I don't understand this advice or the logic "Never shoot a dry bore".

[TrxR]

I don't like where this thread is going as it may lead someone to believe that oil in the barrel is a good thing. I think the key here is "VERY LIGHT" film.
I use to use lock ease but have gone to using kroil followed by a dry patch or two. Very light film.

So you just run a wet patch of kroil then a dry patch? I suppose that would leave a small residue behind.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

So you just run a wet patch of kroil then a dry patch? I suppose that would leave a small residue behind.

I wouldn't even really call it a wet patch. More of a damp.

 

[Nick Caprinolo]

So, you send the first bullet down the tube' after applying a light coat of oil, which is then completely burned out, as soon as it is fired. That's a fouling shot. What's left after that. Burning oil creates carbon, which is then left in the barrel. I don't understand how that can help.

Why not just Moly coat them? Yes, I know that lots of folks have written that Moly is ruinous in barrels but many competitive shooters swear by it. I put 1600 rounds down a 6PPC barrel and showed no ill effects. Makes the barrel a breeze to clean and still shoots one hole groups.

I am not advocating the use of Moly coated bullets. When I bought that rifle, the bullets came with it. They were Ellie Huber 65 gr bullets. I am now shooting 68 gr Bart's bullets with no coating. As far as accuracy is concerned, I still get the same one hole groups.

This is like the age old question of "What came first, the chicken or the egg." Everyone has their opinion and we all know that opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. It's a matter of perception. Your perception is your reality.

 

[Troyboy]

When you clean to bare metal, you're oiling the barrel to prevent galling on first couple shots. The oil will blow out of barrel, but the powder fouling from the foulers serves to prevent galling once oil is gone.

 

[JMICK1210]

Was at the range this week and a young man cleaned his rifle bore with a rod and then borrowed my oilcan to finalize the cleaning with an oiled patch pushed through. He then returned to firing his rifle. I gave him a perplexed look as I casually mentioned (hint, hint) that I always want my bore clean and dry when I fire it if I expect MOA accuracy, and that I will fire 2 "fouler shots" to clear out standing oil and residue in the barrel from when I last cleaned & lubed it. He just ignored me and said "Thanks" for the oil. I'd say 1/3 or more folks know so little of basics as I witnessed another young man "sighting-in" his new Rem700 rifle, blowing through 4 boxes/$80 worth of 308 ammo with the barrel resting on the sand bag.(instead of resting the rifle on it's stock.) BUT, what surprised me was finding an old Pac-Nor "Barrel Break-In" sheet from years ago in my stack of papers that said "Never shoot a dry bore, as this will greatly promote copper fouling." For Pete's sake; if shooting a dry bore is bad or not preferred, what does Pac-Nor or anybody else think happens after you fire just a couple of shots through any lubed gun barrel anyway? LOL.

Is it me with my 5 shot 1/2" groups that's nuts and doing it wrong all these years? LOL

As long as you're consistent with your method of cleaning your barrel and you understand what your cold bore holds are then it doesn't matter. In sniper school I cleaned 2 dry, 2 wet, 2 dry and that was it. If i had a big qual the next day i didn't clean my gun at all. I let the carbon build up in the lands and grooves stay there so i didn't have to have a 3-5 round build up of carbon to be back on my original dopes.

 

[VaniB]

VaniB said; Is it me with my 5 shot 1/2" groups that's nuts and doing it wrong all these years? LOL

daleboy said; Ask the guys shooting 1/4" groups what they do .

Not sure I need to ask them.
But, I concede that at 65 I'm still always learning, and I don't mind hearing folks out to maybe learn something new.


Since you brought it up, I simply did NOT want to be bragacious when I chose to say "my 1/2" groups" and NOT choose to say "my 1/4" groups." I've got plenty of those 5 shot 1/4" groups and smaller. (3 round groups are bogus to me) I like to know that when I shoot 5 shot 1/4" groups that it likely had something to do with me and the rifle....and less to do with luck and putting oil in the bore. lol

And I do ALWAYS swab the barrel with an oil patch for storage between all range visits. But deliberately applying oil to a bore before shooting?? Nope.

 

[ebb]

I started long before the internet and a monthly magazine was the only knowledge to be had. I read in one that an oiled bore could have a hydraulic effect and ruin the barrel. I consulted the authority on this and he has assured me that oil is the best for any barrel.

 

[dgeesaman]

Lots of guys will clean the barrel, Run a patch through to dry it. Then a patch with light oil or in my case lock-easy before shooting.

A completely dry barrel will tend to copper fowl more.

Bart

Maybe PAC-Nor had a customer finish the cleaning by rinsing their barrel with brake cleaner. That would truly be dry and a bad idea.

David

 

[Ned Ludd]

Fluids don't compress easily. A liberal application of oil as the last step in the cleaning process is practically begging for a pressure spike that could easily damage the barrel on the next shot. Run a couple or three dry patches through it as the last step. That will still leave a thin film of oil a few molecules thick to protect and lubricate the bore.

 

[dolek]

Not sure I need to ask them.
But, I concede that at 65 I'm still always learning, and I don't mind hearing folks out to maybe learn something new.


Since you brought it up, I simply did NOT want to be bragacious when I chose to say "my 1/2" groups" and NOT choose to say "my 1/4" groups." I've got plenty of those 5 shot 1/4" groups and smaller. (3 round groups are bogus to me) I like to know that when I shoot 5 shot 1/4" groups that it likely had something to do with me and the rifle....and less to do with luck and putting oil in the bore. lol

YES, I do go through the beneficial long prep process of preparing my new barrels as recommended by most manufacturers. I in fact use the "boiling water" barrel prep process to start with. And I do ALWAYS swab the barrel with an oil patch for storage between all range visits. But deliberately applying oil to a bore before shooting?? Nope.

View attachment 1131282

Looks like you are ok,I would not be concerned with what others do .

 

[K22]

I think this issue is a lot like the "bullet weld" theory - nonsense. Obviously you don't want to shoot through a bore loaded with oil since in can created a high pressure situation and possible send the first shot off target.

I run a loose fitting patch through a clean bore to remove any excess rust preventative before shooting. I don't get first shoot flyers. Been doing it this way for almost 50 years now.

 

[wkdickinson]

Again, this is a "what your barrel likes" conversation. I had a 308 Obermeyer 1:8.5" that shot the exact same POA from a barrel with 88 shot down it or totally clean and cold, wet or dry. I now have a Criterion 243 1:8" that puts the first two low and to the right every time you start shooting, clean or dirty. I have always (at lest most of the time) run a dry patch down the bore before shooting to get most of the oil out.

 

[10XSHOOTER]

I use the Slick 50 one lube. a wet patch after cleaning before firing the first shot of break in routine. A lot easier to clean later when shooting groups or ELK!

 

[46and2]

Fluids don't compress easily. A liberal application of oil as the last step in the cleaning process is practically begging for a pressure spike that could easily damage the barrel on the next shot. Run a couple or three dry patches through it as the last step. That will still leave a thin film of oil a few molecules thick to protect and lubricate the bore.

I run HBN in every barrel I have. In a clean barrel I'll run a patch of HBN and 91% alcohol down the bore. When the alcohol is evaporated the bore is slightly frosted whitish.
The first shot is loaded with about 6% less powder charge. If a full charge is shot with a treated bore I'd most likely blow a primer.

 

[Straightshooter1]

I too had read a while back, that if your bore is clean and dry, the friction of the first shot is greater (and that is both harder on the barrel and means the first shot will be errant). So I thought it is worth a try. Like Bart, I got a can of the liquid Lock Ease (not the spray), and started putting a few drops on a patch and running it through the barrel.

What I discovered is that my first shot now is exactly with the shots that follow. Now I realize that my cleaning routine is probably different than yours, but I'm sold. And Lock Ease is a graphite powder suspended in a solvent. So what remains behind in my case is the light coating of graphite. The change was dramatic for me.
View attachment 1131193

While this idea of having a "light" coat of oil for the first shot sounds like a good thing, I have reservations on using anything containing graphite it's under high pressure. Under high pressure, graphite acts like sandpaper. Now this may not really be much of an issue any more than using things like Tubb's Final Finish Bore Lapping bullets. So, if one doesn't mind having a little sanding/polishing of the boar, this I guess it's really of not concern. But, I just don't know how heavy that grit is in something like this or how it might effect wear and tear if done regularly.

This idea of using graphite as some kind of lubrication (especially for high pressure applications) reminds me of when synthetic motor oil came to market back in the 70's. There was a company that decided to use graphite in their synthetic oil and marketed the lubrication benefit of the graphite. Having worked on aircraft that uses synthetic oils, I was interested in using such for my automobiles. But the idea of the graphite concerned me then too. And as it turned out, people who used this synthetic oil laced with graphite were having their engines seize up due to excessive wear of their engine's bearings, cams and rings. Am glad I used my noodle.

 

[1911nut]

After cleaning with PatchOut I run a wet patch with Kroil followed by a dry patch. The bore isn’t totally dry, remember “it’s the oil that creeps” .
When I get to the range I just visually check the bore for spiders or crickets and shoot.

My centerfires first shots go into the group.

My Rimfire gets the same Kroil patch-dry patch but the first shot goes high.

I believe I see less blue on the patches since Ive been finishing with the Kroil-dry patch.

 

[dolek]

While this idea of having a "light" coat of oil for the first shot sounds like a good thing, I have reservations on using anything containing graphite it's under high pressure. Under high pressure, graphite acts like sandpaper. Now this may not really be much of an issue any more than using things like Tubb's Final Finish Bore Lapping bullets. So, if one doesn't mind having a little sanding/polishing of the boar, this I guess it's really of not concern. But, I just don't know how heavy that grit is in something like this or how it might effect wear and tear if done regularly.

This idea of using graphite as some kind of lubrication (especially for high pressure applications) reminds me of when synthetic motor oil came to market back in the 70's. There was a company that decided to use graphite in their synthetic oil and marketed the lubrication benefit of the graphite. Having worked on aircraft that uses synthetic oils, I was interested in using such for my automobiles. But the idea of the graphite concerned me then too. And as it turned out, people who used this synthetic oil laced with graphite were having their engines seize up due to excessive wear of their engine's bearings, cams and rings. Am glad I used my noodle.

Can you point me to tests that prove graphite becomes an abrasive ? I am very interested in this subject...been using graphite for many years will no ill effects . Thanks

 

[rwj]

Can you point me to tests that prove graphite becomes an abrasive ? I am very interested in this subject...been using graphite for many years will no ill effects . Thanks

Graphite has a Mohs scale hardness of 1 - 2 (pretty low). It’s a form of carbon that when subjected to sufficient heat, pressure, and time becomes diamond.

 

[JFrank]

I don't like where this thread is going as it may lead someone to believe that oil in the barrel is a good thing. I think the key here is "VERY LIGHT" film.
I use to use lock ease but have gone to using kroil followed by a dry patch or two. Very light film.

Mike
I think your post deserves a bump for those that missed this important point.
Jim

 

[JFrank]

Fluids don't compress easily. A liberal application of oil as the last step in the cleaning process is practically begging for a pressure spike that could easily damage the barrel on the next shot. Run a couple or three dry patches through it as the last step. That will still leave a thin film of oil a few molecules thick to protect and lubricate the bore.

Bumpin Ned’s important post as well.
Jim