Federal Gold Medal Destroys National Match Upper ! (BOOM !)

[AR-15]

Like it or not I have been to many a HP match where the blown primer got down into the trigger group and disabled the rifle from firing .Now I believe that most of the time it is not over pressure but a condition of using old brass where the primer pockets have expanded too much. There was even a company that made a felt strip for Ar's to keep the primers from jamming things up.

John

Exactly.

 

[shoot4fun]

Upper has approx 2k rounds fired, w/o issue. No bore obstructions, 9 rdns hit target (scored 77 w/ one saved).

Bolt was stuck in battery.

But in your original post you say you had to beat the bolt into battery before separating the upper/lower. The lugs can be partially locked up and bolt still be out of battery. As Murphy's Law dictates, it may have been the missing primer that kept it from going completely into battery.

 

[Shynloco]

Did I miss something or did you or the Federal Rep say that was 21 yr old factory ammo? If so, how has that ammo been stored or kept all those years? Just curious. And if I were you, I'd start all over with a new rifle despite the cost. Sorry about your loss, but at least you weren't injured. Good luck!

Alex

 

[SG4247]

I would write the bolt manufacturer and thank them for building such a great product.

I am thinking not all production AR .223 bolts out there today, would have survived that in one piece.

SG4247

 

[wapiti25]

Slam fire?

 

[snert]

FWIW, I have 4000 once fired Federal GM 308, for which I was responsible for ordering, all fired in Rem 700 by my department. No "reloads" in that 4000 because it was used in training our team...every shot recorded. About 5% have indications of high pressure. Because it shot ok with no blanked primers and none of the team is interested in reloading, it was never noticed. I bought that brass. Now I am finding loose (as in falls out) primer pockets, with extruded brass into the ejector hole, as evidenced by a roundish raised shiny welt on the rim of the cases.

I am now sorting it using a go-no go primer instrument, and culling all that show marks. This ammo was delivered in different lots over 5 years and was stored in cool, dry armory. It got signed out, shot and the brass was policed.

Stuff happens.

 

[hpshooter]

"You have 1 blown primer and 1 pierced primer in the batch of empties in your picture. Those were 2 very good reasons to stop."

Very easy to do when shooting a bolt gun from the bench but the OP was shooting a rapid fire string. Not time to do anything but breath, establish your sight picture and squeeze. As pointed out, this is not the first AR Ka-boom with Federal Gold Medal.

Ken, glad you are safe and hope you get a positive handle on the root cause of the problem.

 

[Berger.Fan222]

Like it or not I have been to many a HP match where the blown primer got down into the trigger group and disabled the rifle from firing .Now I believe that most of the time it is not over pressure but a condition of using old brass where the primer pockets have expanded too much. There was even a company that made a felt strip for Ar's to keep the primers from jamming things up.

John

The army has done a lot of work studying why primers get pushed out from the case with new brass and normal operating pressures. This is the reason military primers are crimped. But even crimped primers in new brass get pushed out some times. The army has researched lots of different crimping approaches, yet it still happens.

 

[WyleWD]

Walk around after a service rifle shoot, you will see lots of brass w/ blown primers.

But does that make it an OK condition. Blown primers are not an Ok and safe condition and should be investigated as to why they happen immediately. You're lucky you or someone near you weren't injured (Seriously). JME. WD

 

[wapiti25]

I was at the range 2 or 3 yr's ago and he was firing Federal non lead factory ammo out of his Rem 700 270 W. The first three rounds showed high pressure, I mean HIGH! pressured and he returned the ammo to the gun shop where it was purchased. That brass showed so much pressure I would not attempt to reload it.

 

[rvn1968]

But does that make it an OK condition. Blown primers are not an Ok and safe condition and should be investigated as to why they happen immediately. You're lucky you or someone near you weren't injured (Seriously). JME. WD

You used forward assist to put the gun back in battery. A bolt can be 10degrees or more out of rotation,perhaps blocked by a piece of blown primer,and fire short of proper seating.I think Fat Boy is right,too much unknown to come to satisfactory resolution. IMHO,Tom. P.S.The Lord was on your side,all you lost was money.

 

[1lnbrdg]

You are reading it wrong. He had to get the bolt back into battery to be able to separate the upper from the lower. This was after the kaboom.

That's a lot different than forcing the bolt into battery to shoot.

 

[AR-15]

You are reading it wrong. He had to get the bolt back into battery to be able to separate the upper from the lower. This was after the kaboom.

That's a lot different than forcing the bolt into battery to shoot.

After the BOOM !, the bolt was in battery, the carrier was very very slightly to the rear, as such the upper could not be removed.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Yeah, using 21 year old ammo of any brand in any firearm isn't a very wise decision ..

 

[savagedasher]

After the BOOM !, the bolt was in battery, the carrier was very very slightly to the rear, as such the upper could not be removed.

Isn't this a comon problem? Larry

 

[jsn]

"It is clear only 2 case show problems and I don't know what one was fire first ,. Larry"

Most of the fired brass has extractor damage, some also has damage from the bolt face (ejector).

 

[savagedasher]

"It is clear only 2 case show problems and I don't know what one was fire first ,. Larry"

Most of the fired brass has extractor damage, some also has damage from the bolt face (ejector).

The gun can have a tight chamber with too short FB both will cause the problem . If I remember correctly the case on a 233 is larger then a 5.56 The head space is different also . Good luck Larry

 

[shoot4fun]

The gun can have a tight chamber with too short FB both will cause the problem . If I remember correctly the case on a 233 is larger then a 5.56 The head space is different also . Good luck Larry

HS is slightly longer on 5.56 NATO than on 223. Leade and freebore are different. Always remember it is safe to fire 223 in a 5.56 chamber but not 5.56 in a 223 chamber. There is a big difference in pressure of 5.56 over 223. The Wylde chamber is set up to allow either to be safely used.

 

[Berger.Fan222]

Yeah, using 21 year old ammo of any brand in any firearm isn't a very wise decision ..

Nonsense. Ammo that is high quality to begin with has a very long shelf life if stored under reasonable conditions.

Lots of folks have fired Korean and Vietnam era ammo by the case load without any problems.

The issues in the present case under discussion are more likely related to the specific ammo in combination with the firearm.

Federal's suggestion that the age of the ammo is an issue is most likely an attempt to reduce their apparent blameworthiness or liability.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Nonsense. Ammo that is high quality to begin with has a very long shelf life if stored under reasonable conditions.

Lots of folks have fired Korean and Vietnam era ammo by the case load without any problems.

The issues in the present case under discussion are more likely related to the specific ammo in combination with the firearm.

Federal's suggestion that the age of the ammo is an issue is most likely an attempt to reduce their apparent blameworthiness or liability.

Your guns, your decision. All it takes is one bad round. Still think it's a mistake.

I don't trust factory rifle ammo period. Not for consistent accuracy, reliability, or safety reasons. Thats why I hand load