or less powder to get the vertical out. It also shows that the barrel responds to a good bullet.

As Adam in Wi suggested, giving it some more firing pin springs is advisable on the 'new' Model 70's. Poor primer performance from weak hits can certainly show up on target....sometimes. And sometimes not. But for a couple of bucks, it's cheap insurance.

Factory ammo is always a tough road, especially with a light barreled gun like yours. Honestly, if you don't want to get into hand loading to tune the gun, I'd suggest testing the Hornady 168 stuff some more and if it repeats that performance, buy a bunch and enjoy it.

All in all, 1/2" Model 70 FW is pretty nice! -Al

I really enjoy handloading I feel like this rifle will shoot good once ammo has been tuned to it like you said when I saw the horizontal spread tightened up and went to vertical with the switch to Berger’s it gave me some hope. I was just tying to put a couple hundred rounds down the tube before starting on load development. The es and sd on the Berger wasn’t very good either. Do you think that could be firing pin spring? I had an sd of about 10 out of the hundred hand loads I put thru this gun

 

[Nealm66]

Man, that’s not very good but it could just be the brass not fire formed to your chamber and if it needs to grow a lot, you’ll see that. I’d try some hand loads before I started tearing the bolt apart. Everyone has different successful processes but the quickest for me is to pick a good powder and somewhere near the speed I want or suspect the charge will make and then find my longest desired coal. Then, I load 4 at 5k difference ladder shortening each string. I’ll shoot 2 and if they’re tight or I think I pulled then I’ll shoot 3. If it’s one hole then I shoot the 4th. I like to shoot at 200 so I can see the spread better. I will tune the powder and depth a little more at 5 or 600 yards if/when conditions allow. Extremely nice looking rifle by the way.

 

[AlNyhus]

Hard to say on the ES/SD stuff....small potatoes in a hunting rifle as ES/SD numbers aren't what puts small(er) groups on target. It's bullets that the barrel likes and fits with your free bore, excellent brass (think Lapua), the ability to change neck tension (think Redding Type S full length bushing die), a decent primer like Fed 210's and powder(s) it likes.

What bullet weight range do you want to use for hunting? -Al

 

[Markg308]

Hard to say on the ES/SD stuff....small potatoes in a hunting rifle as ES/SD numbers aren't what puts small(er) groups on target. It's bullets that the barrel likes and fits with your free bore, excellent brass (think Lapua), the ability to change neck tension (think Redding Type S full length bushing die), a decent primer like Fed 210's and powder(s) it likes.

What bullet weight range do you want to use for hunting? -Al

I put this rifle together specifically for 168 Berger classic hunters. It is a 1-11 1/4” twist 5 5 groove barrel with a bisley match reamer. Factory 168 fgmm is about .025” off the rifling at 2.8 coal. The mag box is 2.840 and the Berger 168’s touch around 2.835. I was thinking starting with minimum powder charge and testing seating depths .015” .030” .045” and .060” off rifling then fine tune and do ocw on powder

 

[Markg308]

Well made it to the range today and shot a course seating test. Guess I’m gonna load up an ocw at about .030” off (group number 4) unless anybody has any suggestions. These are all 5 shot groups

 

[Adam in WI]

I'd be curious to see what #6 looks like with a little tweaking.*




*Not an expert opinion, but it seems like that group has most consistent vertical dispersion*

 

[Dub]

While I admire what you are trying to do, this is a hunting rifle and not meant to stand up to repeated testing. not sure these tests on a pencil barrel are truly telling the truth. Establish a load to hunt with and call it good

 

[Nealm66]

How is the recoil?

 

[Markg308]

How is the recoil?

Not bad at all with the paachmayar pad

 

[Nealm66]

Huh, well if I’m being honest, I don’t think those are very good groups even for a lightweight rifle. I know one of those lightweight tikka’s will definitely shoot tight groups so that’s what I’m comparing too. Maybe it’s possible to tune but it looks like something else. It looks like it’s trying to but then something happens. Either something in the gun setup is moving, or shooter. Here’s a typical tune @200with a 300prc with 245 bergers. Clockwise 2-3 shot groups and then adjusting zero stop into bullseye center. Yours looks like it’s cloverleaf then something changes

 

[Nealm66]

I think if it were me, id try a different rest setup to start at this point. Maybe see how it shoots cold bore out to my furthest ethical hunting distance. If it’s money than who cares how it groups.

 

[Intheshop]

Excuse the following novel;

I'd mentioned a few days ago about a M77 Ultralight 308 that went "under the knife" here to cure 8" 100yd patterns.

The stock has a lot of figure,y'all know how Rugers are,some stocks are stunning. Anyway the rifle was bone stock and only in the last year(or so?) did it go from acceptable hunting accuracy to shotgun patterns.

A quick trip across the BP with some dedicated tooling/fixtures saw the whole free float thing turn out peachy. The "bedding"(factory,no epoxy) appears flat,square,and OK. I wanted to see what effect just clearance'ing the forend would do before making any decisions on further remediation.

Had some pretty std cast 175's loaded up that needed to be emptied. Nothing fancy here,2000-2100 fps with OAL that is short enough to work in about anything. Load/rig came out swinging. Round 1" groups @100.

But..... and here's the point.

If I don't hold my mouth exactly right shooting from a pretty decent bag setup.... I'm saying even a "blink",and you'll see it on target. There was no load development. I've subsequently gone to 150's but that ain't the point. On UL,and honestly any small'ish rigs.... shooter input whilst on the bags is accountable for a LOT of problems.

To the OP. Try a lighter bullet,I'm sayin recoil (bedding?) is causing your rigs problem/s. God luck with your project.

 

[Markg308]

Huh, well if I’m being honest, I don’t think those are very good groups even for a lightweight rifle. I know one of those lightweight tikka’s will definitely shoot tight groups so that’s what I’m comparing too. Maybe it’s possible to tune but it looks like something else. It looks like it’s trying to but then something happens. Either something in the gun setup is moving, or shooter. Here’s a typical tune @200with a 300prc with 245 bergers. Clockwise 2-3 shot groups and then adjusting zero stop into bullseye center. Yours looks like it’s cloverleaf then something changes

Yep my thoughts too. I’m not saying it’s not me but I have shot and loaded for lots of light weight hunting rifles and usually been able to get them to shoot better. I have a factory model 7 stainless 308 in a hs precision stock I was able to get it to shoot around 3/4 moa for 5 shots with same components as long as I let it cool between shots. I even stretched that rifle out to 900 yards on man sized steel sillohetts. I’m fixing to shoot an ocw today and I’ll post targets.

 

[Markg308]

I think if it were me, id try a different rest setup to start at this point. Maybe see how it shoots cold bore out to my furthest ethical hunting distance. If it’s money than who cares how it groups.

I was shooting in a Caldwell rock rest and rear bag and couldn’t get it to stop popping up so I switched to a cross tac front and rear bag and I can now get it to recoil straight back consistently the same way now

 

[Markg308]

Well there’s the powder test.. maybe between 8-9 and play with seating depth more? All 3 shot groups

 

[hogpatrol]

May have missed it but is that barrel a before or after the fire?

 

[choprzrul]

If it were mine, I'd load 5 at 44.1gr and retest.

I really like using my chamber chiller when doing load development....to me it really seems to help have consistent barrel temps and speeds things up. https://smile.amazon.com/Chamber-Ch...9862638&sprefix=chamber+chille,aps,166&sr=8-1

 

[Markg308]

May have missed it but is that barrel a before or after the fire?

After

 

[Markg308]

Had a cz527 rebarreled in 6.5 grendel by then post fire and it was a hammer. Can’t say the same for this one

 

[Markg308]

Had a cz527 rebarreled in 6.5 grendel by then post fire and it was a hammer. Can’t say the same for this one

I’m sorry I meant before the fire