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Salt bath annealing....how do you get that cooled salt puck out?

There are three conditions that effect neck tension, besides die size.
1 Work hardening the brass (sizing)
2 Annealing ( or more properly stress relieving)
3 aging

Anytime the brass hardness is artificially altered, either through working or annealing, the brass will continue to harden gradually with the passage of time (aging).

Many competition shooters will load and shoot, same day, within hours if possible. Not just to load for conditions of the day, or time/temp of the day, but also to reduce the effects of changing necks tension due to aging. This is particularly true for shooting long distance where slight changes in neck tension can result in large changes in group size.

Someone here posted a while back regarding effects of aging. IIRC is went something like this.

For the greatest neck tension, anneal, size, load, let sit 3 days and shoot.
For least neck tension, size, anneal, load and shoot same day.

I hope this helps.
 
smokinghole said:


Wasn't that bad once I put my mind to it.
Click to expand...


Not bad at all! You will want to adjust that bottom plate up some so you can increase the depth of you salt bath. The more liquid, the more it will hold the temperature stable and not cool as easily when cold brass is dipped into it. Nice job there.
 
done111 said:
Not bad at all! You will want to adjust that bottom plate up some so you can increase the depth of you salt bath. The more liquid, the more it will hold the temperature stable and not cool as easily when cold brass is dipped into it. Nice job there.
Click to expand...

Thanks. I got the pot fired up and melted some salt but before I could find a old power supply to run my thermometer I had let the salt cool back down. I want to get it back up to temp tonight and get the level situated as well as adjust my plates needed. I have enough stainless to make 2-3 different holders. I want more bits and need better drill bits to do 2-3 more.
 
Texas10 said:
There are three conditions that effect neck tension, besides die size.
1 Work hardening the brass (sizing)
2 Annealing ( or more properly stress relieving)
3 aging

Anytime the brass hardness is artificially altered, either through working or annealing, the brass will continue to harden gradually with the passage of time (aging).

Many competition shooters will load and shoot, same day, within hours if possible. Not just to load for conditions of the day, or time/temp of the day, but also to reduce the effects of changing necks tension due to aging. This is particularly true for shooting long distance where slight changes in neck tension can result in large changes in group size.

Someone here posted a while back regarding effects of aging. IIRC is went something like this.

For the greatest neck tension, anneal, size, load, let sit 3 days and shoot.
For least neck tension, size, anneal, load and shoot same day.

I hope this helps.
Click to expand...

It's impossible for cartridge brass to age harden.
 
Alright I raised it up and added more salt. I am about 3/4" from the top of the melter with my salt level. It was fast and easy, put a phone metronome on and timed the first few for six seconds. I was going off the original post that I read about this from 6.5creedmoor. I upped mine to 7 seconds as there's just more brass on my SAUM cases. I got good looking annealed cases it seems. The anneal soaked just past the shoulder and the body stayed fine with the case head cool to the touch (I did it bare handed after a few). So easy and controllable.

So what kind of time do you keep a .50BMG case in there? I bet that thing soaks up some heat as you go. I did about 150 cases my first fo around. Some are .300SAUM destined for neck down to 7mm.
 
I don't have any experience with larger cases, I am doing the 6.5 Creedmoor for 5.5 to 6 seconds at around 530-540C. I got the level of salt about half way up the shoulder of the brass. Are you seeing any large drop in temperature when the brass goes in? There is a video on you tube showing a 50 BMG being done. Appears to be about 6 seconds of dip time being used with only a single piece of brass.

 
 
smokinghole said:
Alright I raised it up and added more salt. I am about 3/4" from the top of the melter with my salt level. It was fast and easy, put a phone metronome on and timed the first few for six seconds. I was going off the original post that I read about this from 6.5creedmoor. I upped mine to 7 seconds as there's just more brass on my SAUM cases. I got good looking annealed cases it seems. The anneal soaked just past the shoulder and the body stayed fine with the case head cool to the touch (I did it bare handed after a few). So easy and controllable.

So what kind of time do you keep a .50BMG case in there? I bet that thing soaks up some heat as you go. I did about 150 cases my first fo around. Some are .300SAUM destined for neck down to 7mm.
Click to expand...

I run my salt bath at 550C and have found 8 seconds to be the proper time for my 50 BMG cases. My necks are all turned to a .020" thickness to assure adequate clearance in my .554 throat. On my next annealing session, I will also try using a infrared thermometer to see if I can get an actual temp reading of the brass right after it's removed from the salt bath.
 
Joe R said:
Hi Guys,
A few weeks ago I bought the whole setup to do salt bath annealing. It works well for my 7SAUM and 308 brass. The only problem for me is the startup and take down time. It is just not conducive to the way/place I work. So if anyone is interested in buying the whole setup please drop me a PM. I've only used it once and I will be putting up for sale in the classified section a little later.

Joe
Click to expand...

Joe, check your PM. I sent you a message. I have a buddy that may be interested.

Thanks,
 
MN50Shooter said:
I run my salt bath at 550C and have found 8 seconds to be the proper time for my 50 BMG cases. My necks are all turned to a .020" thickness to assure adequate clearance in my .554 throat. On my next annealing session, I will also try using a infrared thermometer to see if I can get an actual temp reading of the brass right after it's removed from the salt bath.
Click to expand...

Which salt are you running at 550C? I ask because the stuff I bought claims a working temp up to 1000°F. That's about 530C and I'm not super familiar with what happens to the salt as it gets hotter than the advertised range. I'm strong in chemistry but not studied up on heating salt compounds.
 
The salt mix I received is suppose to stay below 590 or it starts to give off fumes I think.....read that somewhere.
 
I seem to remember that too, but I've had mine up to 1100F with no noticeable problems. I searched for info about high temp salt and possible health issues, but found nothing. FWIW, 550C is 1022F and 590C is 1094F.

If you watch the video above, he starts with the pot temp at 552C and it drops to 539C after annealing 10 cases. That's about what I see doing 338LM cases.
 
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smokinghole said:
Which salt are you running at 550C? I ask because the stuff I bought claims a working temp up to 1000°F. That's about 530C and I'm not super familiar with what happens to the salt as it gets hotter than the advertised range. I'm strong in chemistry but not studied up on heating salt compounds.
Click to expand...

The salt I purchased from Ballistic Recreations is a Potassium Nitrate/Sodium Nitrite Blend (it doesn't specify the ratio). It's melting point is 142°C. The warning is to not go above 590°C (1090°F). It begins to Oxidize above the 590°C and can give off harmful vapors. It is Specified as a Class 5.1 Oxidizer (above 590°C).
 
I have the same stuff but it came in a plain plastic bag from a different vendor. It just listed a range on the website but didn't give an upper. Maybe I'll go to a higher temp on mine and I could probably drop down a second in dip time.
 
smokinghole,

that looks really good, I was going to fabricate my own as well but I could not find a 90 degree thermocouple as available from ballistic creations. So I went ahead and ordered the holder from him and waiting for him to return from his Christmas holiday vacation to ship.

Where/what thermocouple are you using?

I did not order the digital thermometer from him though. I am building a PID controller for my pot after having read many posts and reviews about inconsistent Lee pot temperature controllers. Consequently no reason for the digital thermometer, since the PID includes that function.
 
MN50Shooter said:
The salt I purchased from Ballistic Recreations is a Potassium Nitrate/Sodium Nitrite Blend (it doesn't specify the ratio). It's melting point is 142°C. The warning is to not go above 590°C (1090°F). It begins to Oxidize above the 590°C and can give off harmful vapors. It is Specified as a Class 5.1 Oxidizer (above 590°C).
Click to expand...

found the following information here: http://www.targetshooter.co.uk/?p=2882

Quote from the article:

The salt
Gary from Ballistic Recreations was extremely helpful but he cannot ship the salts (to the UK). However he told me the chemical compound of the salts that he used and also the percentage make-up for the solution.

• Potassium Nitrate 50%
• Sodium Nitrate 45%
• Sodium Nitrite 5%

This information should help with finding other source options.
 
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I've lead dipped like this for ~30yrs, easy enough. But this includes dipping cases in MOBIL1 prior to lead (to keep lead from sticking to cases). The lead dipping was done outdoors, never used a case holder.
The salt medium here appears way easier, as done on the bench, with no prior preps.
Good video
 
oley55 said:
smokinghole,

I did not order the digital thermometer from him though. I am building a PID controller for my pot after having read many posts and reviews about inconsistent Lee pot temperature controllers. Consequently no reason for the digital thermometer, since the PID includes that function.
Click to expand...

I would be interested in seeing the components you use and the results. I am a total dummy all things electronic, but if it looks easy enough, I might try it and see if I can avoid burning my garage down.
 
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