Berger vs Hornady bullets

[spudgun]

I loaded up some 6mm CM for the 1000 yd range. I had some Berger 105 Hybred Targets and loaded up 10 of them just to compare to the Hornady 105 Match.

BC of the Berger is .536 G1
BC of the Hornady .530 G1

Now here is what I found very interesting.

Average FPS for the Hornady has been 1320's for a 5 shot group. The FPS avg has been constant through out the year at the 1000 yd target.

When I shot the first Berger it was 3 MOA over the bullseye. Dialed down 3 MOA and took 7 more shots. The avg FPS at the target was 1490 FPS.

Just for kicks I shot one more hornady at this target and it recorded 1341 FPS and 3 MOA below the bullseye.

The loads were identical except for just the bullet.

Is this possible???

 

[Mauser06]

Absolutely. BC on the box is a starting point.


When I started trimming and pointing I needed right around 3 moa less on the turret and it was evident which loads shot better. I also had to adjust my data and the BC now matches pretty close to what the box claims...haven't ran pass 1014yds yet but I can plug in the yardage and dial what the Kestrel tells me and nail the shot out to that far anyways.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Yep but don’t dig into it too deep. Accuracy is what matters. Berger bullets will always outshoot Hornady when they are tuned properly

 

[karrarararararar]

Yes, if you're shooting at 1K you should be looking at the G7 BCs, not G1.

The Berger has a G7 of .275 while the Hornady is only .246

 

[spudgun]

Yep but don’t dig into it too deep. Accuracy is what matters. Berger bullets will always outshoot Hornady when they are tuned properly

That is what I was told last year. I bought 500 Bergers (bulk) and I tried ladder testing to try to get them shoot. After 200 rounds I gave up on my testing and went back to Hornady match.

Below is what I am getting with the Hornady Match.

 

[INTJ]

Yep but don’t dig into it too deep. Accuracy is what matters. Berger bullets will always outshoot Hornady when they are tuned properly

Not always.......

 

[whatsupdoc]

What is the muzzle velocity for each load?
My 6mm Creed at 1000 yards is 7.3 Mils for 105 BTHP and 7.0 Mils for Berger 105 Hybrid Targets
MV is around 3060. So for me its a little over 1 MOA difference.

 

[spudgun]

What is the muzzle velocity for each load?
My 6mm Creed at 1000 yards is 7.3 Mils for 105 BTHP and 7.0 Mils for Berger 105 Hybrid Targets
MV is around 3060. So for me its a little over 1 MOA difference.

You can see the FPS on the right side of the target for each round. That is FPS at 1000 yd.

My muzzle FPS is 2980 ish

 

[Jason Boersma]

Bc yes but also bearing surface, the Berger will have less bearing surface. Both will make the loads different at 1000yds

 

[whatsupdoc]

You can see the FPS on the right side of the target for each round. That is FPS at 1000 yd.

My muzzle FPS is 2980 ish

Are both bullets starting at the same muzzle velocity?

 

[spudgun]

Are both bullets starting at the same muzzle velocity?

Within 20-30 FPS at the muzzle. Bergers were slower than the Honady.

That is why I was puzzled at the big differance in FPS at 1k.

 

[6MMsteve]

Bc yes but also bearing surface, the Berger will have less bearing surface. Both will make the loads different at 1000yds

yep and the hornies will have mo pressure found that out the hard way

 

[whatsupdoc]

Its possible there is a little exaggeration on the BC numbers on the Hornady bullets or
that particular LOT anyway.

 

[Bill Norris]

yep and the hornies will have mo pressure found that out the hard way

Exactly. Bearing surface has alot to do with pressure due to more drag on the longer bullet.

 

[rijndael]

Do they have the same 100Y zero too?

 

[mac86951]

Its possible there is a little exaggeration on the BC numbers on the Hornady bullets or
that particular LOT anyway.

There typically is "exaggeration"

I like the manufacturers that give data for the FPS range for BC, as well as how it's acquired.

IME Hornady is listing valid BC for peak velocity of a cartridge that would shoot that bullet. Example:. Hornady 75gr BTHP match .223 bullet. Listed BC is .395. (maybe from a 22-250). Put it in a 223 and it does not have ballistics that beat, Sierra, Nosler, Berger, Barnes, or other well-known manufacturers.

Answer, Hornady calculates BC from drop data at 200y; hardly a long-range average such as what others do.

I do read that Hornady is using Doppler now for ELD and ELD-X

 

[Bill K]

Even though many slam Hornady bullets, they shoot great, with the right work up, often better than many of the so called custom bullets. Nothing wrong with Berger bullets either, some shoot just fine, it just depends on the rifle and the load. But then again that can be applied to other brands also.

 

[CA_Shooter]

I loaded up some 6mm CM for the 1000 yd range. I had some Berger 105 Hybred Targets and loaded up 10 of them just to compare to the Hornady 105 Match.

BC of the Berger is .536 G1
BC of the Hornady .530 G1

Now here is what I found very interesting.

Average FPS for the Hornady has been 1320's for a 5 shot group. The FPS avg has been constant through out the year at the 1000 yd target.

When I shot the first Berger it was 3 MOA over the bullseye. Dialed down 3 MOA and took 7 more shots. The avg FPS at the target was 1490 FPS.

Just for kicks I shot one more hornady at this target and it recorded 1341 FPS and 3 MOA below the bullseye.

The loads were identical except for just the bullet.

Is this possible???

Have you also tried the Hornady 108 ELD? If so, how were results

 

[Fast14riot]

Even though many slam Hornady bullets, they shoot great, with the right work up, often better than many of the so called custom bullets. Nothing wrong with Berger bullets either, some shoot just fine, it just depends on the rifle and the load. But then again that can be applied to other brands also.

I've found that many of the Hornady standard BTHP bullets can shoot surprisingly well. They're not as consistent as Berger straight out of the box, but hardly a bad bullet. The ELD line I've not had the same luck.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

That is what I was told last year. I bought 500 Bergers (bulk) and I tried ladder testing to try to get them shoot. After 200 rounds I gave up on my testing and went back to Hornady match.

Below is what I am getting with the Hornady Match.

Gotta know how to tune Berger. Guarantee with the right powder, primer, seating depth, tension combo Berger would shoot better and definitely agg better if you plan to use it in competition.

Once you get a feel for tuning Berger bullets it becomes pretty easy. Lots of info out there on getting Berger bullets to shoot very well.

As you can see, the 6.67” group you provided is ALL vertical which is not good. Doesn’t look to be in tune, but the vertical is most likely due to the inconsistency of Hornady bullets. If you care to share the exact details of components and methods used when ladder testing Berger bullets then I’m sure some of us could help steer you in the right direction and dial you in for much better accuracy than you are currently getting with the Hornady match bullets. Of course if you’re happy with settling for the accuracy Hornady is giving you then that’s perfectly fine as well. Hope you enjoy your rifle