I was wondering if anyone has experience with a load similar to this ? Rifle is a 1903 30-06, due to health reasons (shoulder surgery) I need to reduce the load a bunch . Any shot taken would be an open shot from a steady rest . I loaded up some test rounds working with Trail Boss and 150 grain Nosler BTs , 15 gns was very accurate at 100 and mv should be somewhere around 1200 fps ...I have no experience hunting with a .308 bullet going that slow so I would like to hear what others may have to offer. I was also thinking of reduced loads of H4895 but guessing recoil/velocity will end up at about the same place ? Thanks for any help.
White-tail load... Is a Nosler BT .308 bullet at 1200 fps "enough gun" at 100 yards...
- Thread starter dolek
- Start date
Think the concern for good bullet performance is in question. Bullets designed for hunting typically are designed to expand properly at designated velocities. Thinking impact velocities of 1600+ fps is the lower end normally. Find a bullet that does that at 1000+ fps and your in business. Otherwise hitting the vitals without expansion still kills. Have you considered pushing the bullets over 1600 fps and getting a good recoil pad ? Even a brake would help alot if you didn't mind ear protection while shooting while hunting.
What about Hornady FTX bullets designed for 30-30 lever actions. I have no personal experience with them but my assumption would be they would expand at lower velocities given their intended application?
Great info,thanks . I will be putting a better pad on the rifle and as it is the recoil from that load was fine. I know I can jazz it up some and still be able to manage the recoil . Seems that load is just too light . I just took a quick look at those Hornady FTXs ,they offer them in 135 gn...Maybe those with a reduced load of H4895 would be fast enough for them to perform as they should ?
Hornady shows a minimum impact velocity of 1750 fps for reliable expansion.
dellet
Gold $$ Contributor
12-1500 is a very narrow working range for hunting bullets.
Most .308 bullets will need 1800 fps to expand.
Most 30-30 bullets like the FTX will need 15-1600 fps. They make a Marlin and Winchester, the Winchester expands to a lower velocity.
Then you drop down into the bullets designed for Blackout, The problem there will be bullet length and twist rate if you want a heavy bullet. Most will need 1/8 or faster. And many come apart in flight above 12-1300 fps. That will eliminate a lot of the specialty sub-sonic bullets.
Maker Bullets, has a few designed for sub-sonic 308 and low velocity 1300-1500 fps in the blackout in the 150-180 grain weights. Those would be a good possibility. I did a lot of testing with those and would be confident in those velocities
Barnes has a couple designed to expand down to 1350 but they start getting pretty light 110-120 grains.
Speer has a 150 Gold Dot for Blackout that has double caliber expansion as low as I tested, 1600 fps. I would expect it to go lower.
Plenty of options, but I would decide If you want 180-200 grains around 1250 MV, or 120-150 grains around 15-1700. MV.
You might sit down with a recoil calculator and figure a 120/150 grain bullet around 1700 200 fps with a 20 grain powder charge.Compared to a 200 grain bullet at 1300 with a 10 grain charge.
Lot's of ways to make it work with a good bullet and MOA accuracy at 100 yards. Just needs a bit of thought.
Most .308 bullets will need 1800 fps to expand.
Most 30-30 bullets like the FTX will need 15-1600 fps. They make a Marlin and Winchester, the Winchester expands to a lower velocity.
Then you drop down into the bullets designed for Blackout, The problem there will be bullet length and twist rate if you want a heavy bullet. Most will need 1/8 or faster. And many come apart in flight above 12-1300 fps. That will eliminate a lot of the specialty sub-sonic bullets.
Maker Bullets, has a few designed for sub-sonic 308 and low velocity 1300-1500 fps in the blackout in the 150-180 grain weights. Those would be a good possibility. I did a lot of testing with those and would be confident in those velocities
Barnes has a couple designed to expand down to 1350 but they start getting pretty light 110-120 grains.
Speer has a 150 Gold Dot for Blackout that has double caliber expansion as low as I tested, 1600 fps. I would expect it to go lower.
Plenty of options, but I would decide If you want 180-200 grains around 1250 MV, or 120-150 grains around 15-1700. MV.
You might sit down with a recoil calculator and figure a 120/150 grain bullet around 1700 200 fps with a 20 grain powder charge.Compared to a 200 grain bullet at 1300 with a 10 grain charge.
Lot's of ways to make it work with a good bullet and MOA accuracy at 100 yards. Just needs a bit of thought.
STOMP442
Gold $$ Contributor
Use a varmint bullet or maybe something like the new Sierra Tipped Match King Something that will expand regardless of velocity. At that range and the accuracy, you are describing it should be pretty easy to put the bullet where it needs to go. At worst it will do the same thing a sharp stick and a string would. Poke a hole.
HTSmith
Silver $$ Contributor
I used to load these for my son in a 30/06 many years ago when he was about 10. He knocked over two mature does with it--one at about 75 yards and another at about 125. I used 30 grains of SR4759--data for 150 Gr. shown in pic. I was surprised at the accuracy and how well they killed. It kicked less than a 243 and had little muzzle blast. If I couldn't get single shot pistol bullets, I'd go to the 125 Gr. BT's and drive them a bit faster. Best to you,
I appreciate all the help,looks like many ways to achieve my goal...opened my eyes wider . I really need to research some of these bullets mentioned . My local shop had the Hornady FTX in 165 grain so I picked up a box along with another jug of H4895 . The bullets are for 30-30 velocities ,the 60 percent reduction formula brings me down to nearly equal charges of H4895 between the 30-30 and the 30-06 . I want a good clean kill,figure if the recoil of that load is too much I better rethink my plan .
I will experiment with this and order some of the other bullets in the meantime after some reading. I really want to explore this rifles potential with light loads .
I will experiment with this and order some of the other bullets in the meantime after some reading. I really want to explore this rifles potential with light loads .
dellet
Gold $$ Contributor
Hornady 160 FTX #30395
This testing was done in 10% gel with a 300 Blackout. Impact velocities are shown, the gel was 3" behind the chronograph, shot at 25 yards.
Notes say with a MV of 2100,
100 yards, 1900 fps, #1290 energy
200 yards, 1714 fps, #1040 energy
Below about 1650, bullet started to tumble instead of expand
One other thing as a side note is, loaded in a 30-30 book COL works fine, but as you can see, this thing looks like a round nose they stuck a tip on. Be aware of it jamming at a pretty short length.
This testing was done in 10% gel with a 300 Blackout. Impact velocities are shown, the gel was 3" behind the chronograph, shot at 25 yards.
Notes say with a MV of 2100,
100 yards, 1900 fps, #1290 energy
200 yards, 1714 fps, #1040 energy
Below about 1650, bullet started to tumble instead of expand
One other thing as a side note is, loaded in a 30-30 book COL works fine, but as you can see, this thing looks like a round nose they stuck a tip on. Be aware of it jamming at a pretty short length.
Get some hard cast gas check lead with FN. They work well at lower velocity and as handgun hunters have found a good FN hard cast does the trick. I use Montana's in my 32 Win Spcl. with very good results.
If you want a jacket drop to a 125 NBT and push them a little faster.
If you want a jacket drop to a 125 NBT and push them a little faster.
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Thanks for posting your experience,the visual helps a great deal . You are correct on the COL,here it is next to the Nosler BTs...both at touch.Hornady 160 FTX #30395
This testing was done in 10% gel with a 300 Blackout. Impact velocities are shown, the gel was 3" behind the chronograph, shot at 25 yards.
Notes say with a MV of 2100,
100 yards, 1900 fps, #1290 energy
200 yards, 1714 fps, #1040 energy
Below about 1650, bullet started to tumble instead of expand
One other thing as a side note is, loaded in a 30-30 book COL works fine, but as you can see, this thing looks like a round nose they stuck a tip on. Be aware of it jamming at a pretty short length.
rebel
Gold $$ Contributor
The 125 SST may be an option. A bit more fragile than the Nosler 125. I have killed successfully at 100 yards with a 2100 fps MV. The other bullet is the Sierra 125 FNHP, at 2100 fps MV it is a great 125 yard bullet, possibly 150 yard. Not the best BC in the world but hit's like a ton of bricks at the right range.
If i wanted to maximize my hitting power with the least recoil I'd go for a 6br. Negligible recoil running an 80-105 grain bullet around 2700+ fps
Depart123
You are on the right track with Trail Boss. You won't get down to that velocity safely with a regular rifle powder. You will have to use a pistol powder. I've done it with 150g 30-30 round nose bullets. I used 12g of Unique IIRC. It did the job at about 75 yards.
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