BRA Does NOT Guarantee "Harry" a World Record

[mikeeg02]

I'm surprised at your speed. If you're not feeling pressure try 30.7 h4895 with 450s. I had a consistent shooting barrel with 107s, 30.7 4895, and 450s, probably 10 off.

 

[comagutsa]

I'm surprised at your speed. If you're not feeling pressure try 30.7 h4895 with 450s. I had a consistent shooting barrel with 107s, 30.7 4895, and 450s, probably 10 off.

Hey mate
It's a brand new barrel with 43 rounds down it and a load I just threw together to run in barrels . yeah no pressure.. What speeds you getting Mike?

 

[mikeeg02]

Hey mate
It's a brand new barrel with 43 rounds down it and a load I just threw together to run in barrels . yeah no pressure.. What speeds you getting Mike?

It may speed up a little more after a few more rounds. I'll have to look at my notes but I believe that barrel was 2940-2950. My other three barrels with varget loads tend to be around 2980

 

[mikeeg02]

With only 43 firings and using formed loads. Did you only form a hand full of cases ? Or are the cases from the previous barrel ?

 

[comagutsa]

With only 43 firings and using formed loads. Did you only form a hand full of cases ? Or are the cases from the previous barrel ?

Cases are from last barrel (have 200) I just had to stop as sun was setting . And there is bugger difference in chambering between old barrel and new

 

[KenOath]

I tested some 450s and BR4s at 30.6gr also.. Speeds.
BR4s
View attachment 1062833
View attachment 1062834

450s
View attachment 1062836
View attachment 1062837

Looks like the 450s are giving better es..

 

[tom]

Larry,

Did you ever diagnose the problems?

Tom

 

[bcarico]

Larry,

Did you ever diagnose the problems?

Tom

Pretty sure it was a tuner error.

 

[CaptainMal]

Larry,

Did you ever diagnose the problems?

Tom

OK. Will make this short. I am an ars when it comes to reloading. That short enough?

Two years of BRA, three barrels on two different actions, custom rifle by Alex Wheeler, thousands of rounds testing and thousands of dollars trying. Add in the IBS shoots and as of last Monday I never had any of my BRA rifles/barrels shoot worth a poop compared to my Dashers. What could the commonality be?

Roy Hunter stopped at my house last Monday. He used some of my pullers to re-seat the bullets in his ammo for this past weekend shoot. When he used my BRA seating die as I had set it, his concentricity and seating depth got inconsistent. Need I say more? We diminished and basically fixed the problem by using my Dasher seating die. Disassembled the Forster BR die and found no issues with the chamber of parts.

Sitting in a cancer center waiting for my wife to finish her tests and it hit me. I set that die wrong. Home and sure enough, there was the problem smacking me. I was starting the bullet seating before the case was fully supported by the die chamber, tweaking some necks and making as much as .015" off concentricity. All that time and I only had clues but did not recognize the issue. My BRA ammo was crap. My Dasher ammo was fine. It sure showed in my scores the past two years.

Right now I have a Wilson Dasher die and a new K&M Arbor press on the bench. Initial testing shows that, after running cases back through the Harrells' die to straighten them out, my re-adjusted old Forster die is good for maybe .003" runout and the Wilson seems to keep things under .002".

Heading to Bob Davidson's private range tomorrow to start initial testing. Don't tell Alex. He may just pass out laughing at me. Promise.

 

[tom]

Was your depths varying or just run out? That's good news either way though, it sucks worse when you can NOT find a problem!

Tom

 

[tom]

Don't tell Alex. He may just pass out laughing at me. Promise.

He can read(at least somewhat) Hopefully he didn't put you on his "No soup for you" list

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Theres about a million things that need to be right in this game. Id never laugh at someone's mistake, I have made more than my share. Im just glad you got to the bottom of it.

 

[Ccrider]

Wow. Seems that one of the things to do when having problems is to make sure your hand loaded ammo is right—-preferably perfect. Seems to help to shoot smaller groups. Well, better late than never.

Makes me feel a lots better being a newbie. Thanks

 

[ttfreestyle]

He can read(at least somewhat) Hopefully he didn't put you on his "No soup for you" list

Order your rifle and step to the side

 

[Roy H]

You guys might not be laughing but I sure was when I showed Larry and he was ready to wreck his loading room Roy

 

[CaptainMal]

He can read(at least somewhat) Hopefully he didn't put you on his "No soup for you" list

Right at the top. At least I'm good for something.

Roy was throwing that Forster bushing BR die in the garbage can. I rescued it because of the unknown and the expense. Glad I did because - it was an issue of BOTH consistent seating depth and run-out. First took that die apart. Replaced an "O" ring and studied out its' operation. Compared it to the other BR seating die without the micrometer adjustment that seemed to be way better.

After discovery I found out it actually takes, after bullet pulling, TWO passes through the Harrell's die to get the necks back straight. Now as I sit and play re-doing some BRA from another lot, I can really see differences in bullet quality between Roys, Barts, VT's and Bergers. Night and day repeatability and you can guess the specifics. Picture is right now......

cSuzI68hQgWlHc4OlpKRFQ by Larry Malinoski, on Flickr

Will try Roys 108's for the first time tomorrow with H4895. The "repair" I am working on right now had Varget in it. Just re-doing, checking run-out and seating with care. They seem to be way, way, way better.

Thanks Roy for stopping me from doing damage to my loading bench. I was not a happy camper for a while. Just a reminder....

"There's no pain if your stupid".

 

[KenOath]

Right at the top. At least I'm good for something.

Roy was throwing that Forster bushing BR die in the garbage can. I rescued it because of the unknown and the expense. Glad I did because - it was an issue of BOTH consistent seating depth and run-out. First took that die apart. Replaced an "O" ring and studied out its' operation. Compared it to the other BR seating die without the micrometer adjustment that seemed to be way better.

After discovery I found out it actually takes, after bullet pulling, TWO passes through the Harrell's die to get the necks back straight. Now as I sit and play re-doing some BRA from another lot, I can really see differences in bullet quality between Roys, Barts, VT's and Bergers. Night and day repeatability and you can guess the specifics. Picture is right now......

cSuzI68hQgWlHc4OlpKRFQ by Larry Malinoski, on Flickr

Will try Roys 108's for the first time tomorrow with H4895. The "repair" I am working on right now had Varget in it. Just re-doing, checking run-out and seating with care. They seem to be way, way, way better.

Thanks Roy for stopping me from doing damage to my loading bench. I was not a happy camper for a while. Just a reminder....

"There's no pain if your stupid".

Glad you may have gotten to the bottom of your problem... good to know I’m not the only one that looses sleep over this stuff!!!

 

[CaptainMal]

Glad you may have gotten to the bottom of your problem... good to know I’m not the only one that looses sleep over this stuff!!!

Don't lose sleep. Hardly ever as I sleep quickly and solid. Do get a bit upset with myself for doing stupid things. Will not look back though. Satchel Paige said...

"Never look back. Something could be gainin' on you".

 

[X-Caveman]

About the only time I ever measure loaded round run-out is on my dummy round for finding length to lands. I think I've determined that, unless that case is pretty straight, I'm gonna have a hard time feeling what I need to using the method that Alex has posted the video on. The more I learn about tuning (I think), the more frequently I do this.

Sorry about your struggles. Glad you found a smoking gun.

 

[Shooter13]

Myron Cope, late announcer for the Steelers, likened ordinary pro football players as just another "Harry". My name is Larry but I shoot like "Harry". To be good at the BR game I feel you should be a machinist, chamber your own barrels, fit them to your actions and be superb in your testing procedures. Wealthy would also be another "must" on the list. Had one of the best gunsmiths build me a new BRA last year. To date my results are disappointing.

With way more than $10,000 in rifle, scope, mounts, dies, cases, various powders, bullets (Vapor Trail, Bergers, Barts, Hornady, Sierra), brake, new target camera, neck turner, hundreds of trips to the range, mega hours on the bench and more... my Dashers easily outshoot it on its best day. I am not alone. At Manatee I know three others who had BRA's recently built. Only one, BR1, has had success with his builds. The others are like me but with less than my 1,000+ rounds of testing. Two others on this forum also correspond with me to discuss their frustration with the BRA. We just cannot get it to shoot well.

Sure my gunsmith told me to trash the Krieger barrel at about the 400 round mark. I resisted because this next test would be the one. The next and the next have long come and gone. The gun is now good for fire forming.

New barrels and the work to get it chambered is both expensive and tough to source. Then after, there are no guarantees. While all the recent hype on the BRA seems to say is it's making good shooters great and great ones, world class. That may be the case but BRA does not take us "Harry's" into the realm of a quality shooter just like that.

I regret my recent foray into frustration with the BRA. It has taken much of the fun out of benchrest shooting for me. Think about this before jumping in with high expectations. You just might be another "Harry".

PM me, I may be interested in the BRA, hoping it is a DD, seriously, shoot me a pm.