New reloaded problems

[spife7980]

I assume I'll start all over with the ones I previously loaded. I have the puller that looks like a hammer from rcms. Will the bullets be reusable?
And do I just toss the brass since they have an unfired primer in them or is it OK to punch out an unfired primer?
I understand it's not 100% accurate measuring the AOL with a dial caliper alone but that's how I've been doing it so far. I thought the bullet comparator would increase the accuracy with this but it only measures from the oclave. Is there a better more reliable method of measuring the AOL?
Another important question I had was since I try to measure everything i thought I would actually weigh the individual bullets once they were loaded as I've never been 100% confident with the Hornady powder dispenser but only a handfull of bullets actually came out weighing exactly the same. Shouldn't they be exact if the trim was exact, the bullets are the same grain and the powder was exact?
Is there a better way to measure powder that's quick yet reliable?

As mentioned you can pull them that way with the inertia hammer if its what you have and to shove a little tissue or foam in the bottom to avoid dinging them up. Probably wouldnt but an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. A collet bullet puller that mounts in your press may be worth the investment if you have a bunch of them to do. Slamming the hammer could agrivate your elbow if you loaded up a whole mess of them already.

Your overall length can vary a little bit depending on how uniform your meplats or tips are. Thats why measuring off the ogive is preferred. Typically the body of the bullet will be more uniform bullet to bullet than the tips. Measuring to the ogive isnt an exact measurement to the lands just like the headspace gauges arent. If you are shooting an ar or something then you will b restricted to magazine length for a maximum length and thats really he main time that OverAll Length matters. If you dont have mag resitrictions then you can find your lands like in this video. Your ogive measurements arent absolute, they are relative to the equipment you are using at the time. A hornady and a berger bullet will give different measurements when loaded into the lands and it depends on the shape of the bullet being more tangent or secant.

The bullets will weight a bit different from each other. But they should be pretty close. Im not sure I would worry about sorting them yet since youre just getting started. Once you have rounds that chamber and you know function in your rifle then you could start refining your load. Powder charge etc will be a much more vital aspect to nail down before you worry about sorting bullets.

Actually I see now that you say the loaded bullets weight different. Thats probably due in majority to the brass. If you weight the brass you could sort them into batches of .01-.02 or so but again, its not something I would worry about intil you learn to reload them. Weight sorting is more of a refining the load thing and not so much a developing of the load thing.

I like my chargemaster but it is far from laboratory accurate. Make sure that your hornady scale is level and that its not plugged into a circuit with fluorescent lights if you can help it. A power filter or universal power supply will help clear up some of the power fluctuations in your circuit if you really want to get into it. Just use the check weights often and let your scale warm up for a decent period of time, half hour maybe, so that it gets in its equilibrium. These electronics can be boogers at time but its better than beam and little powder scoops if youre doing enough of it.

 

[Bigdaddydean]

Oh definitely a wealth of info here!
Thank you so much gentlemen.
I had heard the RCBS chargemaster was a better machine vs. the Hornady but if that overthrows as well then I may think twice. Yes. I have the small digital scale that came with the Hornady press. However, it too can be difficult to measure with as it too isn't accurate too often even when weighing the same load. For instance. I take about every other load from the Hornady powder dispenser and place it on the digital scale for reference and it could be off as much as .2 of a grain. Most of the time it's accurate but it definitely makes me worry.
With that being said how important is it if The load is off by as much as .2 grains? The reason I ask is the Hornady will still give me the "green light" when my target grain is 24.2 (not even the heaviest load for the 68 grain bullet) and the scale says 24.3? How much "wiggle room" would be considered reasonable? I would think in terms of consistency you'd want each load exactly the same correct?

 

[Bigdaddydean]

OK.
So I just grabbed a few brass from my cleaned bag.
I zero'D my headspace comparator and came up with this:
(2) were the same at 1.460
(1) at 1.458
(1) at 1.456
(1) at 1.457
So now I want to bump the shoulder down .003 to .004?
I'm assuming my die was set up wrong to begin with since the previous loads wouldn't seat. So after reading this, to set up the die correctly to start I would seat the die to where it just touches the shell holder AFTER it cams over?
If so. Then back it off a 1/4 turn and start from there?
Also, I may have left something out previously when I was describing my setup. While reading and watching videos it says to lube the cases slightly. And not to get much of any into the neck.
I use the one shot case lube over the case pad. Roll them around a bit and put them into the press. Every time I press a shell out there is definitely some resistance. Not a huge amount but certainly seems more than what it appears to be like in the videos. Could this be an issue? How much lube should I be using? Everywhere I read it says a lot goes along way. I feel like I'm using a lot but like I said. It definitely feels like there's a lot of dragging or resistance while pressing.

I'd really like to thank everyone again for they're input as everyone here has pretty much saved me a lot of further worry!
So with that said....thank you very much!

 

[Bigdaddydean]

I guess I forgot to ask while I was rambling...if my die setup is correct. How to I adjust it to get the .003-.004 down on the shoulder? Do I just take it out of the 1/4" turn i backed it off of originally when it first touches the shell plate?

And to get this .003-.004 should I be taking it from the longest shell measurement or the shortest of the five I checked?

 

[Lapua40X]

... Never move to the next operation until you check your sized cases in the rifle chamber.
For a newbie to skip this gets you to where you are right now. So go back and try some fired brass and some sized cases and figure out how to size them so they fit your rifle....

Gets my vote for best single recommendation. You can't build a house on a faulty foundation.

 

[spife7980]

You might be alright if you over charge the occasional one by a tenth or two but thats why people do load testing. To see where their pressure signs appear and then back off a bit. If you are at 24.2 but 24.3 shows signs then back off so that a hot day wont push you over the edge. If 24.4 shows no pressure then you shouldnt have a big issue with it.

I just take a gallon zip loc and spray a few seconds of oneshot lube in, seal it and then jostle them about to get them all coated nicely enough. Anymore is a waste of time IMO. Let it dry so that its not a liquid.

When you are measuring them turn each one a bit, you should see them settling down to a more common number with a spread of not more than .001 or so. I bet if you turn the 1.460s you could get it to where they actually read 1.458 at some point on it.

I would set it up to where the sized brass comes out at 1.456 and see if they chamber nicely or if you can feel the shoulders crushing as you cam down on them. If you can feel resistence then take it .001 more until it just gets easy.

As for where your sizing die will be in relation to the shell holder or backed out Im not sure. I dont have any of those components but I would follow what the press and dies say to do and go from there. On my coax I set it up to where I have a full cam over so that i know Im going to the same spot on each case. I cant say whether your hornady press operates the same way or not. Might take a little bit of trial and error. If 1/4 turn off doesnt size the shoulder enough then tighten it down. If its too much then turn it out.

 

[GNERGY]

Put your ram all the way up and tighten down your sizing die till it touches the shell holder, AND leave it there, DO not loosen it 1/4 turn and size some brass and see if it chambers in your rifle. First.
Tarey

 

[jsudduth]

http://www.lewilson.com/casegage.html

You should get one of these in your cartridge of choice. Sizing too much can be a problem as well. The tool has a cut out across the base. If you are below the lowest level you have sized too much. If you are above the highest, you haven't sized enough. Drop a sized case in the tool and it will tell you if you are sizing properly and if you need to trim it. You control how much sizing you do by loosening the lock nut on the die and turning it up or down in small increments.
JS

 

[Bigdaddydean]

So I guess I'm still a bit confused on an issue with the sizing. Of the five previously fired cases I pulled out of the bag. Again. These are already cleaned and when I say previously fired I'm saying they were purchased, fired, then Cleaned. None of these were previously hand loaded. Of the five cases I grabbed. Only 2 had the same measurement, yet they all seemed to drop right in when I pulled the charging handle back and locked it, all the cases slid right in. So with that being said, how should I determine which direction to size them?
2 were at 1.460
1 was 1.458
1 was 1.457
And the 5th was at 1.456 all while spinning them to find the most accurate measurement.
is it safe to assume that the higher # meant more headspace? If so, is this my starting point for setting back the .003-.004? If so, what are the chances I have another case somewhere in the 2000 i have yet to check with a larger #?
Or am I over thinking it?

 

[Langey]

1st post

I trimmed the cases to the 1.75 deburred, chamfered, loaded primers, charge and then bullet. My C.O.L. Is exactly 2.25.
I feel like I really took my time on this but when I loaded 5-6 rounds in a mag and tried to chamber a round it wouldn't chamber all the way. Was about 1/4" or so from chambering and wouldn't eject the round.

Last post

None of these were previously hand loaded. Of the five cases I grabbed. Only 2 had the same measurement, yet they all seemed to drop right in when I pulled the charging handle back and locked it, all the cases slid right in.

Does anyone have an idea what is happening? Is his original loaded COAL too long?

 

[M-61]

1st post


Last post


Does anyone have an idea what is happening? Is his original loaded COAL too long?

I read it as ALL went in the magazine. Therefore the COAL was fine......that's post#1
Post #29 shows .004 difference in base to a datum line established by whatever tool he is using prior to being hand loaded but after being fired.
What measurement is he getting after is reloads them? Something is happening during the reloading obviously. Is the shoulder being bulged during bullet seating? I don't see how the measurement from base to datum can INCREASE during sizing.
I also am confused.
To the OP: First get this resolved before being concerned about scale accuracy. (my suggestion)

 

[jsudduth]

So I guess I'm still a bit confused on an issue with the sizing. Of the five previously fired cases I pulled out of the bag. Again. These are already cleaned and when I say previously fired I'm saying they were purchased, fired, then Cleaned. None of these were previously hand loaded. Of the five cases I grabbed. Only 2 had the same measurement, yet they all seemed to drop right in when I pulled the charging handle back and locked it, all the cases slid right in. So with that being said, how should I determine which direction to size them?
2 were at 1.460
1 was 1.458
1 was 1.457
And the 5th was at 1.456 all while spinning them to find the most accurate measurement.
is it safe to assume that the higher # meant more headspace? If so, is this my starting point for setting back the .003-.004? If so, what are the chances I have another case somewhere in the 2000 i have yet to check with a larger #?
Or am I over thinking it?

It is not uncommon to have that much variance in fired brass from a semi-auto. The bolt is moving backwards while there is still a bit of gas pressure in the case.

Size them to SAAMI spec using a case gauge and the will safely function in any rifle built with a SAAMI spec chamber.

 

[Spike A]

Maybe I missed but has he tried to chamber one of his fired unsized cases, and an already sized case but not loaded ? I saw some suggesting but didn't really see he did ?

 

[carlsbad]

Keep it simple. To troubleshoot load one cartridge without powder, checking after each step to see if it chambers. --Jerry

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

I don't see how the measurement from base to datum can INCREASE during sizing.

If the body is squeezed but the shoulder isn't touched, which can happen when attempting to partially resize with a FL die, the base-to-datum dimension can increase.

 

[Hoosier]

Do you have a local gunshop that carries reloading supplies? If you do, go and buy a Lyman or Wilson case gauge. Mine for 223 is a Lyman, but either is good. The case gauge will show if the cartridge meets SAMMI specs.
Many experts recommend small base dies in order to reduce or eliminate the bulge toward the base of the cartridge. I have been reloading since 1966 and have never had a need for these dies. It is a good idea to lightly crimp 223 bullets that will be fired in AR15s. I have seen the bullets move in cases in the magazine. The crimp doesn't need to be heavy.

 

[M-61]

If the body is squeezed but the shoulder isn't touched, which can happen when attempting to partially resize with a FL die, the base-to-datum dimension can increase.

Yes, certainly when attempting to partially resize in a FL die. I should have eliminated that sentence completely but I did not.
Actually post #33 & #34 says what I should have.

 

[timeout]

I know a fair amount about reloading and there is so much here it is confusing. Where are you located? If you are somewhere near any of these guys it would behoove you to get together with one of them and walk step by step through the process.

 

[Webster]

Do you have a local gunshop that carries reloading supplies? If you do, go and buy a Lyman or Wilson case gauge. Mine for 223 is a Lyman, but either is good. The case gauge will show if the cartridge meets SAMMI specs.
Many experts recommend small base dies in order to reduce or eliminate the bulge toward the base of the cartridge. I have been reloading since 1966 and have never had a need for these dies. It is a good idea to lightly crimp 223 bullets that will be fired in AR15s. I have seen the bullets move in cases in the magazine. The crimp doesn't need to be heavy.

How do you crimp a bullet that does not have a crimping groove? Standard dies don't crimp. I would think that crimping with a crimping die on a bullet without crimping grooves would change the shape of the bullet and it should not increase the grip on the bullet. An unnecessary variable to trying to make accurate ammo. Neck tension is enough to hold the bullet. 99.999% of shooters don't crimp.

 

[MislMan]

Since your reloading for an AR15 you should ask for advice from an AR15 site/board as well. Do a search on "reloading for AR15 and you should find plenty. Lots of good comments and advice here but reloading for the AR Is and animal all to itself. You may in fact have a weapon/action related issue and not your loading at all.