Change the F-Class National Championship CoF?

[Medic505]

What comes next, get rid of 800/900 and only shoot 1,000.

We got rid of 800 and 900 yards in 2012 or 2013. Real men and women shoot from 1000.
It's F Class, not palma.

 

[Ringostar]

I don't mind moving distance in a Palma match. What I don't agree with is shooting 300yds on a pull and mark target. How many pasters will it take before the X ring is covered on the small target. Then it becomes a puller discretion as to whether the shot is an X or 10. I don't believe that it would be scored fairly down the line.

 

[swadiver]

There is a movement afoot to change the Course of Fire (CoF) of the NRA F-Class National Championships by removing the 300 & 500 yard stages so all shooting will be done at 600 yards.

Why you ask?

There are a number of reasons:
If this is done all the shooting will take place at the most challenging distance. By removing the other two yard lines the shooters experience will be enhanced by shortening the shooting day and reducing shooter fatigue. You won’t have to haul your gear from yard line to yard line. The hosting clubs will save money and effort since they will only have to prep frames for one distance reducing their prep efforts and cost them less money. Who knows perhaps the entry fees will go down.

At every competitors meeting I have attended after the mid-range championships the majority of the competitors voted to make this change and the NRA HP Committee has failed to make the change. That is the reason for this petition. If you are a mid-range F-Class competitor and in favor of the this action print out the attached file, sign it along with your fellow competitors and mail it to the NRA at the address noted on the petition.

+1

 

[Lbart]

I don't mind moving distance in a Palma match. What I don't agree with is shooting 300yds on a pull and mark target. How many pasters will it take before the X ring is covered on the small target. Then it becomes a puller discretion as to whether the shot is an X or 10. I don't believe that it would be scored fairly down the line.

+1

 

[falconpilot]

It's Mid-Range for that reason. Its 300, 500 and 600 yards. I don't like lugging gear between the yard lines more than anyone else, but I do enjoy the differenet yardages...While matches and nationals are NOT won at 300 and 500 yards, they can darn sure be lost there. I've seen many points lost a 300 and 500 yards, by other competitors and by myself...cleans are NOT a given!

I for one am against the change - prefer the way it is..

 

[falconpilot]

I don't mind moving distance in a Palma match. What I don't agree with is shooting 300yds on a pull and mark target. How many pasters will it take before the X ring is covered on the small target. Then it becomes a puller discretion as to whether the shot is an X or 10. I don't believe that it would be scored fairly down the line.

It's been scored fairly for years now. It hasn't suddenly changed.. E-targets are a much bigger "what if" to me than what you have mentioned..

 

[bennett ford]

Before you get rid of the shorter mid ranges, think of how many F-class shooters in the country depend on 300 yard ranges for most of their shooting. To belittle their efforts would surely drive some of them out of the game. Losing shooters is not what our community needs. A three day match of 2 or 3 20 shot strings would be a real test (day 1 300, day 2 500, day 3 600). I have played the high power game in its various forms since 1963 and the allure has always been the mental challenge, the physical challenge, and the people . Think long and hard before you exclude anyone who is having a good time.

 

[MattPeetz]

It should only be 600 and 1000 yards.

 

[Medic505]

To belittle their efforts would surely drive some of them out of the game.

I do not think anyone is belittling anyone's efforts in any way. I would also wager that 300 and 500 yard matches drives away far more shooters at Nationals than it attracts. I have shot F-Class Nationals from 2011 and this (2018) will be the first time I've signed up for mid-range and I'm already having second thoughts about it. After shooting the Rocky Mountain Palma and the Santa Fe Long Range last weekend, I ask myself on the way home, do I really want to play the move all your crap every match game at Nationals? If I had a choice, I would say no.

Jimmy Dasher, I see you points and also agree. The 300 yard target is by far the most challenging in the game. But the fact remains, it's not only going to make for a couple very long days, but a very long week. I would be all in for having two separate events, but I don't see that happening either.

I have to believe if it was all fired at 600 yards, there would not only be greater participation, but a bunch more happy shooters.

 

[Jay Christopherson]

I don't mind moving distance in a Palma match. What I don't agree with is shooting 300yds on a pull and mark target. How many pasters will it take before the X ring is covered on the small target. Then it becomes a puller discretion as to whether the shot is an X or 10. I don't believe that it would be scored fairly down the line.

seen this in action personally... all 600 for mid-range would be at least somewhat more compelling in terms of winning than the current format and I'd guess more people might attend for all of the reasons that have already been stated.

 

[Shep1]

seen this in action personally... all 600 for mid-range would be at least somewhat more compelling in terms of winning than the current format and I'd guess more people might attend for all of the reasons that have already been stated.

I personally like the berger format at SWN

 

[Shep1]

I personally like the berger format at SWN

Midrange and long range SWN format is about right

 

[Ringostar]

Midrange and long range SWN format is about right

The F Class Nationals used to be run similar. There was no separate mid and long range. We shot one day at 600 and 3 days at 1000. The 600 was dropped in 2012.

 

[effendude]

I support Larry's petition from a target maintenance point of view, 300 yards is a waste of paper. Even cutting pasters in half, then ripping then into smaller pieces, the X-Ring only lasts 3-4 shots. Then it needs a new center. Keep shooting 300 yards on the backer and you need a new one soon, even is you move the centers around on the backer. I have proposed for a long time to make the 300 yard target similar to a smallbore 5 spot target. There is much real estate on the carrier and we shoot the crap out of 3" of it.

I have never been to nationals but I would like to if it was ever held during a time other than hunting season. It is the national championships, I do think all the distances should be shot at.

Scott

 

[KT]

It's Mid-Range for that reason. Its 300, 500 and 600 yards. I don't like lugging gear between the yard lines more than anyone else, but I do enjoy the differenet yardages...While matches and nationals are NOT won at 300 and 500 yards, they can darn sure be lost there. I've seen many points lost a 300 and 500 yards, by other competitors and by myself...cleans are NOT a given!

I for one am against the change - prefer the way it is..

I'm with Jim. I like the 300, 500, and 600 yards as part of the midrange. It's an extra challenge. Different targets, changing elevation between lines, and moving gear brings in a physical and more and importantly a mental challenge.

I would like for the midrange to stay the way it currently is.

 

[davidjoe]

“What comes next, get rid of 800/900 and only shoot 1,000.”

.... As far as F-Class goes, yes, I wish they would. The 800 and 900 target is specified to be the same size rings as what we shoot at 1,000. It’s all considered Long Range. Closer distances just make for easier shooting and higher scores. Perhaps if a club wanted to be a high master factory this is a good thing.

But otherwise the 800 and 900 just require more movement. Any skill you can demonstrate at 1,000 is simply amplified at 800 and 900. No one is “good” at 1,000 but bad at 800. While there are “accuracy” rifles and BC monsters that lack pin point accuracy, the last 200 yards to 1000 are already beyond the scope of that distinction.

 

[KWeigel]

“What comes next, get rid of 800/900 and only shoot 1,000.”

.... As far as F-Class goes, yes, I wish they would. The 800 and 900 target is specified to be the same size rings as what we shoot at 1,000. It’s all considered Long Range. Closer distances just make for easier shooting and higher scores. Perhaps if a club wanted to be a high master factory this is a good thing.

But otherwise the 800 and 900 just require more movement. Any skill you can demonstrate at 1,000 is simply amplified at 800 and 900. No one is “good” at 1,000 but bad at 800. While there are “accuracy” rifles and BC monsters that lack pin point accuracy, the last 200 yards to 1000 are already beyond the scope of that distinction.

I am one that still really enjoys the Palma course. You can’t win at those yard lines but you can definitely screw up!

 

[ngb1787]

I am one that still really enjoys the Palma course. You can’t win at those yard lines but you can definitely screw up!

Very few shooters at our range clean the shorter yard lines. Just sayin,

 

[Kings X]

I think dropping 300 and 500 might hurt the sport.
The Mid Range format is justification for a second gun.
With just 600 and 1000 only one large caliber gun needed to shoot in either match. I think that many shooters drag out the favorite 7mm or 30 caliber to shoot 600 when the wind kicks up. Why not shoot it all the time?
Right now, a lot of shooters do better at Mid-Range with one of the 6mm. Accurate and less recoil equals higher scores.
The folks complaining about dragging equipment around would only have one gun case to worry with..
But it would hurt barrel manufactures, brass companies and Bullet manufacturers. Maybe even scope and stock makers. I know it would cut into gunsmith work load.
Just pulling your leg - am all FOR changing the format to only 600.

 

[Lbart]

Richard,
Glad to see your last line. BTW, the petition was not my idea. I’m just the messenger/poster.