Anybody applying for sheep/goat/moose in Colorado?

[linebaugh]

I have been applying for sheep and goat in Colorado for 15 years now as a non-res. Yesterday the new application booklet came in the mail. I could not be more digusted with the state of Colorado, it's not possible.

I think back when I started I paid 1200 per species and had to pay 2400 up front for the "privelage" of having no chance of even drawing a tag then got my money back 45 days later. This had progressed to sending in 1800 or 2000 per species 2 years ago and last year they finally let a person apply for a nominal fee while keeping your 4 grand in your bank account.

This year they expect you to buy a habitat stamp, pay a fee for processing, buy a small game license and pay 100$ per species to apply and/or get your preference point. For me that's a 300$ bill for the privelage of possibly getting drawn in the next 10 years. If you applied for all 3 species that would be 400$ a year. They took a nice gentle approch to ramping up the cost for application... that was a joke.

What an absolute JOKE Colorado has become. I have effectively wasted 15 years of my life on a dream that has now become too costly to maintain. To say that I am pissed off would be the understatement of the year. I can only conclude that the all mighty dollar, piss poor management and a state that is becoming the next California has everything to do with this. I will never hunt that state again in my life and I will never vacation there aigain in my life. As far as I am concerned the state can go broke and eat sh--!

Had to rant and vent somewhere. I will send the DOW an email but I am certain nobody will give a damn about my frustration and wasted years. I can't imagine I am the only person whom is beyond disgusted with this nonsesical joke of a state. Would love to hear others thoughts good, bad or otherwise on this issue.

 

[Evan]

The state's hunting is pretty screwed up and has been for a while. As I understand it all the populations are pretty unhealthy and they're not recovering. There also may be some preference given to residents and the sheer number of people here certainly doesn't help. Sorry! I don't even try. Most of my buddies, despite having tags, have not been able to actually get an animal.

 

[moondog]

I've lived here since 76 and things have changed a bit for sure. I stopped hunting big game about
5 years ago, too crowded for my liking's. If I didn't have a place to shoot 10 minutes from my
place, I would rethink my final years here. P.S. they ain't gunna go broke with the dope revenue
coming in!

 

[wvlongshot]

I also was disgusted in the fact of having to buy a small game license even to apply for cow elk tags, mule deer, and I guess anything that's not OTC tags.
Even my 13yr old son has to have one for application of a permit.
About done with Colorado.

 

[linebaugh]

I've lived here since 76 and things have changed a bit for sure. I stopped hunting big game about
5 years ago, too crowded for my liking's. If I didn't have a place to shoot 10 minutes from my
place, I would rethink my final years here. P.S. they ain't gunna go broke with the dope revenue
coming in!

They might go broke. Dopers drag in welfare abuse, crime and give little back to society as a rule. If you don't believe that I will give you my nephew's phone number. Dumb ass kid that moved from Iowa so he could legally smoke dope in Colorado. Can't and won't keep a job, in general uses everyone he can to get by, 25 years old and life is groovy as long as he can smoke dope and be a scum bag. How much do you think the state takes in as revenue off of his ilk?

 

[Evan]

They might go broke. Dopers drag in welfare abuse, crime and give little back to society as a rule. If you don't believe that I will give you my nephew's phone number. Dumb ass kid that moved from Iowa so he could legally smoke dope in Colorado. Can't and won't keep a job, in general uses everyone he can to get by, 25 years old and life is groovy as long as he can smoke dope and be a scum bag. How much do you think the state takes in as revenue off of his ilk?

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, supported by your anecdotes, but the colorado department of revenue reports 1 billion in retail marijuana taxes in the past 5 years since it was legalized. Revenues grow year after year well ahead of inflation or normal market forces. This is all revenue that was in the black market and now is a contributing part of society. I'm all for it.

 

[mrjdasr]

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, supported by your anecdotes, but the colorado department of revenue reports 1 billion in retail marijuana taxes in the past 5 years since it was legalized. Revenues grow year after year well ahead of inflation or normal market forces. This is all revenue that was in the black market and now is a contributing part of society. I'm all for it.

hope you are in the head of the line when the sh-t hits the fan, as it surely will
congratulations you just made my ignore list

 

[Bill K]

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, supported by your anecdotes, but the colorado department of revenue reports 1 billion in retail marijuana taxes in the past 5 years since it was legalized. Revenues grow year after year well ahead of inflation or normal market forces. This is all revenue that was in the black market and now is a contributing part of society. I'm all for it.

All the states that have gone legal dope, reports the great amount of revenue they are taking in.
But have you seen the figures they are spending on welfare, medical cost increases and the rate of crime climbing ? Not one figure will they release showing that. So you can bet your bottom dollar they are loosing money in the long run on these dopers and leach's .

 

[MrMajestic]

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, supported by your anecdotes, but the colorado department of revenue reports 1 billion in retail marijuana taxes in the past 5 years since it was legalized. Revenues grow year after year well ahead of inflation or normal market forces. This is all revenue that was in the black market and now is a contributing part of society. I'm all for it.

$200M a year ain't crap. Politicians can blow that in a day...The black market is still thriving as not all will/can pay the high prices of store bought pot...Does free up law enforcement to pursue violent crimes though, JMHO
Dope and alcohol are cruel masters...

 

[Bill K]

[...Does free up law enforcement to pursue violent crimes though, JMHO

You are kidding right ? Free up LE, not hardly, they are now even more taxed to work more crime that the dopers are doing. And with the way dopers are treated in courts now days, if they have a drug arrest and are on a rehab program, often the DA's allow them to plead to lesser crimes and get even more probation, rather than jail time.
So they are free to continue to keep committing criminals activity on the streets.
I saw and see it too this day, even after 28 years in LE and being retired now. But friends still working the streets can tell you what the courts and one's that support drug legalization will not.

 

[spencerhenry]

I feel your pain on the hunting in Colorado. I am a resident, but can assure you I am about done with Colorado as well. There are some good people working for Parks and Wildlife, but unfortunately the Denver beaurocrats push the decisions. Management of actual game herds, in my opinion, has not been good in the last several years. The state merged the Parks Department with Division of Wildlife a few years ago, since then the decisions have been more based on money than on sound game management. My fees as a resident went up as well, not enough to stop me from hunting, but enough that I may not apply for licenses that take many years to draw.
I hunted moose last year, the quality of the hunt was not good, the hunting pressure was heavy, it was only due to persistence that I found a moose on the last day. I drew deer, antelope, and moose all of those hunts saw massive hunting pressure, I used 10 points for deer, and 9 for antelope. The quality of the hunts was low, I would rate them a 3 on a scale of 1 to 10.

I personally believe that the State of Colorado is in for serious financial trouble in the coming years. There has been a huge influx of people drawing on the state without contributing much. Every local jurisdiction is asking for more money every election, on the state level there are many requests for money as well. This last year the Department of Transportation tried to get a state property tax to fund roads, fortunately they were not successful. Marijuana does bring in a lot of tax revenue, that ballot item was successful partly due to the tax being earmarked for schools, NOT the general fund. Yet, even still there are claims that our schools are grossly underfunded and falling apart, and there were requests for increased property taxes locally for schools.
This state has become a little California, guns and gun owners are targeted here. There is a very large illegal alien population that the governments protect from federal law. Taxes may not be super high right now, but they are going up little by little. Our public lands are being overrun with people to the point that a permit is now required to camp in some locations in the Maroon Bells Snowmass Wilderness area.
Colorado State government will spend every bit of revenue they have, and it will not be enough. There will be higher taxes in the coming years, along with a decreased quality of life.

I believe that the OP, is one of many that will swear off Colorado, I think this will increase greatly in the next few years. Non-resident license fees are a big source of revenue, when that declines where will the money come from to manage our already struggling big game herds?

 

[pikespeakgoat]

As far as I am aware, most of the mountain states except for New Mexico have some sort of point fee/license purchase requirement to apply/accumulate preference points. Most (State G&F's) have found their cash cows wrt hunting and these types of fees and will milk it for all they can. It's all about the almighty $$$ IMO.

Take Colorado for instance, just look at the resident $50.00 point fees that they will acquire beginning this year with the new $50.00 per species fees (Moose, sheep & goat). Assuming app numbers same as last year - 86,778 applicant for these species at $50.00/point = $4,338,900.00. That's a heck of a revenue booster in just one year! Previously these apps garnered just $260,334.00 in application fees at $3.00/app.

Now look at just the new $7.00 application/species for resident (antelope, bear, deer & elk) - Again assuming same applicant numbers from last year, 309,272 applicants at $7.00/app = $2,164,904.00. Previously these applicants garnered just $927,816.00 at $3.00/app.

For NR, the big 3 (moose, goat, sheep) there were 37,540 apps last year at $100.00/point = $3,754,000.00 compared to just $112,620.00 at $3.00/app.

NR for bear, deer, elk and antelope - last year there were 194,745 apps at $9.00/point = $1,752,705.00 compared to just $584,235.00 at $3.00/point.

Then with the $2,500,000.00 saved due to no more refund costs for vendor provided services and you can clearly see why all these G&F departments want these types of fees and these types of processes.

These new fees amount to an increase of $10,125,504.00 in new revenue over last year, assuming same number of apps. Quite the budget booster isn't it?

I previously purchased NR points in Wyoming for moose, started at $5.00. Then after I was in for 4-5 years they raised their point fees to $50.00, I bowed out, now they are $150.00. Hindsight being 20/20, wish I would have stayed in that game a few more years until I drew, oh well, live and learn.

Back to Colorado, this will be year 32 for me as a resident applying for moose. I hope to draw some year...... however, I would give up my chance for tag in a heartbeat if I could be assured that my grandson could draw his, he will be 17 this year.

Bottom line for me is that with all the fees that many states are charging, to just at some point in the future have a chance to draw a tag, I have to pay in order to play the game. Do I like it, absolutely NOT.

 

[hogpatrol]

After hunting Africa, you couldn't pay me to hunt out west but aren't the other states like Idaho, Wyoming and Utah better for hunting than Colorado?
Aside all that, from this chair, once the boomer hunters are finished hunting, all those license fee monies will dry up. Millennials aren't going to waste money for years on "points" and "draws".

 

[rardoin]

After hunting Africa, you couldn't pay me to hunt out west but aren't the other states like Idaho, Wyoming and Utah better for hunting than Colorado?
Aside all that, from this chair, once the boomer hunters are finished hunting, all those license fee monies will dry up. Millennials aren't going to waste money for years on "points" and "draws".

Don't forget Montana

 

[Kramerica]

Let me start by saying I am no expert at all here. I went out to Colorado two years ago to elk hunt (over the counter unit) for the first time. It was terrible, I’ve honestly never seen so much orange on a mountain before. And all the elk were across the road on private land the entire time. Didn’t even come close to seeing anything on public land. It was pretty frustrating and eye opening. Not to mention, it was pretty expensive for a younger out of state person. I’d like to go again (in a different unit) but reading this thread makes me think twice. Not a lot of options though I only know one person who lives out west so that’s where I go. As much as I beat up on my home state of NY for terrible laws I will say I enjoy our long hunting season and my lifetime hunting license. Lifetime license at the time I got it cost me about $300. One 12 day elk hunt in CO cost me around $600 just for the OTC tag. Ouch.

 

[Evan]

Sadly, that's the common experience: pumpkin city and all the animals are hanging on private land where they know they're safe.

 

[Bill K]

Are not all the states raising their lic/tag fees over the last few years ? It really comes down to two things, if you want to hunt in anyone of them, go for it and pay the price. Or simple don't, and spend your money elsewhere or on something else.
We can complain all we want, but in the long run, you go or you don't. Take up another hobby or sport or maybe just hunt varmints and enjoy getting out.

 

[spencerhenry]

I suspect your hunting dollars will get you more satisfaction in states other than Colorado.
If I didn't have a private ranch to hunt for elk, I'm not sure I would hunt elk anymore.

 

[hogpatrol]

Are not all the states raising their lic/tag fees over the last few years ? It really comes down to two things, if you want to hunt in anyone of them, go for it and pay the price. Or simple don't, and spend your money elsewhere or on something else.
We can complain all we want, but in the long run, you go or you don't. Take up another hobby or sport or maybe just hunt varmints and enjoy getting out.

Bill, probably an outlier but PA hasn't had a license fee increase in seventeen years. It has to be approved by the legislature, the same entity that won't allow Sunday hunting. Can't speak for other states.

 

[Liven The Dream]

I Hunted Elk and Deer in the San Juan Mt. with a Good Outfitter and Friend.
The Rules put Him out of Business .

Thought for the Day ! Make Hunting so hard and costly , no one Hunts ….
Now they can push you don't need a Rifle no one Hunt's anymore ???