Alabama F-Class Championship.......... a big flop.
- Thread starter Mozella
- Start date
Winds at 30mph?
Sounds like the issues that one of the ranges in either AU or NZ identified has cropped up here. That is that the shot out membranes allow the wind to move the membrane surfaces in relation to each other causing lost shots. I don't think CMP yet understands just how much maintenance is required to keep the system nominal.
Sounds like the issues that one of the ranges in either AU or NZ identified has cropped up here. That is that the shot out membranes allow the wind to move the membrane surfaces in relation to each other causing lost shots. I don't think CMP yet understands just how much maintenance is required to keep the system nominal.
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Shiraz
Site $$ Sponsor
I ordered the Kongsberg system about 8 years ago. Used it a handful times because I had issues with it initially, plus I rather enjoyed a human pulling my target and getting scores the way we get at matches. My Kongsberg system is on a specially built trailer that rolls out behind the normal up/down roller target and is wired with a custom winch setup to raise it in the air.
Once the factory heard that I had issues with the system, they wanted me to be happy and actually sent a technician from Norway to upgrade the system and make sure it was working. It works well, but I have only used it once in the last two years as I still prefer a human pulling my targets when I am practicing. My system remains basically in new condition!
Here's how I got over the "big black dot" issue. I drew a perfectly centered line centered horizontally and vertically on the frame as well as on the rubber membrane. I then took an F-Class paper face and drew lines the same way on it, only at the edges of the paper so the lines would not go through the whole target and be visible in the rings themselves. I aligned the F-Class target lines to the lines on the target and taped the paper target onto the rubber target. Now, I had an official F-Class target that I could actually aim at and one that was dead centered on the Kongsberg. Worked perfectly.
As far as metric and MOA and all that - very simple. Let the factory know and they will program whatever distance and measurement you want. Mine is a fixed distance and in MOA. I am certain that they would oblige and perhaps there would be no charge for it. It is only a few minutes of calculations and programming. Mine was the first F-Class request and I sent them all the sizes I needed. The guy that flew over to upgrade my target system came specifically for my issue and spent just a few hours at the range. The system I now have is the Kongsberg Portable Pelicase system. http://www.kongsberg-ts.no/en/index.php?pageID=77&openLevel=43
Basically a Pelican case that has the transmitter etc. at each end with a clear line of sight. The big range system may be a hard wired system where the wires are buried to the targets from the firing line.
Here's a picture of him testing after it was all set-up.
Once the factory heard that I had issues with the system, they wanted me to be happy and actually sent a technician from Norway to upgrade the system and make sure it was working. It works well, but I have only used it once in the last two years as I still prefer a human pulling my targets when I am practicing. My system remains basically in new condition!
Here's how I got over the "big black dot" issue. I drew a perfectly centered line centered horizontally and vertically on the frame as well as on the rubber membrane. I then took an F-Class paper face and drew lines the same way on it, only at the edges of the paper so the lines would not go through the whole target and be visible in the rings themselves. I aligned the F-Class target lines to the lines on the target and taped the paper target onto the rubber target. Now, I had an official F-Class target that I could actually aim at and one that was dead centered on the Kongsberg. Worked perfectly.
As far as metric and MOA and all that - very simple. Let the factory know and they will program whatever distance and measurement you want. Mine is a fixed distance and in MOA. I am certain that they would oblige and perhaps there would be no charge for it. It is only a few minutes of calculations and programming. Mine was the first F-Class request and I sent them all the sizes I needed. The guy that flew over to upgrade my target system came specifically for my issue and spent just a few hours at the range. The system I now have is the Kongsberg Portable Pelicase system. http://www.kongsberg-ts.no/en/index.php?pageID=77&openLevel=43
Basically a Pelican case that has the transmitter etc. at each end with a clear line of sight. The big range system may be a hard wired system where the wires are buried to the targets from the firing line.
Here's a picture of him testing after it was all set-up.
This side of the world, our rules mandate that we have a standard aiming mark for each range on our electronic targets scribed with the scoring rings. Most have removable corflute centres that go over the target face. There's no interference with the membrane's functionality with any manufacture used, just a need to develop a procedure that will align the aiming mark centre with the acoustic centre of the target machine - and of course an ongoing practice of evaluating target functionality & developing a suitable maintenance routine consequentially.
My local range (Brisbane) has 30 Hexta targets & the aiming marks are screen printed onto the corflute.
My local range (Brisbane) has 30 Hexta targets & the aiming marks are screen printed onto the corflute.
As soon as plans can be developed, I will post a notice on this forum. Ed
This will definitely force a change in the types of reticules used by F-class shooters. Many of us are aiming at the X in the center of the target, if it's clear enough to see it. I can invision scopes with coaxial circles in the reticule sometime in the future.
B Nettesheim
Gold $$ Contributor
I believe that the NRA rules say that f-class targets are to have f-class centers.
Yes, that is the current NRA rule (more or less) for NRA-sanctioned F-Class events. But a lot of events, even prominent events like the Sierra Cup are not NRA-sanctioned. It's a free market. NRA doesn't own a trademark on "F-Class." I appreciate the broad availability of F-Class tournaments that are not F-Class sanctioned.
Depending on where you live and how far you are willing to drive, you have a lot more tournament options if you are not religious about NRA sanctioning. For my buddies and I, having the electronic targets work properly is much more important than visible rings as a sighting crutch. Having more tourneys within a reasonable drive is also more important than the NRA blessing.
In fact, I think we'd list a lot of things as more important for F-Class tourneys than NRA approval: driving distance, scheduling, smooth operation, working bathrooms, F-TR and F-Open separated, recognition of women and juniors, availability in the slower months (Dec - Mar), a covered firing line, timely awards, reliable posting of results, and general friendliness.
The organizers of the Bama tourneys have done an excellent job, but the bad attitudes of the range staff themselves (eye rolling at suggestions of eTarget problems), and the eTarget problems are the big issue.
Hey, it's a free market. Most of the ranges in the southeast are still using paper targets with scoring rings, and will likely continue to for some time. They are friendly and welcoming if you are willing to make the drive. My buddies and I didn't really find the big black dot (no scoring rings) to be a significant disadvantage, and we don't expect to change scopes or reticles even if we end up shooting regularly at Talladega.
If they can work out the eTarget issues and bad CMP staff attitudes, Talladega will be a great venue for F-Class events and likely have as many participants as they want without providing visible scoring rings.
Jay Christopherson
Not An Admin
I can't imagine putting the time and effort in to attending a F-Class match that didn't feature scoring rings on the target... :-/
Maybe it doesn't bother some guys, but it's not for me.
Maybe it doesn't bother some guys, but it's not for me.
memilanuk
Gold $$ Contributor
In effect, they do if you want to shoot a National Record and have it recognized. Until some other entity supplants them for those purposes, records can only be set during NRA Registered events such as state or regional championships... which have to be sanctioned by the NRA and/or the state-level NRA representative organization i.e. state Rifle & Pistol Association. At which point you dang well better have legitimate F-class centers for people to shoot on, or attendance will likely be on the decline once the word gets out.
NRA High Power Rifle Rule 4.1 says, "Official Targets-In NRA sanctioned competition, only targets printed by NRA Licensed Manufacturers, bearing the Official Competition target seal, or military targets issued by the Armed Services, without modification except are printed by NRA licensed manufactures only, will be used." This rule is for both NRA Approved and Registered competition.
No way. F class is not going to change because some company can't or won't develop a viable target system. No only is the Kronisberg target display not suitable for shooting F-class matches, the reliability is not good enough either. Somebody will develop a target system that not only works but also displays the proper aiming picture for F-class, but at the moment it isn't Kronisberg. I suspect the Kronisberg system will go the way of 4 track cartridge stereo system. Interesting and good enough for a moment in time, but quickly made completely obsolete first by 8 track, then cartridge, then CD's. Circles belong on the target face, not on the reticle.
memilanuk
Gold $$ Contributor
...or you could just offset your aiming point to some other point on the target frame - or elsewhere. As long as the bullets go in the middle, doesn't really matter where you aim. I won a 1200yd match by aiming at a point on the number board (as I'd ran out of elevation in my scope).
Or better yet, find a venue that uses proper target faces for the discipline in question.
Most shooters capable of national records are well aware that national records can only be shot at NRA Registered matches. National Records cannot be shot at NRA Approved matches, club matches, or any other matches that are not NRA Registered (such as the Sierra Cup).
Of course, most shooters who get good enough to shoot national records shoot a lot of matches along the way that are NRA Approved matches, club matches, and/or other matches that are not NRA sanctioned. National records also cannot be shot in unrecognized categories like F-Bench and F-Un (unlimited) that are growing in popularity.
Every state will be different, but there seems to be plenty of demand for F-Class matches in Alabama that are not NRA sanctioned.
I don't believe that the NRA was putting any money into this match. The range belongs to CMP and a local club was acting as host.
Who bought the target system??? jim
The CMP. It's their range.
I think the person or persons who approved the deal, should be looking for new employment by now.. I'm sure somebody got greased to get something that doesn't work installed....... very sad...... jim
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