Come on fellas

[divingin]

I suspect you may be right to a great extent and I get what you are saying, but didn't most folks that reload get into it to make better ammunition and improve their shooting?

I actually got into it to save money over buying factory ammo. I suspect that's true for a majority of shooters, as it allows you to shoot more for a given budget (well, sort of... cost of loading equipment and all that.) The accuracy thing came later, as my shooting improved. YMMV.

 

[spife7980]

I actually got into it to save money over buying factory ammo. I suspect that's true for a majority of shooters, as it allows you to shoot more for a given budget (well, sort of... cost of loading equipment and all that.) The accuracy thing came later, as my shooting improved. YMMV.

This was me too, an old lee loader a rubber mallet and an rcbs 5-10 beam borrowed from my father. I thought I was really cooking with gas too lol

 

[Someoldguy]

I actually got into it to save money over buying factory ammo. I suspect that's true for a majority of shooters, as it allows you to shoot more for a given budget (well, sort of... cost of loading equipment and all that.) The accuracy thing came later, as my shooting improved. YMMV.

That's what got me started. I bought a S&W 44 mag, but at over $1/shot, it made practice expensive. A friend showed me how to cast bullets and reload for it, and it's just progressed from that humble beginning.

 

[BoydAllen]

My first CF rifle was a 788 Remington chambered in .308. I loaded with a Lee Loader using the scoop that came with it, and a plastic headed mallet that I still had. Later I picked up a brass beam undamped Redding scale. That is the rifle that I first bedded, worked on the trigger, refinished the stock, and fitted with a recoil pad....a very long time ago.

 

[jamesdmock]

My first CF rifle was a 788 Remington chambered in .308. I loaded with a Lee Loader using the scoop that came with it, and a plastic headed mallet that I still had. Later I picked up a brass beam undamped Redding scale. That is the rifle that I first bedded, worked on the trigger, refinished the stock, and fitted with a recoil pad....a very long time ago.

Boyd, your experiences somewhat mirror mine. My first CF rifle was a 94 Winchester 30/30, but I did not load for it. A friend of mine's father-in-law owned an automobile repair shop and he was an advanced hobbyist gunsmith. He had a lathe and mill and had the know how to use them. After seeing the Mauser that he built and gave to my friend, I asked if he would build one for me. He stated that he had one in the works that he had just barreled in .30/06. He also had a stock for it that he had not finished. The rifle was '98 large ring Mauser and I forget whose stock and barrel was used. I went to work on the stock and got it fitted to the rifle and finished. I bought a Lee Loader and some 4350, Speer bullets and went to work. I was pleasantly surprised by the accuracy of my first effort and used it for deer hunting for several years. Soon after starting with the LEE Loader, I upgraded to a Lyman press and a Herter's powder thrower. That was almost 50 years ago, and my equipment has changed but maybe the enjoyment of seeking utmost accuracy has not. Good shooting..... James

 

[Brians356]

Question (that I know the answer to): What is the typical allowed variance in headspace for a rimless cartridge chamber from min to max according to SAAMI. In other words how much longer is maximum than minimum? My point is that this represents the possible range of factory rifle headspace measurements that you could find that would still be considered within SAAMI specifications.

I'll bite, just to advance the narrative. Look at 308 Win SAAMI drawing for an example. SAAMI values for length to shoulder datum are:

Edit: 20 October 2017: "hogpatrol" pointed out Max Chamber datum length 1.640 is denoted on the SAAMI drawing (I had previously calculated it by adding the "unless otherwise noted" length tolerance of 0.015). All related figures have been corrected.

Maximum Chamber: "1.640 MAX" = 1.640
Minimum Cartridge*: "1.634 - 0.007" = 1.627

So max permissible worst-case headspace = Max Chamber minus Min Cartridge = 1.640 - 1.627 = 0.013

Maximum Cartridge: "1.634" = 1.634
Minimum Chamber: "1.630 MIN" = 1.630

So minimum headspace = Min Chamber minus Max Cartridge = 1.630 - 1.634 = -0.004

Note: That's a crush fit, or negative headspace.

So the allowed variance in headspace is 0.013 - -0.004 = 0.017


[* This is not denoted as such on the drawing, but must be calculated as shown.]

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[rkittine]

I have all Whidden dies, so do I need to buy a set of Wilson Case Gauges?

Bob

 

[Barlow]

I taught a buddy of mine to handload 20 plus years ago. Just the basic stuff. A couple years ago I asked him how much clearance (headspace) his loads had. He didn't know as he had no tools (or inclination) to measure it. So he brought some fired and resized cases down for me to measure. He uses RCBS dies and a Rockchucker press and always cams over per instructions. He had .002-.003 bump. Rifle is a Mark X Mauser 30-06. I agree with Boyd on the issue, but in this case it's right on the money. Incidentally, he killed his 30th Bull last year, with his pet 165gr Nosler pt load. No guides on public land. Barlow

 

[rkittine]

I went to Wilson site and looks like the Adjustable Case Gauge is for belted magnums, but the regular ones are preset?

 

[jimmymac]

I actually got into it to save money over buying factory ammo. I suspect that's true for a majority of shooters, as it allows you to shoot more for a given budget (well, sort of... cost of loading equipment and all that.) The accuracy thing came later, as my shooting improved. YMMV.

Interesting. I may be the odd guy out then since saving money was not what got me motivated. Truth be told though, us reloaders spend more on ammo than anybody, but we sure do shoot a lot and we shoot better stuff to boot.

 

[hoz53]

Interesting. I may be the odd guy out then since saving money was not what got me motivated. Truth be told though, us reloaders spend more on ammo than anybody, but we sure do shoot a lot and we shoot better stuff to boot.

I got into it to save money. The guy at the reloading shop talked me out of a lee loader and into an rcbs press and dies. Im glad he did. Anyway I did save money at first and back then loaded 45ACP for 4 to 5 cents each buying the cast bullets. I didnt even have a caliper or mics for quite awhile when i started.
Eventully I got to the point where it was about making better quality loads and not saving money. I agree with Boyd-- Simply stated I sure wish there were some better instructions with the dies or available from the company when i started.

 

[Brians356]

I'll bite, just to advance the narrative. Look at 308 Win SAAMI drawing for an example. SAAMI values for length to shoulder datum are:

Maximum Chamber*: "1.630 MIN" + 0.015** = 1.645
Minimum Cartridge*: "1.634 - 0.007" = 1.627

So max permissible worst-case headspace = Max Chamber minus Min Cartridge = 1.645 - 1.627 = 0.018.

That's eighteen thousandths, boys and girls.

Maximum Cartridge: "1.634" = 1.634
Minimum Chamber: "1.630 MIN" = 1.630

So minimum headspace = Min Chamber minus Max Cartridge = 1.630 - 1.634 = -0.004

Note: That's a crush fit, or negative headspace.

So the allowed variance in headspace is 0.018 - -0.004 = 0.022


[* These are not denoted as such on the drawing, but must be calculated as shown.]
[** "Unless Otherwise Noted ... Length Tol +.015"]
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Could someone check my work?
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[hogpatrol]

Could someone check my work?
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On the SAAMI pdf file, page 110, for the .308 I see chamber headspace specs at 1.640 maximum and 1.630 minimum

 

[Brians356]

On the SAAMI pdf file, page 110, for the .308 I see chamber headspace specs at 1.640 maximum and 1.630 minimum

You're correct. I used 1.630 + 0.015 (length tolerance unless otherwise noted) but the figure "1.640 ... MAX" is noted, so I will edit my post to correct that. Thanks!
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