California Fires

[Uthink Uknow]

Well, I think Newsom has it backwards; the California wildfires are causing global warming.

 

[CA_Shooter]

Here is a historical chart that goes up to 2006 for cutting down trees in California for timber, which also includes the requires brush clearing. So taking a look at the dramatic decrease is a huge reason for the uptick in fires every year.

 

[6xcshooter]

When you live with the devil. You burn with the devil.

 

[Texas10]

Interesting talk, slave labor.. I have dealt directly with some of the inmate crews, over the years. While it is true the wages they are paid into their accounts is pennies on the dollar, 99% if them are more than willing to work on the fire crews, enjoy it and it gives them some free time out of the facilities they are doing time in. They are far, far from being slave labor. And for your information, there are probably more white workers than man of color, so stop falling for and using the race card, like others seem too, every time they turn around and have no valid arguments.

The only one who threw the race card was YOU. The whole point, in case is passed you by, was that those low paid inmates are substituting for better paid, skilled labor, and that reduces costs to businesses who use them. That should've been plain enough by itself, but somehow it became a race issue to you.
SWD's post related that without low cost inmate labor, fire crews are smaller. Why do you think crews are smaller? Could it be a cost issue? Hmmmmmm.....

 

[Medic505]

Could it be the fact that there aren't enough willing bodies to throw into the fire? You can't tell me that the firefighters that have been burning the candle at both ends aren't worn to a frazzle. I'm very confident they appreciate any and all help they can get. Cost issue? BS. I've been there, done that, got the tee shirt. Have you?

 

[Nick Caprinolo]

I can not understand why anyone would build a home in an area susceptible to disaster on a regular basis. I can't blame insurers for not wanting to insure areas like this, or charge high rates. Yet, people continue to build and rebuild there. The same goes for flood areas. How many times has the Mississippi river overflowed and wiped out entire neighborhoods, only to have folks rebuild?

It seems to me that the local governments should not be issuing building permits in these areas. When these areas are struck by natural disasters of this nature, local authorities declare a disaster and then the feds start tossing tax payer money in the mix. Insurance companies then have enormous payouts and rates are raised throughout the country.

Yes, I am going to hear a lot of derogatory remarks about my views. The thing is that when I bought my property, I took a lot of things into consideration. Things like schools, being near a hospital, fire station, crime statistics, flood plains and weather conditions.

 

[CA_Shooter]

I can not understand why anyone would build a home in an area susceptible to disaster on a regular basis. I can't blame insurers for not wanting to insure areas like this, or charge high rates. Yet, people continue to build and rebuild there. The same goes for flood areas. How many times has the Mississippi river overflowed and wiped out entire neighborhoods, only to have folks rebuild?

It seems to me that the local governments should not be issuing building permits in these areas. When these areas are struck by natural disasters of this nature, local authorities declare a disaster and then the feds start tossing tax payer money in the mix. Insurance companies then have enormous payouts and rates are raised throughout the country.

Yes, I am going to hear a lot of derogatory remarks about my views. The thing is that when I bought my property, I took a lot of things into consideration. Things like schools, being near a hospital, fire station, crime statistics, flood plains and weather conditions.

I hear what you’re saying but which major or medium cities in the US aren’t susceptible to one or another natural disaster?

 

[Nick Caprinolo]

There are predictable tables for natural disasters. earth quakes, eruptions, hurricanes and many others. They use terms like once in 100 years or once in 50 years. There are areas in this country where a fire is predicted to happen ever so many years or a flood. New Orleans is hit by floods and storms several times a year. As is some areas of Texas. California has areas where fires can happen two to three times a year.

If you are wiped out one time, that can happen anywhere. Rebuild if you want to. After rebuilding once, the option to do it again is, in my opinion stupid. You have become a disaster just waiting for the next time.

We aren't talking about major cities here. The only danger of living in most cities are from the thugs who want to make you a victim. These fires are in rural areas, sweeping up and down the hills that have been deforested and now full of scrubs. When a fire starts there it creates major wind storms that spread the fire so fast it can't be controlled. Water is sol scarce, that some areas have laws that you can't even catch rainfall from your roof. How do you successfully fight a fire without water.

 

[Rset]

The only one who threw the race card was YOU. The whole point, in case is passed you by, was that those low paid inmates are substituting for better paid, skilled labor, and that reduces costs to businesses who use them. That should've been plain enough by itself, but somehow it became a race issue to you.
SWD's post related that without low cost inmate labor, fire crews are smaller. Why do you think crews are smaller? Could it be a cost issue? Hmmmmmm.....

Slave labor denotes certain implications (right or wrong). Prison labor opportunities are appreciated by many of the inmates serving their time as it gives them an opportunity to be productive and get out of the day to day grind of serving a term (many, but not all terms justified). Much of the work needed during these events is hard labor. Very little training or experience needed, but a lot of very hard work. The business you speak of that is benefiting is Government, which by the way produces nothing and is completely funded by taxes on the working population, and, also pays to incarcerate these inmates. Now, When your house is in jeopardy, your family, your business, etc. I am glad to hear that you will be willing to pay a premium price for assistance. Please post on this site so I can come help. I WILL send you a VERY large invoice for my services so you are not insulted by my offer.

 

[JASmith]

Some insurance companies contract with private hire suppression crews to help protect insured dwellings. I know that at least one if those crews was active in the hills East of San Jose and Fremont this last week.

I know this because one if their additional duties is inspecting insured dwellings and give advice on defensible zones. They visited us in this role yesterday.

 

[divingin]

Some insurance companies contract with private hire suppression crews to help protect insured dwellings. I know that at least one if those crews was active in the hills East of San Jose and Fremont this last week.

I know this because one if their additional duties is inspecting insured dwellings and give advice on defensible zones. They visited us in this role yesterday.

Hiya, neighbor!

Oakland (the city) has been doing this the last few years. Sort of. The Fire Dept does inspections of homes, and passes or fails based on defensible space (brush clearing, dead vegetation removal, branches over roofs, etc.) If you fail, you get a re-inspection at a later date for anywhere from $400 to $800. After that the city can fine you up to $1K/day of non-compliance. I have no idea where the money from the fines goes.

 

[swd]

The only one who threw the race card was YOU. The whole point, in case is passed you by, was that those low paid inmates are substituting for better paid, skilled labor, and that reduces costs to businesses who use them. That should've been plain enough by itself, but somehow it became a race issue to you.
SWD's post related that without low cost inmate labor, fire crews are smaller. Why do you think crews are smaller? Could it be a cost issue? Hmmmmmm.....

Cal Fire is a State agency not a private business. Californian's already pay some of the highest taxes in the country. Why wouldn't and shouldn't we reduce the cost to taxpayers by using labor that is sitting there doing nothing? Pretty much all of the work they do is not skilled. Cutting fire lines with a shovel and McLeod is hard work it needs bodies not college degrees. Up to the Covid thing just we had record low unemployment numbers so don't bother going there.

 

[Ackman]

How ironic you call Gov. Newsom a fascist dictator while championing the use of slave labor to drive profitability for politically connected private businesses.

Say what???? A couple really large severe lightning storms lit fire to areas all over California. They've got a serious problem over there. *** A friend there said the number was something like 1500 spread out over a large portion of the state. Only so many firefighters available to deal with them and it's tough work, can't keep going forever without a break. Newsom is a complete failure by but at least had the sense to get more boots on the ground from wherever he could get them. Slave labor? More like a way to out of the cell for awhile. "Profitability for politically connected private businesses." WTF you talking about.
**** Usually fire season in California is during the time of hot Santana winds blowing in from the desert. This time they were blowing West to East. I'm in Utah and for several days even in Salt Lake the visibility was really bad, the air was just awful.

 

[outasite`08]

Say what???? A couple really large severe lightning storms lit fire to areas all over California. They've got a serious problem over there. *** A friend there said the number was something like 1500 spread out over a large portion of the state. Only so many firefighters available to deal with them and it's tough work, can't keep going forever without a break. Newsom is a complete failure by but at least had the sense to get more boots on the ground from wherever he could get them. Slave labor? More like a way to out of the cell for awhile. "Profitability for politically connected private businesses." WTF you talking about.
**** Usually fire season in California is during the time of hot Santana winds blowing in from the desert. This time they were blowing West to East. I'm in Utah and for several days even in Salt Lake the visibility was really bad, the air was just awful.

What some folks fail to see is the cost for keeping fire crews year round on a payroll. That`s why volunteer fire dept. are important. Some are concerned about the slave labor not being paid like the regular fire crews. Ask a volunteer fire fighter how much he`s paid a year. Ask him/her how much they paid for his/her equipment to have the priviledge to risk their life and fight a fire. Some people just want to flap gums and know nothing about the whole issue. Jeff

 

[divingin]

That is exactly right. And for every "volunteer" there is one less paid firefighter.

That might be true if there was a set limit to the number of firefighters. There isn't. The prisoner firefighters augment the pro's, not replace them. There's nowhere near enough professional firefighters to respond to the current fires, which is why the surrounding states are sending in crews (as we in California do when they have problems.)

 

[outasite`08]

That might be true if there was a set limit to the number of firefighters. There isn't. The prisoner firefighters augment the pro's, not replace them. There's nowhere near enough professional firefighters to respond to the current fires, which is why the surrounding states are sending in crews (as we in California do when they have problems.)

You gotta wonder what drives some people? Want to argue?Are paid by Soros to start chaos? I live in Delaware,our wildfire response teams are sent to Cali and other states in the West all the time during peak fire season. That tells you that we have them and don`t always need them,but they are still paid. Volunteers are not robbing anyone of a paycheck, if it didn`t exist in the first place. divingin you get it,no so much for ol` tex. Jeff

 

[rr2030]

There is no limit to what some people dont know.

But what the hell, it's entertaining to read some of theses hip shot opinions, then watch the members on this forum eviscerate them.

 

[GeoffR]

It seems that 55 "specialist" Australian firefighters are heading to California this weekend. I guess they are professionals and that when you have fires coming at you every little bit helps when it comes to fighting them.

It's a pity we can't fight hurricanes also... you guys are really copping it over there!

 

[snert]

Right up front I will tell you I am NOT an expert. But in regard to the perfectly sane question as to why people rebuild in a flood zone, over and over, I think it has something to do with the insurance payouts and the govnt rules for disaster relief. And the banks that hold the mortgage. Pure guess here, but if a property is mortgaged it isnt "owned" fully by the insured, but rather by the bank. The bank has an interest in seeing the property rebuilt, so it can profit from long term mortgage interest. And I think there are certain incentives and disincentives to encourage rebuild. The process was covered in World magazine very well about two years ago i recall. But I don't recall the details!!

 

[SPQR70AD]

this is what gets me about these fires. they were talking about 1000-2000 year old redwoods might get burned up in these fires. what I want to know how did some last 2000 years without burning up? people say it was lightning. so there was lightning storms like that for 2000 years? others say brush is not cleared. well who cleared the brush in 30 AD? or 1022 AD?
Being we are ruled from demons from hell I do not dismiss the fact that the hand of man involved in these fires